New Cham and questions

Susan Marshall · 01-24-04, 12:58 PM

I got my little guy finally about a week ago and he is doing well but I do have a couple of questions i was hoping to get feedback on. The first question is how do you cup train a cham, mine doesn't go near it and he only gets the good worms if I am lucky enough to drop one on the leaf right in front of him. Otherwise they just fall to the floor and are wasted. I just spent 100.00 getting an order of Butterworms, waxworms and silkworms from Toronto and they are being wasted it's such a shame. I just want the best for him, He is so cute. He is too shy yet to hand feed. The 2nd question is I have misted his cage so many times and he never drinks?? Is this normal. Even when we put the dripper on for him he never goes near it. He does on the other hand have a good appetite. I have seen him eat 15 small crickets and 2 waxworms in 1 day and his body length from the tip of his nose not including his tail is about 3 to 3 1/2 inches long. I appreciate your input .

Cheers!
Susan

tHeGiNo · 01-24-04, 01:36 PM

I would say just make sure the feeding cup is placed low in the foliage of the enclosure, towards the bottom of the cage. They will best approach the feeding cup from an upward position down towards the prey. This will also help to ensure the chameleon doesn't hit the side of the cup while hunting, LOL. Try different things: show him inside the cup, place him above the cup, etc etc. Thats all I have to offer as I am not too experienced in this field. I am a believer in free range prey. Much more beneficial IMHO, and would recommend it.

As far as drinking, so long as you are spraying a good amount I am sure he is drinking. Often times, they will lick up the dew off the leaves when your not looking. It sometimes takes a while before they start drinking as the water drops on them. Just keep the dripper and keep misting and I am sure he will be fine.

dank7oo · 01-24-04, 01:42 PM

Hey Susan.
Great to see you here, and hopefully I can assist you with a few of your problems.

Cup feeding - As theGino said, the angle of the cup may be a problem. However, if you chameleon is under 6 months of age, he may not cup feed. I have cup fed two of my chameleons. The veiled started at 9 months and the panther at 7 months. I give them some in the cup, and also free roam some so they don't get a lazy tongue.

As for the spraying. What kind of chameleon is he? A veiled? If so, just watch for signs of dehydration, such as sunken in eyes or wrinckly skin. I wouldn't worry otherwize. Chameleons usually drink when you aren't looking, and compared to other species, I find that veiled do in fact drink less than the majority. My panther for example drinks almost everytime I spray him, whereas my veiled would drink once a week, but would drink a lot when he did.

Hope this helps and best of luck.

Jason

tHeGiNo · 01-24-04, 01:45 PM

Also what I have noticed with my Veileds is that they will not drink directly as I spray them unless I spray in their immediate direction for a minute or two. They eventually begin to drink as the water hits them. Again, I wouldn't be too worried about this because as I mentioned they often drink the dew right off the foliage when you aren't looking.

On a little side note, I read somewhere that Veileds take a while before they begin to drink as you spray them, rather then solely drinking the dew off leaves. This wasn't the case for mine, but you never know. I really don't think you have anything to worry about, but you could still watch for the signs of dehydration which dank suggested.

choriona · 01-24-04, 03:31 PM

Yeah, veileds are sneaky drinkers. Once in a blue moon do I see them drink. But I spray them every day to keep the humidity up - they breathe that moisture in. And I ahve also noticed that you must sometimes be spraying for a good 5 minutes before they become interested.

As for the feeding - when they are young, take advantage of the fact that they are liking crickets. Gut load them and dust 'em up real good for the growing period. I would try not to offer the other bugs until your cham gets bigger. Unless you are already past 6 months. Just an opinion.
Can I ask why you want to cup-train? If your enclosure allows, I would let the bugs free roam. As for the worms, you can get a ceramic dish that is wide and low (like a cat food plate thingy). If the sides are smooth and high enough, the worms can't get out, but the shape is not quite a bowl/cup deep dark scarry place to put your tounge. Try it out. If your cham gets used to the bugs being in one place, graduate to a deeper dish that will trap crickets that are too stupid to jump. This can simply be a larger diameter bowl like a dog food dish, or my favorite the zip-loc container bowl. This works better when the cham is bigger and in a bigger house. (ie bigger than the bowl)

Susan Marshall · 01-24-04, 04:19 PM

Thank you for your suggestions. He is a veiled and he definitely looks plump and not wrinkly at all. I have been gutloading the crickets with Minerall and fish food flakes fruit etc and have been dusting his crickets. He is scared of the Silkworms I think but loves the butterworms and waxworms. He won't even consider mealworms. I am not sure how old he is. Does anyone know what the average age of a 3 to 3 1/2 inch long body is? He is very active always on the move hunting for those crix. He has great colour nice and bright green.

vipervenom · 01-24-04, 04:44 PM

If he is fairly new then he is still adjusting to his cage and new home. Give it time. But he shouldn't have too many worms because they are very fatty. Also, he needs time to get used to the misting and the dripper. He will eventually drink. Mist him first thing in the morning to simulate morning dew. Get a non-toxic and not transparent dish and just put a couple crickets int here and leave for say 30 minutes and come back to see if they are gone. Usualyl they are too shy to eat inf ront of people that asre new to them. He will eventually eat from your hand, running in his cage and from a cup. Give him time.

Collide · 01-24-04, 05:17 PM

Hey Susan

some chams hate cut feeding they need that trill of the hunt thing. try putting the silks on the branches and let them move around they cant get far and it will give your guy some time to get used to them.. also i have noticed that although all chams love silks this dont come fast every cham i have given there first silk has spit them out. Took abit to get them to like them.

Now as for the butter worms if he is not eating them u can keep them in the frig and then they wont go to wast so you can keep them longer...

And although clear containers are good for you cham to see the food just watch for him tryine to hit food through the container.

He is still small to might be a bit shy. Oh and watch out for too much fish flake that is alot of proteen so i wouldent use it as a constant suplement it could cause problems later on if over used, but mineralll is great.

Gongrats on your new baby your gonna have to take some pic's hehe

Hope that helped

Oh and probably sround 4 months or soo

Brandy

meow_mix450 · 01-24-04, 05:44 PM

its normal f you dnt see them drink its rare, but if you had a panther you would be sure that you would see them drink hope everything works out

Meow

Collide · 01-24-04, 08:33 PM

Just another thought silks are very liquidy lots of hydration in them and they are very filling as well. so they might be filling him up.

vipervenom · 01-25-04, 10:37 AM

Meow mix, I disagree completly about it's rare to see a cham drink. It's actually not a very good sign if you don't see them drink. And clear containers are not to be used in cup feeding. If the cham hit the cup, he runs the risk of a toungue infection.

vipervenom · 01-25-04, 10:39 AM

Oh ya, and DO NOT use fish flake food. I have had all my crickets die from fish food. Use a variety of different coloured vegetables. There are also commercialyl available gutloads out there too.

gfisher2002 · 01-25-04, 11:27 AM

Meow Mix has a point. I see my Panther Drinking everyday. However, it is hard to catch some veiled cham at it. Alot are very shy and timid and WON't drink if you're standing there watching. If they are comfortable with your presence you should see them drinking but if they are not, it might be hard to catch them in the act. Not to say Veiled's drink less, just that they may be less likely to drink infront of you.

And a clear cup is risky cause if the cham tries to nail a cricket through the side, the tongue strikes the glass first and they may develop a strained or torn muscule in their tongue. Don't know how an infection fits into that?

And I agree, stay away from fish food. Just use commercial gutload, oranges, oats, sweet potatoes, etc.

meow_mix450 · 01-25-04, 11:32 AM

hmmm are oranges good to gut load, i heard that its no good for chams, but i feed tem oranges, as well...

Meow

tHeGiNo · 01-25-04, 11:40 AM

Vipervenom,

Quote:

Meow mix, I disagree completly about it's rare to see a cham drink. It's actually not a very good sign if you don't see them drink.

I'm sorry but do you have a clue what you are talking about? Do you own a Veiled chameleon yourself? It is absolutely 100% completely normal to not see a veiled chameleon drink. It in no shape, way or form a sign of unhealthiness, nor is it a 'bad sign'. I sometimes have to spray one of my Veileds for five minutes straight before I see him drink. Infact, often times, I empty a whole spray bottle, refill it, then spray some more before he starts drinking as it falls on him. Anyhow, once more, not seeing your VEILED CHAMELEON drink is not a bad thing. Panthers and Veileds are two different species of chameleon. As I mentioned earlier, veileds often consume water through licking the dew off leaves and the water content in prey items.

Quote:

If the cham hit the cup, he runs the risk of a toungue infection.

Using a clear cup causes a potential for injury, not infection. May you please explain where the infection comes in?

**EDIT** As I see mentioned already, the injury comes from smacking the cup while trying to hit a bug which they see through the cup.

Also, I don't think it was the fish flakes killing your crickets. Maybe a lack of hydration, but I am not sure about fish flakes. I used to use it as a gutlod prior to understanding its high protein levels (it is composed of a great deal of fish, afterall).

Moral: please refrain from putting false information into peoples minds. If your making assumptions and don't know what you are talking about, don't post.

Quote:

Alot are very shy and timid and WON't drink if you're standing there watching.

Although it is a possibility, I think it is more that they don't usually drink in that manner. They are more accustomed to licking dew off leaves. I figure, once it has 'rained' for long enough, they just decide to start drinking. Or something like that; regardless I have doubts that it has to do with being shy.