Looking for input.... - Page 2

**millertime89** · 08-30-12, 01:56 PM

The first ones he got, Bob had a few before him and I believe Mike Willbanks had a few as well. Since you can see that one I'll post a few others. Those are 6x3 cages.

**millertime89** · 08-30-12, 02:11 PM

Jake (guy in the grey shirt and black hat) says he thinks they were w/c, and we can't exactly ask Jim anymore. I'm waiting to see if anybody else might know.

MDT · 08-30-12, 02:32 PM

That is one big @$$ snake.....

**Aaron_S** · 08-30-12, 02:36 PM

That is why I want people to really know what they are getting into with these animals.

Speaking from a legal point of view, how can you allow "dwarfs" when they have specimens CAUGHT FROM THE WILD that grow to be over the limit. CBB "dwarfs" generally grow to a decent still since they get a better diet than their island that they usually hail from.

exwizard · 08-30-12, 03:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by millertime89

...You are correct for the national laws, however when you have place such as Des Moines, IA with a climate that would quickly kill both Reticulated and Burmese pythons, but outlawing only retics and requiring a permit for any species over, I believe 8 ft, it is evident that these are bad laws based on bad "science" and observations of the ill-informed. Re: their impact on ecosystems, it is widely known (even though its ignored) that other animals that are just as widely kept, if not more-so, do more damage to ecosystems than invasive pythons. Cats are the bets known, but goats are another perpetrator, and as I'm sure you're aware, Cane Toads and rabbits wreak havoc in places that they shouldn't be...

Since you used Des Moines to make your point I will expand on that. I live in Des Moines. Yes our restrictions are not only flawed but are actually worse than you described. Yes, Retics are banned outright, no matter the size. Condas and African Rocks are also banned btw. That is a statewide law. Burms, Amethistines and Indian Rocks are ok though. Cut to Des Moines. This city does not allow any snake over 6' no matter the species without a permit. Thing is Im afraid to try and change our city ordinance for fear it could backfire and turn into other cities like Baxter which bans any "venemous or constrictors" of any kind. That would be bad because among other reasons, Ball Pythons and Corns would be included in that ban..

**millertime89** · 08-30-12, 04:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aaron_S

That is why I want people to really know what they are getting into with these animals.

Speaking from a legal point of view, how can you allow "dwarfs" when they have specimens CAUGHT FROM THE WILD that grow to be over the limit. CBB "dwarfs" generally grow to a decent still since they get a better diet than their island that they usually hail from.

There's been recent discussion about this recently. General consensus is dwarfs are no longer considered "dwarfs", but they're kind of in a group of their own. There's normals, then jamps, then dwarfs, then "superdwarfs". This is all still up for some debate obviously and the SDs are another topic as well.

**millertime89** · 08-30-12, 04:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by exwizard

Since you used Des Moines to make your point I will expand on that. I live in Des Moines. Yes our restrictions are not only flawed but are actually worse than you described. Yes, Retics are banned outright, no matter the size. Condas and African Rocks are also banned btw. That is a statewide law. Burms, Amethistines and Indian Rocks are ok though. Cut to Des Moines. This city does not allow any snake over 6' no matter the species without a permit. Thing is Im afraid to try and change our city ordinance for fear it could backfire and turn into other cities like Baxter which bans any "venemous or constrictors" of any kind. That would be bad because among other reasons, Ball Pythons and Corns would be included in that ban..

I agree, we kind of saw that in Ohio (depending on which story you believe), it sounds like it was only when USARK got involved to protect reptile keepers there that they decided to include them in the ban.

exwizard · 08-30-12, 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by millertime89

I agree, we kind of saw that in Ohio (depending on which story you believe), it sounds like it was only when USARK got involved to protect reptile keepers there that they decided to include them in the ban.

So yeah, I have my permit and as long as things remain as they are, Im ok.

exwizard · 08-30-12, 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MDT

That is one big @$$ snake.....

IMO, If you want a Retic that is a definite smaller size, I would stick with the SDs

**millertime89** · 08-30-12, 05:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by exwizard

So yeah, I have my permit and as long as things remain as they are, Im ok.

hopefully they improve, if they get worse in Des Moines but not IA you could always move out of the city limits.

Quote:

Originally Posted by exwizard

IMO, If you want a Retic that is a definite smaller size, I would stick with the SDs

This can be a tricky situation. I'm usually the first one to say SDs are what you want, but with the market the way it is and the appeal of SDs you have to be VERY careful to make sure you know EXACTLY what you buy. Unfortunately there are some unscrupulous breeders out there selling xx% SDs as full SDs and you, unfortunately, start to get crosses sold as 100%ers and it gets hairy. 50% or more usually stay pretty small. USUALLY.