need help on advice..

[justinO]

So a guy on one of those tiny forum sites with limited people on it, asks about heating his ball python, UTH or lamps:

the responses were as follows:

Yes you need lighting that gives off heat, one for the night and one for the day. Do not leave the day light bulb on all day 24/7 the python will get stressed and wont eat.

and

BP's love and need to have a basking lamp.

and this doosey

Actually, undertank heaters ALWAYS require a rheostat or thermostat, as they may otherwise become to hot for the species you're keeping. Many UTHs get up to 110 F. Heat lamps, on the other hand, are less expensive, and you can alter the heat output by changing the wattage of the bulb. They heat the air better than a UTH, and are a more natural source of heat. It's best not to have a false sense of security with UTHs or heat tape.

and last

experienced keepers will reccomend lights as well. As well as any experienced vet!! Balls will bask in sunlight in their natural habitat and will do so with heat lamps as well.

I say that these people are on CRACK and need to give their ball pythons to someone who has actually read something on them.

What say you about the heating issue?

Jessy

By the way, i linked them to tim cranwills FAQ page on heating which I think explains very well why heat lamps are re-tarded.

[marisa]

Heat lamps work in certain situations, and I am in the group of people who believe heat is heat. If the area your python is sitting is at 92 degrees exactly then personally I do not see what differance it makes if that heat is coming from above or below.

BUT....as for heating lamps I personally don't use them for other reasons. For one, they cost more to run. Two, they are in my house more of a fire hazard than heat tape, three I cannot use a heat lamp on my rubbermaids or in a rack type setting, four bulbs constantly burn out which ends up costing me money. I have so many other reasons but those will do.

The list of benefits of heat tape/UTH is also a long one. In the end, belly heat/UTH/heat tape is the way for me.

Marisa

[thunder]

i use under cage heat for the same reasons that marisa gives, EXCEPT for my display animals, so that they can easily be seen.

[robitza]

I use a heat rock at the moment. It was my only option at the time. But I am going to switch to UTH.

Question, would a waterbed heating pad work? And if so, what temp should it be set at?

[Invictus]

Sorry Justin, but I agree with the statements from the "other" forum. UTH's do NOTHING to heat the air, only the surface. I have used both, and now use light bulbs exclusively in my custom cages, because they get BOTH the surface temps AND the air temps to where they need to be for any and all species that I keep.

I have a tank that I tested the theory of heat rising from a UTH. THAT is what is completely re-tarded. When the surface temp of the UTH was at 120, the air temp even an inch above was a meager 74. I haven't tested it with heat tape in a rubbermaid, but I suspect it's pretty much the same thing.

Underneath the light bulb in my custom cages, assuming the cage is in a room with comfortable room temperature, the air temp under the bulb is 90 with a surface temp of 92, and the cage is about 80-85 ambiently (depending on the temperature of the room.) Neither you nor Tim Cranwill nor ANYONE else can tell me that this wrong, or useless, or not the correct means of heating, or ANYTHING to that effect, because simply put, you're dead wrong if you disagree, because I have proven it to be an effective heating method. If it's good enough for some of the big breeders in the states, and good enough for ball pythons in the wild, it's good enough for my collection.

[wyz]

I use heat rope, lamps and heat mat. Depends what my setup is and how I can make it work for my animals.

Originally posted by justinO
I say that these people are on CRACK and need to give their ball pythons to someone who has actually read something on them.

Just my 2 cents on that but.....

Why are you looking at bashing people who use different types of heating systems. Have you tested them ALL in ALL setups possible and came up with real proofs that some are bad ?

I think there are worst things that need to be adressed in the herp society. Heat is heat, anything can work fine WITH the right setup.

WYZ

[Vengeance]

I use both, I like the UTH because I can get a better measure of controll over the basking points in my cage. I find that when I tried to creating basking points with lights the tempatures varied too much by the ambiant air temp in my house, I find it doesn't fluctuate nearly as much with an UTH, but I'm alos using a Glass tank which sucks *** for holding any kind of temps. Going to build cutoms enclourses and I have 3 more Ball pythons coming in the next month or so that I will be keeping in rubbermaids till the custom cage is done so I'll see how I do without lighting.

[marisa]

Actually using a UTH under a rubbermaid brings my air temps up to around 90 while the hot spot is 92-94. I have all my heat tape carefully controlled and monitered with a variety of probes though.

Works perfectly for me.

Invictus, chill out man! You are defending yourself before anyone even disagrees! :P If you believe it like you say you do so strongly (and I am sure it DOES work perfect for ya) then there is no need to "pre-defend" your thoughts. We have all had this discussion before and we all left it at you do it this way, I do it that way. Blah blah. :P

Marisa

[Invictus]

His initial post was already attacking anyone who used overhead heating. That is why I got defensive.

I say that these people are on CRACK and need to give their ball pythons to someone who has actually read something on them.

By the way, i linked them to tim cranwills FAQ page on heating which I think explains very well why heat lamps are re-tarded.

So by this I can devise that I'm either on crack or that I have a learning disability? How is that not an attack?

[hhw]

Well, for Sterilites, I find UTH is enough to warm the air as well.

The caveats to using lighting for heat are that they will reduce humidity and use more electricity. However, if you're able to provide enough humidity anyhow and don't mind spending a bit more on your power bill, there's no problem to using it at all.

[marisa]

Holy Moly! Nevermind. Can't even talk in this thread without people getting EXTREMELY aggetated. Attack or no, I did not say. I jokingly said calm down and joked about the issue constantly being brought up.

Holy crap. Can't even just talk these days.

Marisa

[CDN-Cresties]

I currently use heat tape and keep my BP in a rubbermaid. Works great so far.

[justinO]

Yeah I noticed. I too say chill, i'm sorry for the way I worded my post, I was just frustrated at some of the things coming from them. They even stated after that their vet who takes care of all the family pets (including the dogs) told them not to use UTH's and that lamps were the only thing to use for ALL reptiles. The next was a post that if you use the energy efficient bulbs that you can put them directly in the enclosure. Then, said that to mimic nature, only 12 hours of light/heat should be provided. I just couldn't stand it!

I have seen some scary pictures and real life scenes of ball pythons being fried to a crisp with lamps. I have seen pics of people putting the lights IN the cages and the ball wrapping around it and dying very quickly.

The people above also advised to put a 2 month old baby ball python into a 20-33 gallon tank and feed it live mice it's whole life. It took away alot of credit from them and I immediatly jumped on this heat issue too.

Oh, and i'm a she, Jessy..... Justin's the he

And dispite the freaking out, thanks for the replies so far!

[mykee]

Wow! ANother touchy subject, maybe this one should be filed along with Religion and Politics! Anyways, for MY rack/rubbermaid set-up I find that heat tape works best, and probably would for all racks systems. However, I do feel that an overhead light is mostly useless in that it dries out the air, and doesn't provide the heat in a captive environment that a ball can readily utilize, seeing that balls are in their hides 90% of the time, how would they benefit from an overhead heat source?

[smeagel]

i used to use an overhead lamp, and a glass aquarium for my female ball. now i use a rubbermaid, and a human heat pad, and she is 1000 times more comfortable, and eats like she should. she is now a piglet where before she would eat once every bout month and a half. now she eats once a week! she is gaining weight like crazy!