The Savannah Monitor Diet thread..

infernalis · 08-08-12, 11:29 AM

I started this thread and moved the posts here so we can discuss and debate Savannah Monitor diet in Captivity and the wild.

BarelyBreathing · 08-08-12, 01:55 PM

As Wayne said, no more ground beef. Savannah monitors are primarily insectivores. Set up a roach colony, add a bunch of night crawlers to his 2 ft of substrate, give him crickets, snails, slugs, crayfish, organic shrimp, freshwater crabs and millipedes.

Also, never ever ever force handle a monitor. If his enclosure is set up correctly, he will never have to be taken out to bathe. Bathing a monitor is pretty much pointless.

How is he set up?

Gregg M · 08-08-12, 06:35 PM

You do not want to feed your savannah only inverts. It would not be a good diet for them especially when they reach adulthood. You NEED to add rodents to their diet. Half of their captive diet should consist of about 50% rodents 50% inverts.

Also, in general, most varanids will not eat millipedes. Many species can be dangerous to add as a food item When something tries to eat a millipede some species will release a poision in both gas and liquid form. That poison is cyanide. Some species may be fine to feed but how do you know what species it is? Better off not risking it.

BarelyBreathing · 08-08-12, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gregg M

You do not want to feed your savannah only inverts. It would not be a good diet for them especially when they reach adulthood. You NEED to add rodents to their diet. Half of their captive diet should consist of about 50% rodents 50% inverts.

Also, in general, most varanids will not eat millipedes. Many species can be dangerous to add as a food item When something tries to eat a millipede some species will release a poision in both gas and liquid form. That poison is cyanide. Some species may be fine to feed but how do you know what species it is? Better off not risking it.

Yeah, because clearly no wild savannah monitors ever make it to adulthood. :rollseyes:

Pirarucu · 08-08-12, 11:12 PM

Apparently, yes it does. Here's my take on it. Instead of each keeper posting their own philosophy, why don't we just say "In the wild they eat almost exclusively insects but some people say it's better to feed rodents too." and let the person make their own choice on which they believe is the healthier diet?

Here's my take on it: I would not feed them strictly bugs, but I would say it's perfectly possible to do so and keep up with their energy needs. They meet their energy needs in the wild living on a diet of bugs, and if I had to guess I'd say their energy needs are higher out there than they are in captivity... "They don't get as big in the wild eating bugs" is a bit of a silly argument to me. They don't get as big in the wild because it's harder to get food, not because of the type of food. Give them enough bugs and I'm positive they'll do fine.

Now, as I stated, I would not feed them only bugs, but I would not feed 50% rodents either. That seems excessive to me. Now if we were talking birds, I may well feed them more of them, since they are lower in fat. I very much like the idea of feeding quail or chicks..

Pirarucu · 08-08-12, 11:26 PM

As far as not feeding millipedes, wasn't there a theory about them rolling millipedes on the ground using their bottom jaw to encourage the millipedes to release their toxins? I'm not saying feed millipedes if you're not sure they won't hurt them, but I'm curious if anyone else has heard about them doing that. I saw a video of a Sav doing it to I think a hornworm, perhaps under the impression it was a millipede?

infernalis · 08-08-12, 11:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pirarucu

As far as not feeding millipedes, wasn't there a theory about them rolling millipedes on the ground using their bottom jaw to encourage the millipedes to release their toxins? I'm not saying feed millipedes if you're not sure they won't hurt them, but I'm curious if anyone else has heard about them doing that. I saw a video of a Sav doing it to I think a hornworm, perhaps under the impression it was a millipede?

Right, but it has been brought up that evolution has "shaped" Savannah Monitors to deal with African millipede toxins, however different species of millipede produce different toxin chemistry, and the Savannah Monitor is more than likely ill equipped to handle foreign toxins from species they normally do not consume.

With this question in mind, I will pass on offering millipedes.

Pirarucu · 08-08-12, 11:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by infernalis

Right, but it has been brought up that evolution has "shaped" Savannah Monitors to deal with African millipede toxins, however different species of millipede produce different toxin chemistry, and the Savannah Monitor is more than likely ill equipped to handle foreign toxins from species they normally do not consume.

With this question in mind, I will pass on offering millipedes.

Oh I agree, I would never offer millipedes that they may not be capable of dealing with, the only ones I would ever feed would be the ones they consume regularly in the wild. I was just curious if anyone else has observed or heard of that behavior.

Gregg M · 08-09-12, 06:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BarelyBreathing

Yeah, because clearly no wild savannah monitors ever make it to adulthood. :rollseyes:

We do not and can not offer the same diet they get in the wild. The insects are different. they eat land snails which we can not get. The amount the eat daily when time are good is more than we can offer. This is not the wilds of Africa, it is captivity. It is stupid to even bring up "the wild diet" when we are talking about a reptile that will be living in someones house. THEY NEED MICE IN THEIR DIET IN CAPTIVITY. Stop trying to get people over to your invert only crap. All you are doing is setting the new owner up for failure.

Jay · 08-09-12, 08:49 AM

Facts from where bb, cite your sources please.

varanus_mad · 08-09-12, 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gregg M

We do not and can not offer the same diet they get in the wild. The insects are different. they eat land snails which we can not get. The amount the eat daily when time are good is more than we can offer. This is not the wilds of Africa, it is captivity. It is stupid to even bring up "the wild diet" when we are talking about a reptile that will be living in someones house. THEY NEED MICE IN THEIR DIET IN CAPTIVITY. Stop trying to get people over to your invert only crap. All you are doing is setting the new owner up for failure.

Agreed.

Wild inverts in africa far exceed what we have available in both size and quantity availability.

BarelyBreathing · 08-09-12, 04:50 PM

So instead of trying to simulate it you go completely out in left field and offer food that is nothing like their natural diets?

StudentoReptile · 08-09-12, 05:24 PM

To each his own. Stop bickering over it. Sheesh.

Take it to the monitor discussion thread if you want to debate it til kingdom come.

Toronto1977 · 08-09-12, 05:25 PM

Yeah, I think the ignore option is in order here lol.

Gregg M · 08-09-12, 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BarelyBreathing

So instead of trying to simulate it you go completely out in left field and offer food that is nothing like their natural diets?

What? you mean like shrimp and crabs? Seriously. those items do not simulate anything they eat in the wild.

Again this is not the wild. In the wild, conditions are harsh, food can be scarce at certain parts of the year. We do not want to simulate any of that. We want to improve on those conditions in captivity. This includes offering a healthy, nutritious diet that may consist of more rodents. I can tell you with 100% certainty that they do not eat shrimp or crabs in the wild. That is for sure.

The fact is, savannahs have been foud to consume rodents and other mammals in the wild as well as insects, arachnids, land snails, and numerous other inverts.

You can not deny that even in the wild, rodents do in fact make of some % of their diet. I also believe that in areas over their range and even over the season, their diet will vary depending on what in available and abundant. Again, shrimp and crabs will not be on the menu.

You are NOT going completely out into left field by offering rodents as part of their diet. You are simply offering them what is available, healthy, and full of what they need in order to thrive in captivity. This includes a varied diet of inverts and rodents. Not one or the other.

I have raise many monitors from hatchling to adulthood on rodents and inverts. I am sure my result speak much louder than your assuptions.