Paper bag method

lilyskip · 08-02-03, 08:23 PM

So I just stapled Huxley into a paper bag with airholes and a brained pinky rat and mouse, (f/t, of course), and I am just wondering if I should leave the bag on the hot side or the cool side overnight??

Does anyone else feel totally crappy when they do this, by the way? Cuz I'm looking at this bag that contains my snake and feel like the world's worst mother right now.

sapphire_moon · 08-02-03, 09:10 PM

Why are you putting him in a paper bag? Why don't you just try giving it to him first?? I would feel that way. I never tried it, I just left a mouse in overnight and threw it away in the morning. But I would probably leave half the bag over the uth and the other half on a cooler part.....Just my 2 cents. Good Luck!!

BurmBaroness · 08-02-03, 09:54 PM

I'm assuming you are trying to get Huxley to eat. I'm also assuming huxley is a baby. From your other posts, I am guessing you have only had this bp for a few weeks. First thing you need to do is get one of those prey items out of the bag. If you really feel the need to put him back in with the other prey item, then use a new bag, so it will contain no trace smell of the prey item you removed. Did you try to offer food first? Never offer 2 different prey items in the same feed, unless the snake is an established eater and you are just trying to switch prey items. If the snake has not eaten since you acquired him, then all handling needs to stop NOW. He is probably so stressed, he's not gonna eat, no matter what you offer. Make sure temps are correct, 82-83 cool side, 92 warm side. I would suggest putting him in the cage, and leaving him alone for at least a week. No handling, nothing, except cleaning and water changing. keep him in a quiet low traffic area. Then after a week, you can try offering a f/t, appropriately sized prey item, and make sure it is warm. BP's have heat pits, they like their food warm. If that doesn't work, you can e-mail me, as there are lots of things and little tricks to getting baby bp's to eat that are not as stressful as some methods. I have had some pretty odd baby bp's, but everyone has eaten at somepoint, usually when I hit the right trick that trips their trigger. Good Luck

Solid Snake · 08-02-03, 10:13 PM

easier way...

Get a 5 gallon tank with repti carpet, leave the rat on the floor. 5 gallon tanks only costs 10$

lilyskip · 08-02-03, 11:37 PM

Hey Burm--Hux has eaten before, he's just stopped recently. I offered the food already (heated up) and he didn't take it, and it seemed like this was a lot less stressful than assist feeding. The temps are fine...I figured he just either wasn't hungry or it was my technique. Is the paper bag thing a really bad idea?

Edit: ya'll freaked me out and I opened the bag, and he ate this little tiny pinky mouse, but left the pinky rat. I didn't handle him (nor have I been handling him at all this week), and I left the open bag and the pinky rat in the tank. He can crawl out of it if he wants to... The pinky mouse was MINISCULE, though, so I'll have to try with some more food in a few days, if he looks hungry.

Stockwell · 08-02-03, 11:41 PM

Baby Regius should be offered small live mice, in the dark, and only once they are settled in a tight hide. They need to feel secure first, then make sure the temp is up near 90F. Keep them in small quarters, like a 5 gallon tank, and restict the ventilation by putting something over most of the top, to get the scent level up..
Before trying feeding, Go a few days without disturbing the snake then drop a small live mouse in front of the opening to the hide, then dim the lights... Most will take food this way.
They need the movement, smell and heat to trigger all the strike criteria.
I've started a couple hundred that way..try it.

lilyskip · 08-02-03, 11:49 PM

thanks...he too was started by the reptile store on live pinky rats. he's never taken a pinky rat with me, but will eat f/t pinky mice (my guess is because they're smaller and less intimidating). I'm pretty reluctant to feed, live, though, mostly because it will be logistically impossible for me during the school year in college.

Do you have any recommendations for feeding f/t besides braining, chicken broth, etc.?

Stockwell · 08-03-03, 12:08 AM

Well all you can do is heat a small mouse up..not a pinky..Baby Regius will take small mice, with fur...put it in a zip lock and soak it in hot water for a while. Take it out of the bag and cut the mouses nose off with scissors, this gets more scent molecules airborne . Then offer it slowly and quietly on tongs, and wiggle it just in front of the snakes hide... It should be almost dark, no cage lights.
With luck...BANG! he'll grab it.
If there is no strike response try again later or just leave it close to the snake, but once they are cold, and not moving you have lost 2 vital strike triggers.
Once snakes put on some size they will take dead prey much easier, but live is always best for the first few months.
Best of luck!

remsin76 · 08-03-03, 01:59 AM

balls should never heat pinks the're too small they cant really smell them.

BurmBaroness · 08-03-03, 09:03 AM

I agree with stockwell, my only suggestion being use hoppers, preferrably with their eyes still closed, just as extra precaution. Never leave the snake alone with live prey, and if not eaten in 10 minutes, remove it. Sounds like everything is going OK, but remember, after a few feeds of live, they will usually go to p/k, then on to f/t no problem. Also, balls do go off feed for weeks, sometimes months, so when I have one that does that, usually a male at breeding time, I just offer once a week, and he eats when he's ready. No sense stressing him out trying to get him to eat when he's not going to eat till he's ready. I also agree, baby BP's can usually start off on hopper size mice, pinkies are too small, and make a light meal if they even take it.

lilyskip · 08-03-03, 10:01 AM

Yeah, I agree that the pinks are too small, and I am not really worried about him not eating, because I know that balls do that a lot. It's weird, though, because every time I offer something bigger than a pinky, he won't take it. He's definitely big enough to take something larger, but even if I brain it, he's not into it...

Stockwell (is Roy your first name? That would save me two syllables

) -- Hux is 3 months old, and fed on live before I bought him. When do you usually make the switch to f/t? He's already eaten two f/t meals out of four offered, but all he eats are pinky mice.

Stockwell · 08-03-03, 10:23 AM

Yeah it's Roy. You can make the switch once your snake is successfully taking live mice.
Regius do not eat pink mice in Togo, they are ambush feeders and take rodents, moving past them, usually at high speed. LOL
Don't underestimate the size of meals they can take.I always fed hatchling Regius small mice(not hoppers)right after their first shed.
They have to be at least big enough to be moving around. Larger prey targets also generate more heat and more scent, and are more likely to be taken.
If the snake seems scared of mice, it isn't secure enough yet in its hide, make sure it can squeeze in, and avoid holding the snake for a couple weeks.
If it's eaten before, you should be off to the races once the snake is settled in.

BoidKeeper · 08-03-03, 10:43 AM

But Roy, why mice? Why not rats? You can't raise a BP on mice, why not give them rats right away instead of trying to switch them later.
Thanks,
Trevor

Stockwell · 08-03-03, 11:01 AM

Yes, sure Trev but
I always fed mice to Regius, although I did go through lots of them,especially in the breeding season. Rats are fine, if you have a good supply of hopper rats than that would be equivalent to small mice. Once you start a food type though, it can be hard to switch. I always had a better supply of mice than rats. Also some baby Regius might be more interested in the smell of mice than rats..Id try both but still offer them live
Actually you young keepers are lucky.. I had to buy dozens of Gerbils during the pioneering days of the 1980's, as that was the only thing big old Togo wild caughts would eat. (there were no CB's or CH's before the late 80's)

Invictus · 08-03-03, 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by BoidKeeper
But Roy, why mice? Why not rats? You can't raise a BP on mice, why not give them rats right away instead of trying to switch them later.

I couldn't agree more. As I said in another thread, pinky mice are for Erycines and Colubrids. Heavy-bodied boids should be WEANED on adult mice, maybe switching to rats later, or, as BoidKeeper said, start them on live rat pinkies. (Here in Alberta, of course, live rats of any age are illegal, so it's adult mice as starters here).