Newbie Breeders!l in search of some assistance

Strutter769 · 10-09-11, 07:50 PM

Thanks to a visit to the NARBC show this weekend by a relative with resources ($$$$$), my wife and I will soon begin breeding BP's (because I didn't see hardly any at the show!), BRB's, possibly Suri's and maybe even a Dumeril's Boa or two. We have 0.1 Piebald, 1.1 50% het Toffee, 0.1 Dumeril's, and even 0.1 15-yr old BCI, I would like to breed once.

We plan to adding different morph BP's early on and as well as 1.0 stunning BRB.

Partners are medical professionals who are brushing up on their knowledge of genetics.

Can anyone point us in the direction we should start headingvtrom here?

Thanks!

**Aaron_S** · 10-09-11, 07:59 PM

You should first ensure you have your infrastructure in place first. I would start with racks for adults and then an incubator, followed by hatchling racks.

I would also just look at what you want to breed and go from there. I'm sure you're excited but still take your time and acquire animals of the utmost quality. Don't get a morph just for the sake of having it right away and for a lower price.

I would also make a plan on what you plan to breed. You've listed a few animals with all different types of care and breeding. From ball pythons to boas and at least three different variants.

Almost done here, so hang in. Breed what you want to keep and look at it. Not what will sell. Especially morph wise. You have to look at it all the time and clean all the crap so why look at something you don't really like?

Lastly, I would recommend at least an albino female ball python to your collection. You'll want to attempt to prove out that het toffee boy and that's the best and cheapest way! I hope you got paperwork for those two!

Strutter769 · 10-09-11, 08:38 PM

Remarkable, Aaron, thanks for that! When you say to prove the Toffees, are they that impressive? We had read recently they weren't too exciting. Thanks for the suggestion of the albino too. We'll be headed to the local semi-monthly show in a couple weeks, then back to the NARBC show in May. I've seen some incredible BRB Morphs I can't wait to try also. Saw a bright orange one with gold/yellow spots that was outta this world on YouTube!

Strutter769 · 10-22-11, 08:36 PM

Ok, hopefully picking up.an albino BP at the Scott Smith expo in a couple weeks. Also newly addicted to Pearl Rainbow Boa morphs now, also like the deep red lines that are out there.

I have another question, (maybe should be separate post?) Why would we get a het, as opposed to just a Hypo or Anery etc? Wouldn't it be worth the few extra bucks on the long run? I don't really understand the benefits of hets. Can someone give me the layman's answer for that? (-:

Snakefood · 10-22-11, 08:43 PM

easy, with hets it's gonna take 2 or more generations to get the "visual" or "homo" that you are looking for, but they are FAR cheaper when your looking at the high end morphs.

Visual (homo) bred to another visual will give you what your looking for 1st gneration, but costs WAY more.

So the choice is basically time or $$

**millertime89** · 10-22-11, 08:49 PM

het means the gene is recessive, you have to breed two hets, or a het and an animal displaying the gene to get ones that display the gene. So its entirely your call what you want to do. I'll give an example. Say you've got a het albino, and you want albinos, you buy the het albino for less than you would a regular albino, bot more than a normal. You go out and buy another het albino of the opposite sex, you breed them, and you get some albinos in the clutch, you've saved some money and now have babies that you want, as well as a proven het albino pair, and you sell off the normal appearing babies as normals (because you can't tell which are hets and which aren't, the best bet is to sell them all as normals to cover your butt). Its all about cost/benefit. If you want to produce hypos or aneries, buy one, and buy a het. All the offspring will either by the type you want, or a het carrying the gene and capable of producing more.

**millertime89** · 10-22-11, 08:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snakefood

easy, with hets it's gonna take 2 or more generations to get the "visual" or "homo" that you are looking for, but they are FAR cheaper when your looking at the high end morphs.

Visual (homo) bred to another visual will give you what your looking for 1st gneration, but costs WAY more.

So the choice is basically time or $$

I thought you get visuals on first clutch, if you want supers it'll take 2 generations.

Snakefood · 10-22-11, 08:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by millertime89

I thought you get visuals on first clutch, if you want supers it'll take 2 generations.

Yes, sorry, your right. I was mixing that one up with how many generations it is going to take me to make my own snow lines out of aneries and amels!!

**millertime89** · 10-22-11, 08:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snakefood

Yes, sorry, your right. I was mixing that one up with how many generations it is going to take me to make my own snow lines out of aneries and amels!!

ha ha, there ya go!

Strutter769 · 10-22-11, 09:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by millertime89

het means the gene is recessive, you have to breed two hets, or a het and an animal displaying the gene to get ones that display the gene. So its entirely your call what you want to do. I'll give an example. Say you've got a het albino, and you want albinos, you buy the het albino for less than you would a regular albino, bot more than a normal. You go out and buy another het albino of the opposite sex, you breed them, and you get some albinos in the clutch, you've saved some money and now have babies that you want, as well as a proven het albino pair, and you sell off the normal appearing babies as normals (because you can't tell which are hets and which aren't, the best bet is to sell them all as normals to cover your butt). Its all about cost/benefit. If you want to produce hypos or aneries, buy one, and buy a het. All the offspring will either by the type you want, or a het carrying the gene and capable of producing more.

Ok, lost me in just one place, I think. Hypos aren't THAT much more than Hets, at least not twice the price. Wouldn't two Hets be more expensive than one Hypo?

Strutter769 · 10-22-11, 09:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by millertime89

I thought you get visuals on first clutch, if you want supers it'll take 2 generations.

I get it. Thanks!

Strutter769 · 10-22-11, 09:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snakefood

easy, with hets it's gonna take 2 or more generations to get the "visual" or "homo" that you are looking for, but they are FAR cheaper when your looking at the high end morphs.

Visual (homo) bred to another visual will give you what your looking for 1st gneration, but costs WAY more.

So the choice is basically time or $$

Visual x Visual = Visual So, if I have a High Red and I cross with a Pearl, how much of my litter will be High Red Pearls? Is that knowable?

Snakefood · 10-22-11, 09:30 PM

Ok, I only know genetics from a corn snake perspective, but if it's the same:

High red x pearl will give Normals (het high red and pearl)

You raise and breed 2 together and that's where you'd come out with a percentage of visual (homo) High Red Pearls

**lady_bug87** · 10-22-11, 09:31 PM

If you are still talking BPs
Genetic Wizard 3.0 - World of Ball Pythons

Knock yourself out lol (I am the WORST with Genetics)

**millertime89** · 10-22-11, 09:32 PM

visual x visual will result in both visuals and non visuals, but those non visuals are hets, and when bred to a visual will produced visuals and hets, but when bred to another het will produced non-visuals (both hets and normals) and visuals
the double the price thing was just an examble, it varies from snake to snake.
You're talking BRBs right? I'm not sure what genes produce what in BRBs. But a Pearl x high red will be all het high red het pearl, with no visuals. breed the kids back to the parents and you'll get varrying amounts of pearls and high reds.
As far as numbers, you can predict.
A het pearl to a pearl will produce 50% pearls and 50% het pearls (roughly)