New Redtail Boa

Wykyd · 06-18-16, 07:37 PM

I just rescued yet another critter, this time it was a redtail boa. Now I'm in the process of building him a suitable enclosure as he's roughly 4' long, been kept in a 55g aquarium and prior to me getting him his heat lamp had been out for 3 days and they fed him 1 adult mouse a week. He's very skinny and shows signs of being in too small of an enclosure (creases in his scales). I'm not going very elaborate, however I do want to build him a nice crib. Below is a general picture of the design. The enclosure itself is 2'x2'x6'. My questions are:

1) I see a lot of rack style or plain setups for boas, do they have basking spots or just UTH or heat tape?

2) What would be the best and easily cleanable way to seal the inside of the enclosure that is not harmful to the boa? I plan to use a combination of cypress mulch and fir bark (cypress first and fir bark on top) as substrate.

PICTURES!!!!

DLLNP · 06-18-16, 08:53 PM

Nice boa! I'm in the middle of rescuing a new boa as well... I'm glad we can give them a better life!

1) most racks have UTH/heat tape... I think most boa keepers stay away from basking bulbs because they tend to dry out the air.

2) any polycrylic water based sealer is totally non- toxic wince dry, they hardly have a scent when wet even.

bigsnakegirl785 · 06-18-16, 09:20 PM

I've found the creases on the side to be humidity issues rather than cramped conditions with snakes. If the humidity is too low, it doesn't matter how big the enclosure is or how they lay, they'll get those. You keep the humidity up and you most likely won't see any.

For your set up I'd advise a CHE or RHP, they will heat the air and any surfaces below them, belly heat is more supplemental than required imo. I've also noticed better digestion in my sunglow since switching her to ambients (took a few months, but she's gone from pooping every 3-4 meals eating biweekly to pooping every 2 weeks), and I've never had any problems with my adult boa, and he's been on ambients his whole life. I've only had the two new ones about a week so it will be awhile before I see how they compare.

I used water-based polyurethane in my enclosures. No warps or bows ~3 years later, using damp EcoEarth (coco coir) to maintain 70-80% humidity. The amount of coats changes on each individual piece of wood in my experience.

I would try to find an alternative to cypress mulch, the use of cypress mulch is depleting the cypress forests, and is a major environmental concern as they cannot be replenished once cut down. There are and have been bans in certain states/counties, and talk of it in many places across the US. The closest I can think of is coco chips off the top of my head.

riddick07 · 06-18-16, 09:29 PM

I would use radiant heat panels but I'm not sure how they do with wood. I had wood cages at one point but they were a pain to move so I trashed them and just have PVC or racks. I have a ceramic bulb on my big girl but when I buy her a new ap cage she's getting a RHP.

I tend to offer a cooler side for my boas then I see most people recommend. The cool side is in the mid to high 70s range and I often find my boas hanging out at these temps. The middle area tends to stay in the 80s and the hot spot is 90 or so. So far these temps work for my guys but I often hear about not letting it get below 80. Humidity is in the 70-80 range dipping into the 60s sometimes.

Honestly he doesn't look skinny in those pictures. I'd probably put him at every two weeks for food. The size depends on what you think he should be eating right now. It's hard to get a good idea from a picture sometimes but I'd probably put him on rat pups or weaned rats. He doesn't look much bigger than my male boa.

DLLNP · 06-18-16, 10:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by riddick07

I tend to offer a cooler side for my boas then I see most people recommend. The cool side is in the mid to high 70s range and I often find my boas hanging out at these temps. The middle area tends to stay in the 80s and the hot spot is 90 or so. So far these temps work for my guys but I often hear about not letting it get below 80. Humidity is in the 70-80 range dipping into the 60s sometimes.

I offer a cooler side than most recommend as well, I live in a very cold climate and although my hot spot is usually around 90 my cool side is sometimes as low as 70 and honestly my male boa spends the majority of his time on the cool side unless he is in shed or digesting. If you read any of Russo's writing on temp cycling boas for breeding he lets them cool off to 70 at night without a hotspot for the entire winter. Letting temps dip below 80 is definitely not a big deal.

Quote:

Honestly he doesn't look skinny in those pictures. I'd probably put him at every two weeks for food. The size depends on what you think he should be eating right now. It's hard to get a good idea from a picture sometimes but I'd probably put him on rat pups or weaned rats. He doesn't look much bigger than my male boa.

I was going to say the same thing about his size/weight, doesn't look to bad IMO.

Wykyd · 06-19-16, 05:44 AM

Well, I'm glad to hear he's in better shape than I initially thought. I guess I did forget to mention the screen top they had on his cage too... it amazes me how people are.

I've never used RHPs before, but I'm assuming they work the same as a UTH except from above. I will have everything on thermostats (Repti Temp 500R) and outlet timers. When using the RHPs, should I make the enclosure shorter, maybe 18" instead of 24"? Would I still use 2 RHPs, one on either side of the enclosure?

Unfortunately my pet store (That Pet Place/That Fish Place) doesn't sell RHPs. Is there a preferred brand? Size/amount for that size enclosure?

Jack is my first boa and I just want to make sure he is in the best possible environment to thrive and be as happy as possible. Last night he ate 3 adult mice, unfortunately he's currently on live, but now that he has eaten since moving to my house I plan on trying to make the f/t switch. I'm assuming I should try with f/t mice first to make sure he'll do f/t then try and make the switch to rat pups or small rats. I can definitely tell they eat different then bps do, but is the prey item not sized the same? He's roughly 4ft long and about 1.5"-2" in diameter at his thickest part.

macandchz · 06-19-16, 09:50 AM

nice rescue. i'm sure he'll do well for you. let us know how he does on the switch from live to f/t. mac still isn't switching. Stubborn Snake!

bigsnakegirl785 · 06-19-16, 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by riddick07

I would use radiant heat panels but I'm not sure how they do with wood. I had wood cages at one point but they were a pain to move so I trashed them and just have PVC or racks. I have a ceramic bulb on my big girl but when I buy her a new ap cage she's getting a RHP.

I tend to offer a cooler side for my boas then I see most people recommend. The cool side is in the mid to high 70s range and I often find my boas hanging out at these temps. The middle area tends to stay in the 80s and the hot spot is 90 or so. So far these temps work for my guys but I often hear about not letting it get below 80. Humidity is in the 70-80 range dipping into the 60s sometimes.

Honestly he doesn't look skinny in those pictures. I'd probably put him at every two weeks for food. The size depends on what you think he should be eating right now. It's hard to get a good idea from a picture sometimes but I'd probably put him on rat pups or weaned rats. He doesn't look much bigger than my male boa.

I have heat panels in my wooden enclosures, and they do just fine (during the winter I struggle with temps but I think that's more to do with the height than anything). What exactly about them are you worried that they wouldn't work?

For the temp gradient thing I normally suggest a cool side of 80F because most people either offer an enclosure too small for a true gradient, or because they're a newbie and they haven't had experience keeping a gradient. Generally, if you have a cool end large enough for them to curl up in, a middle gradient big enough they can curl up in, and a hot end big enough they can curl up in, a gradient of 75-88F is fine. You will need a way to monitor all three points to be sure everything is in line. I wouldn't go below 75F in any part of the enclosure, though.

You don't want it to jump from 75F to 88F all of a sudden. It will lead to the snake avoiding one side or the other, affecting digestion.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wykyd

Well, I'm glad to hear he's in better shape than I initially thought. I guess I did forget to mention the screen top they had on his cage too... it amazes me how people are.

I've never used RHPs before, but I'm assuming they work the same as a UTH except from above. I will have everything on thermostats (Repti Temp 500R) and outlet timers. When using the RHPs, should I make the enclosure shorter, maybe 18" instead of 24"? Would I still use 2 RHPs, one on either side of the enclosure?

Unfortunately my pet store (That Pet Place/That Fish Place) doesn't sell RHPs. Is there a preferred brand? Size/amount for that size enclosure?

Jack is my first boa and I just want to make sure he is in the best possible environment to thrive and be as happy as possible. Last night he ate 3 adult mice, unfortunately he's currently on live, but now that he has eaten since moving to my house I plan on trying to make the f/t switch. I'm assuming I should try with f/t mice first to make sure he'll do f/t then try and make the switch to rat pups or small rats. I can definitely tell they eat different then bps do, but is the prey item not sized the same? He's roughly 4ft long and about 1.5"-2" in diameter at his thickest part.

You want it taller. If it's too close, you risk burning or overheating your snake. Although RHPs are built to be able to touch them without being burned, this doesn't mean if a snake sits under it all the time with it too close that it won't be bad for them. I'd recommend 18"-24" of height with a heat panel. The probe should be placed underneath the panel, out of reach of the snake or its hides. If you want to add a basking shelf to your enclosure, you can attach the probe to the bottom of the shelf, and adjust the thermostat settings accordingly. That's how I have my T12's set up.

You can buy heat panels online, I'm not sure any pet store sells them. Pro Heat and RBI are the only brands I know of. Pro Heat has a wide selection of panels, but you'll have to contact the owner directly to find out what size you'll need, and they're a bit pricier. RBI panels come in just a few sizes, generally 80 watt is used for 4'x2's, I have a 120 watt in my 6'x2'x3's.

If you don't have to, please please do not feed multiple prey items. It's power feeding and can affect the health of your snake. If it's big enough for 3 adult mice, you need to get it on weaned rats, mice aren't going to cut it. Small rats may be appropriate as well. I would go straight to rats without the f/t mice. Boas generally aren't hard to switch, and if he doesn't take it right away just wait him out, he'll eventually take a f/t rat. He's too big to be eating mice.

When you feed your boa you should feed one prey item roughly it's girth without leaving a bulge. At 4' he should be eating every 2-3 weeks at most. If he's older than 3 years, he needs to be eating every 4-6 weeks.

I also want to add, you should give him an extra two weeks or so to recover from that last meal you gave him. If you fed him Sat the 18, don't feed him again until July 16 at the earliest, later if he's 3+ years.

Wykyd · 06-20-16, 04:34 AM

So then one 120 watt RHP should do the entire enclosure? I'm planning on starting construction this weekend, so I will post a few more plans associated with the build. Again, I just want to be sure I'm doing everything right. I've already read contradicting points on multiple care sheets and multiple forums (temp gradients, humidity, feeding frequency, etc). I have the utmost trust in ssnakess and value everyone's opinion here. Thanks for everyone's time and I will continue to post updates as I can. Any other useful information is greatly appreciated.

Wykyd · 06-20-16, 08:42 PM

More pictures!

bigsnakegirl785 · 06-20-16, 09:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wykyd

So then one 120 watt RHP should do the entire enclosure? I'm planning on starting construction this weekend, so I will post a few more plans associated with the build. Again, I just want to be sure I'm doing everything right. I've already read contradicting points on multiple care sheets and multiple forums (temp gradients, humidity, feeding frequency, etc). I have the utmost trust in ssnakess and value everyone's opinion here. Thanks for everyone's time and I will continue to post updates as I can. Any other useful information is greatly appreciated.

Yup 120 watt should be fine, I've found that's about as big as a 2' wide enclosure will fit anyways. You're technically supposed to have at least 6" from a surface on all sides, but the 120 watt panel is a bit too big for that in a 2' wide enclosure. So if it's not powerful enough, you'll need to supplement something like a CHE on the opposite end. Shouldn't need to though.

Yes care sheets will vary a lot, that's why they're just a stepping stone. Generally, temperatures should remain constant, but everything else will be different.

I've found the conventional way of feeding snakes is usually feeding I'd place in the overfeeding to powerfeeding range. It's hard to underfeed a snake, but really easy to overfeed them. Each species will vary wildly on how much food is appropriate, but in general keeping your feeding conservative is best. A boa constrictor reaching 6' by 3 years isn't exactly healthy, so just because your snake "isn't as big as everyone else's" doesn't mean your snake is stunted or unhealthy. Unnaturally fast growth and excessive amounts of food is really bad for snakes. Plus, your boa seems to have a lot of dwarf influence so I wouldn't expect him to get much bigger.

Wykyd · 06-20-16, 09:52 PM

Orly now? lolz. So maybe I don't need to build such a large enclosure? What's the easiest way for me to find out whether or not he/she is a dwarf? I'd really hate to go and build this enclosure and it's too big for the snake.

More enclosure pictures. I semi scrapped the original design and went with one more like my bearded dragon enclosure design. It's pretty simple and straight forward, however, I plan on doing some foam work around the back and sides. I also plan on making hides with removable tops for access/cleaning. The bottom will just be sealed with bedding. Again, the unit is still 6'x2'x2' as well as the stand. I plan on drilling holes in the plexiglass for venting. Couple rows at the top and bottom on either side. The RHP will mount above the right side of the enclosure making the left the cool side.

bigsnakegirl785 · 06-21-16, 05:07 PM

There's no real way to tell for sure, especially if any Colombian blood has been mixed in. Purely going off his looks, he looks like a Central American locality of some sort. Males generally average 3'-4' and females 4'-5'. You pretty much have to wait and see how big he gets. Since boas grow incredibly slowly, it could take another 4+ years for that to become apparent.

At 4', if your boa is a dwarf it's most likely somewhere around 2-3+ years old. A Colombian can be pushed to reach 4' at a year, but that's more average of a 2-3 year old size when properly fed. Boas don't reach their max sizes until they're 5-6+ years old. I know Colombians and "B(C)C" grow well past 6 years, but not too sure about dwarf localities.

The size of the enclosure is totally up to you. However big he ends up being, a 6'x2' isn't going to be "too big" for him. If you want to go smaller for your own reasons, and he stays under 6', then by all means a 4'x2' will be sufficient. You don't have to feel like you need to make the enclosure smaller because it might be too big for the snake, though. Snakes don't like open spaces, they couldn't care less about the size of the box they're living in as long as they have plenty of cover.

Wykyd · 06-21-16, 08:53 PM

Yeah, it's tough to take much from what the previous owner told me due to his terrible husbandry and lack of knowledge (or desire to learn), but he said it was a "2 yr old super docile South American red tail boa." He's a very active snake and he really enjoys being held.

Some questions about viv setups. I was looking into controllers for the viv and was wondering what was recommended. I would like to have all probe style with digital readouts. Is the Hydro Therm by ZooMed worth it to control the humidity/basking temp? I plan on using a Pro Heat RHP and a fogger if needed for the humidity. Also, good probe thermometer for all 3 zones?

Wykyd · 06-22-16, 04:09 PM

Thermostats I'm interested in are:
Vivarium Electronics VE-300 - Reptile Basics Inc
https://www.amazon.com/MTPRTC-ETL-Ce...iglink21195-20

I'm not having as good of luck on finding a good probe thermometer/hygrometer. Here are the ones I've been looking at though the reviews are all over the map. A lot of people complain about the accuracy of the hygrometer (most complaints are a 20%+/- swing).

https://www.amazon.com/Pawliss-Digit.../dp/B017Z7Y6FK
Exo Terra : Thermo-Hygro / Combination Thermometer and Hygrometer
Vivarium Electronics Digital Thermometer / Hygrometer