hide box = socialization vs safety

kazz · 01-04-18, 08:13 PM

So how do you think a hide box it is a place to feel safety for snakes and it's necessary or no hide box it's a big contribution to socialization for snake ?

I have a hide box and half of it has a heat pad with thermostat (snake lie on a temperature sensor ). I can say that my carpet snake most of time in hide box and really afraid of me and light.
I have asked this question on Ukrainian forum and ppl give me a link on youtube channel where a dude has a 10 carpets and no hide boxes at all.
What is your experience ?

jjhill001 · 01-04-18, 08:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kazz

So how do you think a hide box it is a place to feel safety for snakes and it's necessary or no hide box it's a big contribution to socialization for snake ?

I have a hide box and half of it has a heat pad with thermostat (snake lie on a temperature sensor ). I can say that my carpet snake most of time in hide box and really afraid of me and light.
I have asked this question on Ukrainian forum and ppl give me a link on youtube channel where a dude has a 10 carpets and no hide boxes at all.
What is your experience ?

What kind of cages are those carpet pythons in?

DJC Reptiles · 01-04-18, 11:02 PM

Miss clicked, I do use hide boxes. It is important for any snake to use a hide box so it can feel more secure.

Jim Smith · 01-04-18, 11:15 PM

The purpose for the hides is to provide a place for your snake to feel safe and secure. To not provide a hide simply because you want to see you snake more often would suggest that perhaps a snake is not the best choice of animal for you to have. If you really want a snake that is a good "display" animal, then I suggest that you consider one of the aboreal species. Just a thought...

kazz · 01-05-18, 01:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jjhill001

What kind of cages are those carpet pythons in?

this is that guy https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hSKr5eXDSbM

kazz · 01-05-18, 01:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Smith

If you really want a snake that is a good "display" animal, then I suggest that you consider one of the aboreal species. Just a thought...

Carpets is arboreal snake. My carpet NEVER lay on a ground. She is on branches always. Too bad carpets out of hide boxes at night only.

DJC Reptiles · 01-05-18, 02:32 AM

Carpet pythons aren't known to be completely arboreal. Most carpets are semi arboreal and will spend most of their time on the ground, and some of their time in branches. Keep in mind all snakes have different personalities, so your snake might be more arboreal then others. To not provide a hide box, would be detrimental on your snake's health in the long run because of stress. Stress has been known to cause health problems, and increase risk of respiratory infection and other harmful diseases (Stress reduces the immune system in an animal over time). It is so much easier to just use a hide box, you can make one out of so many things, even a cereal box works well.

kazz · 01-05-18, 02:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJC Reptiles

Keep in mind all snakes have different personalities, so your snake might be more arboreal then others.

Sure. And I can say about my carpet only. And my carpet go to branches right after stick out her head out of hide box )

I have never see her on a ground.

Quote:

To not provide a hide box, would be detrimental on your snake's health

And how often I can take my carpet to ma hands ?
When she was 3 month she lay on my palm for hours. How she try escape from my hand every time.

CameraSkunk · 01-05-18, 12:43 PM

Kazz it might not be an attempt to escape your hands and be more that she is used to you more now and with that she is more adventurous. She may now also be more willing to explore. Like was said by one of the other members it could be her personality is inquisitive. Just a thought, but I think it would depend on her behavior. If shes quick about it, snapping at you, hissing. That could be annoyance and desire to escape/be left alone. If its slower movement, looking around. That could be interest and adventure.

I'm new to snakes but what I've seen in video and research makes me think that we don't give credit to the intelligence of these animals as much as perhaps we should. Animals in general will be driven by food and desire to survive first. If belly is full, and they feel safe perhaps there is exploration on her mind.

kazz · 01-05-18, 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CameraSkunk

If shes quick about it, snapping at you, hissing.

She hiss if she in shed and I disturbed her and never do if I take her to my hands.

Quote:

we don't give credit to the intelligence of these animals as much as perhaps we should. Animals in general will be driven by food and desire to survive first. If belly is full, and they feel safe perhaps there is exploration on her mind.

they say snake is no such smart as mammals.

jjhill001 · 01-05-18, 05:07 PM

I would certainly say that its a question worth asking, perhaps worth exploring.

I'm going to break up my reply into several parts.

1st are observations on this gentleman's enclosures.

-While there aren't any hides inside them, the majority of the cage space is dimly lit aside from the basking spot area. Only one side of these cages is transparent. Meaning the top and sides do not have light coming through (beside the basking light)

2nd what do we know about snakes?

The most important thing to a snake is security, after that is temperature and finally food and water.

3rd compare those factors to the enclosures in the video.

The enclosures are "sorta" secure in that they are dimly lit and only see through on one side. So in a way the need fo security is suboptimally met in my opinion.

(To forum vets, I would like to point out that almost none of his snakes are utilizing that hotspot if any remember that thread)

4th is the big maybe

We've seen huge strides being made in what is, in my opinion the domestication of water monitors over at the NERD facility is currently underway.

The same methods that NERD employs are anti-thesis to what we know about reptiles. No hides, lots of contact etc. And his monitors are frankly phenominally healthy looking and really social with their keepers.

5th is the question of would this work with snakes.

I've heard anecdotal evidence about species such as Russian rat snakes in that they are particularly social and seemingly intelligent, in my mind species like that would be ideal to begin such an experiment.

I wouldn't say that it's out of the realm of possibility.

We've seen in just the past decade or two how behaviors among captive populations. For example CB baby western hognoses that didn't want to eat pinkies ended up dying, now the ones now will take them with a littlw bit of scenting, previously horribly mean species such as blood pythons are considered fine, the more tame ones were more likely to be worked with and pass on those genes. Now the ones we have are not really more or less mean than any other species.

Overall I'd say unless you are going to do an experiment its best to use a hide box. But its an interesting question I don't believe has an easy answer.

**EL Ziggy** · 01-05-18, 08:54 PM

I offer hides to all my snakes. My carpets spend a lot of time off the ground but they do retreat to their hides after a big meal and when they're in shed. Those are the times when they're probably the most vulnerable so it leads me to believe that they prefer the added security. I'm sure they could live without them but they seem to appreciate having their hides.