>_< mice eating their babies!

Zoe · 04-22-04, 09:12 AM

I have had a colony of mice for months now. I have not added any new mice and have only removed the surviving babies when they are well weaned. There are 5 or 6 females, a male, and a couple youngsters in there most of the time.
Yet the mothers still eat the babies!!! They have lots of food and water, toys, and I rarely enter the room other than the feed or clean, and even then i am hardly intrusive.

I'm at a loss now. They have no reason that I can see to keep eating their babies yet they do... Maybe 1 in 10 litters will survive? They will even eat babies that have a wee bit of hair (enough to show their pattern well enough), not just the newborns.

grr.

Zoë

Linds · 04-22-04, 09:18 AM

What are you feeding them? Sometimes diet can cause higher incidences of cannibalism in mice.

Auskan · 04-22-04, 10:13 AM

If the diet is too low in protein, the mothers may eat their babies to gain extra protein.

Also, what size enclosure are they in? If they are too crowded, that might cause cannibalism.

5-6 females to one male is a fairly high ratio. I have no experience with this many females per male, but I think the recommended is 3-4. I don't know if this is the cause of the problem or not, but it might not hurt to split the colonies. What I would probably do is to move 3 females to a separate cage, and have the male go back and forth between them. That way you can get by with only one male (less smell).

lanceinhispance · 04-22-04, 10:18 AM

ive also always wondered about that to because at local pet stored there are always moms and dads eating their babies.

Cruciform · 04-22-04, 10:27 AM

If they aren't getting enough protein, try getting a bag of rawhide chew sticks. (I'll post a pic of the brand I bought when I get home from work)

They were dirt cheap and the mice love them. Babies are healthy too

Auskan · 04-22-04, 10:35 AM

Cruciform - how much protein is in rawhide chew sticks? I wouldn't have thought there would be much, but I guess I've never looked.

Another option for additional protein is dog food. I have a puppy right now so I also have puppy food around the house, which is higher in protein than regular dog food. So I give them a little of that as well and they can choose which to eat. My mice also eat a trail mix type of food supplemented with bird seed for grains, and I haven't had any problems with cannibalism.

Zoe · 04-22-04, 02:58 PM

they eat dog food and rodent mix (corn, pellets, oats, bla bla) and reside in a 20 gal long.

marisa · 04-22-04, 03:03 PM

Some mice have been shown to eat babies no matter what. Even their daughters could be baby eaters, especially ones that learn from experience.

I would whack every single female and buy all new.

Marisa

Stockwell · 04-22-04, 03:25 PM

Marisa has a good point... If you're sure they are getting enough water and food, it's probably genetic....
Start over with some stock from a breeder that has non cannibal mice, like some swiss webster stock, or any good lab strain.
Cannibals will likely prouduce more cannibals.
PCPC usually has live mice and they are a good strain... why not buy some of those and start over.

BoidKeeper · 04-22-04, 04:44 PM

I've noticed that some females will do it to their first litter and after that they are usually good. No second chances though. Anyone eats their young twice gets wacked.
Cheers,
Trevor

Zoe · 04-24-04, 05:52 PM

hrm... guess I'll have to start over with a new colony. Bummer though, these guys were white with black spots.

Ah well. Good thing I have reserves in the freezer.

Thanks!
Zoe

mykee · 04-24-04, 09:10 PM

I gave up on mice for that exact reason. Sometimes there's just nothing you can do except replace the colony.

Pixie · 04-24-04, 11:29 PM

I stopped breeding mice myself after a year of valiant attempts to only end up with a huge problem with cannibalism.

I had at one point 6 colonies going with mice purchased from different shops to end up with most of my moms eating their young and then worse, adults would gang up on one of their colony cohabitants and eat them! Two of my colonies ended up eating their male studs, two others ate one of the females.

This happened with various diets from fancy rodent mixes to cheap dog food. All the time being supplemented with items such as cheese, hard boiled eggs, peanuts, etc. Anything that was high in protein and fat for the producing mothers.

I even omitted from doing that to see if it changed anything. Then replacing the breeder mice, changing cages to give more space... I always ended up with a carnage!

For all the time and money spent on that breeding project to maybe get a couple pinkies here and there. I gave it up completely.

I've had nothing but good experiences with rats and although I would still like to have a fresh supply of mice around, I'm not getting into that mess again! Others seem to have much better luck than I have, so I guess it can be done!

Pixie

Peter Ludwig · 04-25-04, 07:24 AM

Your problem may not be the mothers lack protein, but they lack calcium and vitamins. Just for the heck of it while they are nursing add to their water a a pinch of crushed up vitamin pill for dogs. A bottle of 100 can be bought at Wal Mart fo under $6.00, it is called "Hartz Health Measures Vitamins" I've just started to use this and I've found a marked improvement in the way the mother mice look, they appear much healthier. I really never had a problem of cannabalism.