Confused

drewlowe · 07-31-03, 05:36 PM

some of you know i lost one of my leos 3 weeks back to what i thought was roundworms. Now i don't know what to think of it. I have another sick leo on my hands, out of nowhere her weight completely droped, her tail has lost over half of what it was in 2 weeks. I took her to the vet today and their going to keep her overnight. Tomorrow the vet will be doing a full exam and running tests on her. On of the test will be a "crypto" test. Which if that test comes back positive for crypto i will have to put down my whole leopard gecko colony and possibly the rest of my collection. My question is, i know someone stated thier was a person that was able to help a leo with some medication. I would like to know what that medication was and what kind of results that person had. If anyone can help i would appricate it very much. And any other info or suggestions would help. i would like to be prepaired incase it comes back positive. I'm thinking of the worst and praying for the best.

thanks for listening.

Jamie

Neo · 07-31-03, 09:23 PM

i think alicewave said in an earlier thread that someone used the human treatment of crypto and it suppressed the crypto pretty well but didnt eliminate it

Alicewave · 08-01-03, 12:14 PM

Yup, let me know if it comes back positive for crypto and I'll put you in contact with the fellow who has the meds for it.

drewlowe · 08-02-03, 11:38 AM

yesturday i went to pick phoenix up and talked with the vet. It's down to 2 possibilities. It's either crypto or coccidia (sp). I never thought i would say this but i'm praying for it to be coccidia. If it's coccidia then it can be treated. But if it's cryto then i have 2 choices either put them all down or decide to keep them and be very careful that i don't catch crypto, and that i can never add a new herp to my collection and i have to stop all breeding. If i do decied to keep them once they all pass away i have to throw everything that came in contact with them away.( cages furnishings, and any tools or misc. items.)

This is completly devistating i cant belive it's happining to me. the vet and i went over all husbandry issues and he belives it possible could have come from me giving them tap water. I stopped giving them tap water around 8 months ago but he said "if" it was crypto it could take a long time for it to finally start showing.

He sent a sample away to the lab i should find out results wend. or thursday. And if these samples come back negative then he has suggested that i make a sacrifice in my collection. For the good of the rest of the collection. I'm so upset and confused, i don't know what to think of all this.

What would any of you do if you were put in this situation????

Siretsap · 08-02-03, 11:51 AM

The 2 best medications I know of for your leos is panacur and flagil. Treat them with flagil to start since it will do more good than panacur for what your leos have. This is a powerful medecine. It comes in capsules so you have to be careful. What you can do is crush one capsul into powder and dilute it in 1 litre of water. Give that water to all your geckos. I am doing it right now for mine. You repeat it everyday (the medication looses it's benefic actions after a day in water) so you have to crush a capsule again everyday and dilute it in 1 litre water and give that water to your reptiles. Do this for 10 days straight, wait 10 days, do it again for 10 days, repeat 2 to 3 times and go have a leo checked again after to see if it's gone or not.
Flagil can be bought at a vet or even prescribed to you by a doctor (they are the exact same thing). Just make sure the dozage of the doctor's is the same as the vet's.

KelliH · 08-02-03, 12:01 PM

Panacur and flagyl aren't going to do a bit of good for the gecko if the have coccidia or cryptosporidia. Drewlowe- ask your vet if any coccidia spores were found in the fecal float? If so then your geckos have coccidia, no question. However, even if your vet DID see coccidia spores in the fecal float they could still have crypto. My suggestion would be to have a full necropsy done, including histopathology, on the sickest of your animals. The vet is right, the sacrifuce of one will tell you a lot, like what exactly you are dealing with that is making your geckos sick. Feel free to email me privately with any questions kelli@hisss.net

Good Luck.

drewlowe · 08-02-03, 12:08 PM

sirestap they have been taking panacur 3 different times because 6 or 7 months ago they were diagnosed with "roundworms". panacur has done nothing for them. Thats why i went out and found a new vet again. This one came highly recommend from the herp society and several other people. He told me there was no way that it could be roundworms because it hasn't went away. that it had to be something with a direct life cycle. which he did a full exam on her and flushed her stomach to send to a lab. I won't give them any more meds until i find out what they have. They already been given so much panacur and baytril it's unbeliveble. I feel so bad and helpless right now. Theres nothing i can do for them but sit and wait. He also said at the rate that phoenix is losing weight she has probly only 3 or 4 more weeks till she passes away. and to think 2 weeks ago she was perfectly healthy (or so it seemed).

Please everyone be careful when giving tap water to your reptiles or this may happen to you. I don't want anyone to go through the stress that my animals and myself is going through.

Siretsap · 08-02-03, 12:12 PM

I only mentioned panacur, the medication I suggested was flagil.

KelliH · 08-02-03, 01:09 PM

Sirestap-

Flagyl would not be effective in treating coccidia. I believe vets are now prescribing albon for that particular parasite. Drewlove, let us know how things turn out!

eyespy · 08-02-03, 01:56 PM

Some of the vets on the "meds management" side of the clinic had fairly good luck using a combo of Albon, smz/tmp and azithromycin to reduce the levels of crypto to nearly undetectable amounts that allowed the animals to live symptom-free, but the animals affected are still considered to be livelong carriers and need strict quarantining. We've also had good luck with silver nitrate filtration of water to get rid of crypto spores. Brita pitchers use silver nitrate, and of course boiling the water can further minimize the risk of crypto.

You may not need to put down your collection of animals even if your worst fears are confirmed, but you'd have to make sure your animals never came in contact with others for the rest of their lives. I've seen hundreds of animals make full recoveries. Good luck and let us know how you make out.

Alicewave · 08-03-03, 07:53 AM

The name of the medication to treat Crypto is Alinia. It's very new and is intended to treat the human form of crypto. It has only become available in the US by prescription in February '03. John who lives in Canada was able to obtain some through his vet. They have been experimenting with different levels of the edication and have had some success. His Leo bounced back in terms of health, started eating again once the side effects of the meds wore off. She was almost completely back to normal. WHen she had another crypto test, it was still there but in much smaller levels. So he's doing another round of medication to see if he can get rid of it completely. This is a real breakthrough in crypto treatment because previously death was the only prognosis. I'll keep you guys posted unless John posts himself which he sometimes does.

http://www.alinia.net/

KelliH · 08-03-03, 08:40 AM

Alicewave-

That is extremely encouraging to hear. Yes, please do keep us posted on this, it could be a significant breakthrough in the treatment for a horrible parasite.

drewlowe · 08-03-03, 11:09 AM

Alicewave THANK YOU so much the results should be in wend. thurs. or friday. i will pm you about how to get ahold of that guy or i will give you my info if you would be kind enough to give it to him. I'm still hoping the test comes back positive for coccidia though. But i'm preparing for the worst. and i thank everyone for thier post on this subject.

The_Omen · 08-03-03, 11:28 AM

Another human medicine that has shown good results in the fight against crypto in reptiles, is Humatin.
In humans it is used for treating crypto in patients with AIDS.

drewlowe · 08-04-03, 11:03 AM

ok 1st set of test results are in, but very strange. Phoenix stool sample came back negative for anything. I also took a stool sample from the colony in and it came up positive for coccida. She was just recently given panacur do you think that could have altered the sample (cause it was greyish). all my leos will be treated but i'm waiting for the vet to call back to see if he wants me to weigh them ( i have a dig. scale) or if he wants me to bring in all 7 to be examined. Plus i have to get stool samples from my beardies and cornsnakes to see if it somehow passed to them. I hope not. I'm just glad it's curable!!!!!!!!!!!

The crypto test could still come back positive. I'm keeping my fingers crossed it doesn't. Thanks again everybody. i will keep you updated when i find out the results from the crypto test.