Cottonmouth Question....newbie

[michtx]

Hello!
My husband and I recently bought land along a creek in Central Texas. I was exploring the creek by kayak today and came across several snakes entwined in some brush close to the banks of the creek. They did not peruse me, and I left the area ASAP.

I returned with my husband by land and we viewed the clump of brush from higher up on the banks. He identified them as Cottonmouths (he is former ranger for Texas Parks and Wildlife)and informed me they were venomous, curious and sometimes agressive.

I acknowledge that I am in the intruder in their environment, however I would like to feel comfortable in kayaking the creek by carrying some method of defense should I be approached by an aggressive individual.

I am wondering if anyone is aware of any spray that I could use in defense if I was approached on the waterway and was unable to retreat to safety? Do you know if common Mace or Pepper Spray are any deterrents to this type of snake?

I thank you for your time and any information,
Mich

[Big_V]

Spraying the animal is the worst idea possible. If you come accross one just let it be. Its not going to chase after you. It is a affraid and will defend itself if you threaten it. The best thing to do when coming accross one is to stay away and in a few seconds it should move on its way. A cottonmouth is not to be feared but respected.

[michtx]

I will clarify further. I have NO INTENTION of disturbing an individual who is not approaching me. My question is strictly one of self defense. I have utmost respect for animals in their natural environment and absolutely will do no harm if I am not at risk personally. However, I know several local fishermen who have had Cottonmouths approach and make unprovoked attacks. They can be curious and aggressive. Luckily, the two I encountered yesterday were neither curious nor agressive. My FIRST action was to retreat, and I was not persued. However, IF I am approached and can not get away quickly enough, I would like to be able to defrend myself against being bit. Currently, I could only swat at an approaching snake with my paddle, but I would like to know if there is a more effective deterrent if and ONLY IF it becomes clear that the snake is persuing me.

[Removed_2815]

Originally posted by michtx
I know several local fishermen who have had Cottonmouths approach and make unprovoked attacks.

Yep, that sounds like a typical fishermen's farce... Ask them how big the largest fish they ever caught was, and then ask to see a photo.

Like Big_V indicated, it's not going to chase you down and envenomate you and to believe otherwise is ludicrous. Stay away from them, and they will stay away from you.

[Reticsrule]

i agree. you have no reason at all to be afraid of them. snakes are not the kind of animals that attack you.

[michtx]

One of the fishermen I mentioned is my husband, a former Cave Specialist with Texas Parks and Wildlife. He has handled many snakes over many years, primarily Rattlesnakes, in Texas Park Lands and Bureau of Land Management lands in New Mexico. He was in fact approached by two Cottonmouths, one of which, though unprovoked, struck at his inner tube white he was fly fishing..... Hardly a fish tale farce.

In addition to posting my question here, I also sought the advice of snake experts via the internet. I received a reply to the same question I posted here from a gentleman who runs the Brazos River Rattlesnake Ranch. This individual's credentials include providing snakes and know-how to the Film Industry, and consulting on National Geographic and Discovery Channel specials. In respect to the Cottonmouth, his website states: "This dangerous semi-aquatic snake is truly an aggressive reptile that will stand its ground or even approach an intruder."

Instead of resting on your dismissive replies, labeling the idea of an unprovoked approach or attack as "ludicrous", I urge you to educate yourselves on this particular species. I think it far wiser to be aware of the realities of a Cottonmouth's behavior, as opposed to being caught up in your obvious and perhaps dangerously naive defense of Cottonmouths.

Finally, as an FYI, the answer I received from the proprietor of the Rattlesnake Ranch responded that a pepper or mace spray would in fact act as a deterent in an approach by a curious or aggressive Cottonmouth.

Thank you for your responses.

[CamHanna]

I would hesitate to call anyone in this thread uneducated (RMBolton especially).

Snakes are generally inoffensive creatures; even the most aggressive and intelligent among them are more inclined to avoid confrontation than to initiate it. Cottonmouths should be no exception.

Though it's obvious by your posts that you are an intelligent person, I think that your notions of our ophidian neighbors have been drastically misguided by hearsay. Books are absolutely indispensable if you wish to better understand the snakes in your region, and the risks they may pose. You should know that there are several common snakes that can easily be mistaken for cottonmouths but that pose no threat at all. Additionally, I would wager that with a little reading you would find local snakes to be of some interest, which can only serve to increase your enjoyment of the Texan wilds and the creatures therein. A great book for Texan snakes is A Field Guide to Texas Snakes by Alan Tennant. I reckon that you could find it in a local library or order it on-line if you're so inclined.

Tennants musings on the threat posed by western cottonmouths
Despite the cottonmouth's formidable reputation, very few people are bitten by this reptile, and even fewer are seriously injured: only about 7 percent of Texas' snakebites involve cottonmouths, and throughout the United States the mortality rate is less than 1 person per year.

Tennant's notes on Western Cottonmouth behavior
The most widespread story about the cottonmouth concerns the water-skier purportedly killed by a flurry of bites after tumbling into a "nest" of these reptiles. For years various re-telling of this fictitious event have circulated in boating circles, and an even more absurd fantasy about a cowboy killed by western cottonmouths while crossing a river on horseback appeared in the television special Lonesome Dove.
All such episodes are untrue: no water-skier or river-fording horse-man has ever suffered multiple A. piscivorus (=cottonmouth) envenomation. These scary myths originate in people's observations of the large number of harmless water snakes that, during the late summer, become concentrated in drying creeks and stock tanks where they are mistaken for nests of cottonmouths.
Cottonmouths do not "nest," however, and packed groups would last no longer than it took the larger A. piscivorus to swallow their smaller relatives. Further, in the water cottonmouths quickly dive and flee even when approached stealthily-much less when confronted with the churning bow wave of a 1,000-pound mustang. On land, an occasional cottonmouth will hold it's ground and gape open-mouthed, but none attack en masse. (In fact, the cottonmouth's notorious gape is actually a comparatively passive defense gesture, for such wide-jawed A. piscivorus often fail to strike even when prodded with a boot.)

Tennant on Florida Cottonmouth behavior
Although big cottonmouths can be pugnacious when annoyed, A. piscivorus is not nearly as ferocious as popularly envisioned. Can cottonmouths bite under water? Of course, that's how they catch fish. Apparently it's only fish though, mostly captured in the shallows. In deep water cottonmouths swim away if annoyed; they do not remain in place, as they do on land, to gape in threat. (Generated by the force of it's own strike, water resistance against a swimming cottonmouth's wide-spread mouth would press it backwards, making a long, aggressive underwater strike impossible.)

While I think that these little snippits address the issue at hand nicely the entire book is really worth checking out. Snakes are actually quite interesting creatures.

Cam

[michtx]

Thank you Cam, but I already have the book - my husband had it in his reference collection when we married. I agree, it is an interesting and informative text. Before I made my initial post, I had already consulted it and read the excepts you posted. As avid wilderness backpackers, wilderness kayakers, experienced cavers and scuba divers, we are aware and respectful of snakes and all creatures in their environment. I experience a more enjoyable wildlife experience if I am aware of risks and have strategies in place to avoid those risks and handle potential crisis.

I do not intend to categorize anyone here as uneducated, I meant to convey that the responses concerning Cottonmouths was perhaps less than fully informed. Again, I agree that most any creature will prefer to avoid an encouter. And as my experience on Sunday demonstrated, Cottonmouths will likely chose to ignore an intruder's presence. However, they can be territorial, curious and occasionally aggressive. My primary concern was to have a strategy in place to handle a chance encounter with a Cottonmouth who is responding as a predator, particualrly if I am kayaking alone and a long way from assistance.

[CamHanna]

My primary concern was to have a strategy in place to handle a chance encounter with a Cottonmouth who is responding as a predator, particualrly if I am kayaking alone and a long way from assistance.

A cottonmouth is going to try to eat you? That is rather improbable. I am not aware of any envenomation by any species in the wild that that was not in response to some offensive action by the victim (whether intentional or not). If the snake does not see you as a treat then it has no reason to bite you, certainly such a simple beast would not harm you purely out of spite.

If you were to somehow offend a cottonmouth then you would likely have little difficulty slinking away before you were injured. If not then I am sure a solid whack with a paddle would be a solid deterrent. I must stress of course that one should not paddle about beating unsuspecting snakes and also that there are a number of snakes that could be mistaken for Agkistrodon piscivorus but are completely harmless.

For instance, below are links to six snake pictures; three are cottonmouths, three are not. Can you tell them apart?

Snake 1
Snake 2 (atypical)
Snake 3
Snake 4
Snake 5
Snake 6

The field guide should help you but do you think you would not the difference when surprised out in the wilderness?

Cam

[snakehunter]

Cam brought up a very good point, memorize the pics in the book all you want, but mother nature is always renovating and trying new things out, not all cottonmouths will look like the ones in the book. FOR INSTANCE

I am an avid field herper to say the least, and on a camping trip I found some northern water snakes (N. Sipideon) and these looked like a different species all together, I was able to ID them by scale counts and stuff, but the point stands, not everything will be cut and dry in the woods, nature is not fair.

On another note I would seriously reconsider carrying mace for snakes, use your paddle to GENTLY slide the snake ina different direction, these guys will most likely become aggressive if cornered, so just keep your distance or just gently try to convince him ona different direction. You will find that they are very quik to get out of others ways. I am very appreciative that you are so understanding about the environment, most I talk to have the mind set that they are the ones at the top, and that what they say goes.................maybe thats why Im a Bio major....haha mother nature always has a way to let you know your place heh heh
-Jacob

[Removed_2815]

I think it's your desire to intrude on their territory and spray caustic chemicals in their eyes that is eliciting "dismissive replies." If you're in an area where you can't get away from the hoards of snakes, then my advice is to find somewhere else to play.

Some species of snakes are territorial (we're talking considerably small territories here - they're not defending the river, mainly just the immediate area). Some species are naturally curious and aggressive - Nerodia sipedon sp. comes to mind. Though, I have yet to see a Watersnake or Cottonmouth leave the security of the water's edge to investigate my canoe. The only instance of curiosity that I have witnessed was a snake that was already in the water as I was approaching. It swam the very short distance to my canoe and proceeded to casually investigate. I would hesitate to say that this snake was being territorial, rather, I believe it was merely investigating a possible area of "land" to explore. After a few minutes of good photo-shooting time, the snake was on its way.
Now, it wouldn't have been difficult to separate myself from the snake had I been so inclined. Paddling away or using your paddle to push the snake away are two simple, effective, and humane methods to remove the snake.

These snakes have absolutely no desire to approach and envenomate you. Again, to believe otherwise is ludicrous. Producing venom is metabolically costly and the snake is not going to waste it on something it cannot consume unless it's the snake's last resort (i.e. you are the one pursuing the snake and it feels it must defend itself).

Mace and pepper spray would have little, if any, effect anyway. Snakes have primitive nervous systems and they wouldn't respond like a human or bear would. I believe it's moot anyway as snake's don't have eyes like mammals, they are covered by a modified transparent scale.

You can happily paddle your kayak without fear of reprisal by the snakes. Now, there's an inherent risk by being in the vicinity of venomous reptiles, and I don't think anyone is saying otherwise - but you are the one who controls this risk. These snakes will leave you alone if you extend to them the same courtesy, it's as simple as that. Snakes are not innately "programmed" to seek out large mammals and envenomate them. Take a moment to think about the selection process. How can a behaviour that would ultimately end with the snake being killed by the large mammal be selected for?

R

[Removed_2815]

I wanted to add that I also respect your desire to share the environment and I can certainly appreciate your fear. I applaud your desire to educate yourself on this species, though anecdotal evidence is hardly worth citing.
Show me some peer reviewed publication that shows Cottonmouths to have a significant propensity to actively swim out and attack kayakers and I will offer you my most humblest apology.
Kind regards.

[K1LOS]

Well, I certainly have trouble believing that a cottonmouth went out of its way to attack a person.

Even if it was your husband that told you that fish story, there is something missing there. Either he unknowingly did something, or was bothering it. Snakes of that size would have no interest in 'attacking' people. The only time you need to worry about them attacking you, is if they are actually big enough to eat you. You won't find any of those in texas! Even then, it would be an ambush, not a chase after you type thing.

Like RMBolton pointed out, it is very taxing on the snake to produce venom, it needs that venom to hunt for food (you are obviously far too large to be eaten).

As for citing somebody who offers know-how to the film industry, and appearing on television, that really doesn't mean that much. How many times have you seen a chameleon change its colour to some rediculous background for camoflauge on television? They just can't do it, but that doesn't make for good tv...

Pepper spray? personally, i think you are more likely to agitate the snake then anything else. I would definately not attempt this myself.

I have heard of using alcohol to get snakes to let go of you when they have latched on to you (maybe somebody else can elaborate on this). Perhaps a spray bottle of vodka might be a better deterent, but thats just speculation, and something that would want to be tested before it is needed in the field.


Step wisely when you are stopping for lunch or whatever, think about your steps and look around. Just be cautious and you won't have any problems. You saw it the first time and didn't have any trouble right?

What are you worried about when you are in the kayak?shoo it away with the paddle and you'll be fine. You could probably out paddle it anyways. I can out paddle snakes in my canoe...

just like anything else, it just wants to carry out its usual day. don't bug it, and it won't bug you.

Geoff

[Piers]

I think much of the cottonmouth aggressive rep comes from the fact that they open their mouths to show their "cotton white mouth". People take this as aggression instead as a warning.
Just my 2 cents worth.
Piers

[ChurleR]

I don't know if this has been stated or not, However, most accounts of cottonmouths chasing people are due to the person being between the cottonmouth and their homestretch of water. Cottonmouths are odd snakes, they have a VERY limited home range and year after year are often found in the same spot, moving a max of about 10 meters in most population studies.

They have a home body of water, and if you're between them and it, they will try to get to it. They're slow on land (top spped about 4 mph max, I don't think you'd have any trouble outrunning that), and they feel much more comfortable in an environment where mobility is on their side. So simply put, if you find one on land and it's moving towards you, get out of the way and see if it heads towards water.

If it's on the land, just powerwalk away, no harm done.