rat snake ident?

buzby · 10-11-12, 11:40 AM

I bought this lad from a local reptile store at the weekend. He'd been brought in to them in quite poor condition but is now looking well and very handleable.
He was given to them as a russian rat snake but they don't think he is. Any ideas as to what kind of rat snake he is?

Jlassiter · 10-13-12, 12:16 PM

can you share a full body shot, please?

It looks like a juvenile black rat snake but I'm not sure.

How long it is now?

buzby · 10-13-12, 12:50 PM

He's about 4 1/2" long. Is this pic any better?

Jlassiter · 10-13-12, 01:06 PM

I take it you meant 4.5' not inches....

But it still looks like a black rat but should've gotten darker at that size.......
I wonder if it is a Texas rat X Black Rat or Gray Rat X Black Rat.....

DEFINITELY Obsoleta of some sort.

buzby · 10-13-12, 01:14 PM

Ha ha, yes, i meant feet, not inches! Someone else thinks he may be a great plains or a great plains/grey hybrid.
It really doesn't matter to me what he is, i am just curious

Jlassiter · 10-13-12, 03:42 PM

I don't see any Emoryi influence unless that "someone else" is going by the brown coloration......

buzby · 10-13-12, 11:44 PM

I'm glad you said that, I'm not any kind of snake ident expert but have looked at a kazillion pictures of emorys since they said it and can't make him look like them no matter how I squint at the screen!

From looking at pics I wondered about grey x black. Not so sure about Texas, would he have such a nice temperament if he had Texas in him? Aren't they quite fiesty?

Jlassiter · 10-14-12, 01:18 AM

Yep....Texas Rats have a temper.....
I've seen thousands in the wild over the years and not many have been nice....LOL

What's weird is it has the exact coloration and pattern of a juvenile black rat but it looks like it did not go through any ontogenesis......Something else is in there that caused this in my opinion.
It may be gray rat, but if you've looked at juvenile Texas Ratsnakes they have that same look.......I'm kinda baffled and all I can conclude is that is an Obsoleta subspecies cross of some sort.....
neat animal btw....

rmfsnakes32 · 10-14-12, 01:23 AM

Do not know much about rat snakes but it is a cool looking snake none the less!

buzby · 10-14-12, 11:20 AM

thanks for all the help, Magwitch is a lovely snake, I've only had him for short while but I'm rather smitten with him

Snakeman8 · 10-14-12, 01:00 PM

It has grey in it, probably a grey x black.

tucker · 11-09-12, 05:06 PM

From the picture it looks like he's too heavy body to be a rat snake. At 4-5 ft my rat snakes are a lot slimmer than my 4 ft Corn. So Maybe a great plains, as they were once part of the "corn" snakes.

Snakeman8 · 12-31-12, 10:00 PM

work on your ident. thats a rat snake, what do you see that makes it not?
by the way theres no corn in it, ive seen a corn cross, looks nothing like it, corns are also a type of rat snake.

poison123 · 01-01-13, 12:24 PM

Looks like a Texas rat

Jason_Hood · 01-01-13, 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tucker

From the picture it looks like he's too heavy body to be a rat snake. At 4-5 ft my rat snakes are a lot slimmer than my 4 ft Corn. So Maybe a great plains, as they were once part of the "corn" snakes.

Ummm, rat snakes, as in Black Rats, get much larger and heavier than corns do so I don't get what you are saying here.

This looks to be a black rat with the possibility of other influences in it to account for the color but the black rat is wide ranging and has many different looks to it including the "greenish rat" in the coastal plains where the yellow/black rats occur and look totally different than in other areas. This could also be a corn rat cross that was back crossed to a rat again, F2 crosses/hybrids get funky and hard to ID. I have a pet shop neat me that has albino black rats/corns crosses as adults and no matter how many times I tell the guy he still labels them as just black rats and breeds them every year to sell. The babies are more obviously not pure when you see them.

Jason