Egg Nests Poached

[Swampwalker]

I saw the following post in the Turtle Forums and thought that this is something that needs to been seen by all herpers, not just turtle people. We all see and hear whats going on in the herp community and hopefully someone will be able to help out with information.

Originally posted by S Gillingwater
In late July/early August, multiple Spiny Softshell Turtle nests were stolen from a research site along the Thames River. If you have any information about this incident or on the sale of this species in Canada please contact me at the below number and email or contact the Aylmer District Ministry of Natural Resources office at (519)773-4700.
If you prefer to remain anonymous, contact Crime Stoppers at:
1-800-222-TIPS.

Authorities are still investigating this situation, but we are now going public to find the people involved and to highlight poaching issues in Ontario. This is a situation that can not be tolerated, as it comprimises both the species in the wild, and the research data being collected.

Thank you,
Scott D. Gillingwater
Chair, Spiny Softshell Turtle Recovery Team
Species at Risk Biologist
Upper Thames River Conservation Authority
(519) 451-2800 ext. 236
gillingwaters@thamesriver.on.ca

[Cruciform]

Yeah, I saw that earlier today. That's right in my area. I'll be keeping an eye out on local bulletin boards and stuff. Maybe the thieves are stupid... most are

[CamHanna]

I didn't want to see this thread fall off the first page.

[marisa]

I don't know much about those species of turtle, or the research site,,,,but maybe it wasn't theives? Just some kids who found a turtle nest? I know when I was younger I flipped out with excitment over finding any sort of eggs.

Marisa

[Holy Mackerel]

Theives or not, this can't be a good thing. The life history of turtles puts them at such great risk, to the point that removing a single adult out of a small population can devestate that whole population.

This turtle being so isolated can't afford to have a reduced nest survival. Lets just hope that the ones that do hatch have some success in reaching maturity.

Scott, best of luck in the investigation!

Steve Jones

[dia]

Originally posted by marisa
I don't know much about those species of turtle, or the research site,,,,but maybe it wasn't theives? Just some kids who found a turtle nest? I know when I was younger I flipped out with excitment over finding any sort of eggs.

Marisa

Same here [going crazy when finding egg] but I don't think kids would loot -mutiple- sites.
Poor turtles, hope at least their being incubated and properly cared for.

[Cake]

"Being incubated and properly cared for"

This is not of any concern, whether or not they survive is not of importance. What is of importance is the fact that some dumbass took eggs out of the wild. Even if they do survive they will do nothing to help out the wild population which is declining due extremely low survivourship into adult populations.
But hey its all about having "cool" animals for the pet trade right, so lets all hope that they get find nice homes in aquariums, with good owners dont have the slightest idea about what conservation means.

[dia]

Cake, I'm not supporting the theift or the idea of the animals becoming pets. Not in the slightest.
But for the animals to [not only have been poached but] never hatch, hatch deformed from proper incubation [I don't know if this happens in turtles or not but...] or to live horrible lives in disgusting or subpar conditions would IMO be even worse.

Maybe I'm not looking at the bigger picture though.
I didn't mean for my comment upset you.

[Holy Mackerel]

Dia,

Reading the posts I beleive that the problem is that this shouldn't have ever happen in the first place. It is hard to even start thinking of the turtles out in captivity because conservation of our wildlife is everything.

It is unfortunate that the general public is poorly educated on conservation topics. Hopefully this will all change in the near future, becuase the future as we know it looks dim.

[Removed_2815]

This still belongs on the first page. Keep your eyes peeled everyone and let Scott, or myself, know if you have any tips you can offer.
Thanks for your help,
Ryan

[Holy Mackerel]

Ryan or Scott,

If the eggs were properly incubated, when would you be expecting the turtles to hatch or when would they have hatched?

It may be useful for people to know. If the sale of them were to occur, that would be the time to keep your eyes open.


Steve

[Removed_2815]

Steve,
Very good point. The Softshell eggs should have hatched by now had they have been left on the river. The turtles have been hatching since 9/16/04 at the site where my research is conducted.
Here is a photo of a baby for everyone's reference:


Thanks everyone,
Ryan

[Cake]

Awe, arent they so cute when they are jsut a bit bigger than a loonie.

Steve you know im on the same page as you on this one.

Dia, i didn't mean to attack you, it just seems to me that most people look at our herpetofauna, and think "wow that would be cool to have as a pet". The general public is not educated on the threats that long lived species encounter due to thier life history traits (delayed sexual maturity, low juvenile survivourship, etc). Nest survivourship is around 0-3% for unprotected nests. the work being done by Ryan, naturalists, Masters and Phd students, is giving these turtles a chance at being around after the aging adult population has died or been poached.

I challenge you to go out and look and find a juvenile/sub adult spiny softshell turtle, if your extremely lucky you might find an adult. Ask yourself after the fruitless search.....Once the adults die, where are the replacements to the breeding population coming from? the answer is from the nests that have been protected from predation. Oh wait, even thoose arent evem safe anymore.

I agree that this should be kept on the first page, so lets keep it there, with educated posts.

Ryan, good luck with your research and I hope this never happens again.

[Removed_2815]

This topic came up at a Turtle Advisory Group meeting yesterday and there has still been no word as to who might be responsible for this.
Again, I thank you all in advance for keeping a watch out for baby Spiny Softshell Turtles being offered for sale and I urge you to contact any of Scott's numbers listed above.
Best regards,
Ryan

[CamHanna]

Would spiny softshells really be worth poaching? Petstores could get in as many Florida and other ssps of spiny as they want but no one really wants to buy them. It's a small market and there would certainly be no point in raiding multiple nests when one would likely supply all of Ontario.