True length of "record" giant pythons.

[Aaron_S]

Originally Posted by Sherman

Why should we solely use them? I use dwarf stuff, and mainland stuff. I enjoy both. I keep both responsibly.

Unless they are classified as a completely different species (which won't happen, and if you think it will- go study some taxonomy and take a seat).

No reason to tell me to take a seat. I have done my readings and you clearly missed my point. Re-read it and try again.

Just play with already small pretty snakes? Like what? Ball pythons and corn snakes? No thanks they bore me and frankly don't have the personality of a retic.

Lots of other species that get larger and are pretty too. Suck it up and deal with it. I like wolves because of their personality but that isn't a reason for me to have one over a dog.

You've missed my point here as well because you've never read all my posts. I'm talking about the illegal keeping of the species. If it's legal where you are, it's less of a problem for me. I still prefer they were just out of the hobby.

We are crazy, but real keepers of giants, real dedicated keepers are not the problem, idiots are. Guess what- idiots will find a way to get hurt regardless. Whether it's owning a big snake, hots, a car too fast, or doing some other dumb crap, a few keepers being huge idiots should not punish everyone. I enjoy and love my big snakes.

I guess by your logic we should ban cars and liquor, because someone might be dumb enough to drink and drive and hurt someone, so lets get rid of them all JUST TO BE SAFE.

Please kid, take a seat.

That isn't my logic at all. You obviously can't tell the difference between something that can act upon it's own thoughts (live animals) versus something that is more or less a tool (that's a severe understatement but it makes my point)

Problem I have is that the few people who don't keep them properly are now placing the entire hobby in jeopardy. I for one just believe that if it's the entire hobby or the giants, the giants can be gone. We won't win this political war without breaking a few eggs. Sucks that your hobby is seen as dangerous.

For the record I do love and respect giants. I've owned them and worked with them. I just stick to my local by-laws because I'm not going to the cause for everyone to lose their hobby because I'm not selfish.

[Sherman]

Originally Posted by Aaron_S

Lots of other species that get larger and are pretty too. Suck it up and deal with it. I like wolves because of their personality but that isn't a reason for me to have one over a dog.

Wolves are entirely different, they aren't developed socially enough to be kept as standard dogs. If you're keeping one as you would a dog- I have a problem with it. If you're keeping a dog in a proper enclosure, with an 8'+ fence, 6' deep fence, and fed a natural raw diet- more power to you. I've worked with wolves and wolf dogs, they aren't bad animals and some people are more than capable of owning them.

Again, I'm not going to "suck it up and deal with it" other species of snakes are not fun to keep, why settle when I can do what I enjoy and what I love. I won't settle, I won't be a sheep.

You've missed my point here as well because you've never read all my posts. I'm talking about the illegal keeping of the species. If it's legal where you are, it's less of a problem for me. I still prefer they were just out of the hobby.

I'd prefer the cancer that is ball pythons out of the hobby too, maybe that way all the people who keep snakes/get into snakes for the money aspect would leave with them, but that doesn't mean it's a smart argument now does it.

That isn't my logic at all. You obviously can't tell the difference between something that can act upon it's own thoughts (live animals) versus something that is more or less a tool (that's a severe understatement but it makes my point)

Sure thing, I guess dogs should be banned to then? Especially bully breeds with the potential to do serious harm. Punish all owners because of the minority of irresponsible ones. Just because you want a mastiff, pitbull, rott, etc doesn't mean you should have one, just get a small dog, deal with it.

Problem I have is that the few people who don't keep them properly are now placing the entire hobby in jeopardy. I for one just believe that if it's the entire hobby or the giants, the giants can be gone. We won't win this political war without breaking a few eggs. Sucks that your hobby is seen as dangerous.

Have you ever talked to politicians? They hear "boa" or "python" and get scared REGARDLESS of species. If you think giants being banned is going to stop them from going after ALL species of snakes you are fooling yourself and delusional. They wanted to ban ball pythons just as badly as giants originally, we fought it back to the few species that ended up banned.

All snakes are seen as dangerous, I've watched people freak out of corn snakes and boas, get real. To your experienced reptile keeper you have a point, to your average uneducated Joe- your words mean nothing. To HSUS- they don't care, and want them all banned regardless.

For the record I do love and respect giants. I've owned them and worked with them. I just stick to my local by-laws because I'm not going to the cause for everyone to lose their hobby because I'm not selfish.

My laws allow them to be legal. No one is going to lose their hobby because of me.

Giant keepers are on the front lines of this fight, we are the most passionate, driven, group of reptile keepers I've met alongside experienced varanid keepers. You don't see this level of passion, drive, etc out of most average bp or corn keepers. We bust our asses to keep our animals and protect YOURS from becoming next. If you think they will stop with giants- you need a serious reality check, you don't belong in this hobby.

[Amadeus]

Originally Posted by Sherman

Wolves are entirely different, they aren't developed socially enough to be kept as standard dogs. If you're keeping one as you would a dog- I have a problem with it. If you're keeping a dog in a proper enclosure, with an 8'+ fence, 6' deep fence, and fed a natural raw diet- more power to you. I've worked with wolves and wolf dogs, they aren't bad animals and some people are more than capable of owning them.

Again, I'm not going to "suck it up and deal with it" other species of snakes are not fun to keep, why settle when I can do what I enjoy and what I love. I won't settle, I won't be a sheep.


I'd prefer the cancer that is ball pythons out of the hobby too, maybe that way all the people who keep snakes/get into snakes for the money aspect would leave with them, but that doesn't mean it's a smart argument now does it.





Sure thing, I guess dogs should be banned to then? Especially bully breeds with the potential to do serious harm. Punish all owners because of the minority of irresponsible ones. Just because you want a mastiff, pitbull, rott, etc doesn't mean you should have one, just get a small dog, deal with it.


Have you ever talked to politicians? They hear "boa" or "python" and get scared REGARDLESS of species. If you think giants being banned is going to stop them from going after ALL species of snakes you are fooling yourself and delusional. They wanted to ban ball pythons just as badly as giants originally, we fought it back to the few species that ended up banned.

All snakes are seen as dangerous, I've watched people freak out of corn snakes and boas, get real. To your experienced reptile keeper you have a point, to your average uneducated Joe- your words mean nothing. To HSUS- they don't care, and want them all banned regardless.


My laws allow them to be legal. No one is going to lose their hobby because of me.

Giant keepers are on the front lines of this fight, we are the most passionate, driven, group of reptile keepers I've met alongside experienced varanid keepers. You don't see this level of passion, drive, etc out of most average bp or corn keepers. We bust our asses to keep our animals and protect YOURS from becoming next. If you think they will stop with giants- you need a serious reality check, you don't belong in this hobby.

I can't believe I read all that jargon.

[Aaron_S]

[QUOTE=Sherman;851569]Wolves are entirely different,[QUOTE]

What analogy would you like then? Tigers to cats? Guppies to great whites? They all hold water here considering we're talking about snakes who really aren't on the level of domestication as dogs or cats...yet you act like they are.

Again, I'm not going to "suck it up and deal with it" other species of snakes are not fun to keep, why settle when I can do what I enjoy and what I love. I won't settle, I won't be a sheep.

The fact you say you aren't a "sheep" by owning one of the more commonly kept species is laughable. Giants aren't really rare.

You're one of those people who believe you should get whatever you want just because you want it, right? The world doesn't work that way.

I'd prefer the cancer that is ball pythons out of the hobby too, maybe that way all the people who keep snakes/get into snakes for the money aspect would leave with them, but that doesn't mean it's a smart argument now does it.

How is it a cancer? I see it as a really large contributor to you keeping your animals currently. It's really funny that you say we're sheep and that what we keep is "cancer" yet you're the first to ask us to "ban together" as a "community" to save you from every bill. To petition for you yet you can't even offer us respect.

You think nobody owns retics for money? Kettle meet pot. Pot meet kettle. You should get along.

Sure thing, I guess dogs should be banned to then? Especially bully breeds with the potential to do serious harm. Punish all owners because of the minority of irresponsible ones. Just because you want a mastiff, pitbull, rott, etc doesn't mean you should have one, just get a small dog, deal with it.

Already are banned. Guess you really showed me huh?

Maybe when you can find an analogy that doesn't have a serious flaw I'd actually consider it. Dogs have a far higher intellect than a snake.

Have you ever talked to politicians?

Yes. I do on a regular basis. There's one that breeds snakes actually. They currently breed ball pythons, also has boas and at one time bred burmese pythons.

They hear "boa" or "python" and get scared REGARDLESS of species. If you think giants being banned is going to stop them from going after ALL species of snakes you are fooling yourself and delusional. They wanted to ban ball pythons just as badly as giants originally, we fought it back to the few species that ended up banned.

Have YOU spoken to a politician or just going off what you've blindly followed like a sheep from the mass hysteria you read on the internet? This sounds a lot like that.

In fact I've stood in front of two different councils for two different cities to get bylaws changed. They don't do what you just did if you present it properly. Apparently we needed the ball python guys to fix it and the giant keepers were too busy seeing who's got the "bigger snake". Am I right?

All snakes are seen as dangerous, I've watched people freak out of corn snakes and boas, get real. To your experienced reptile keeper you have a point, to your average uneducated Joe- your words mean nothing. To HSUS- they don't care, and want them all banned regardless.

Read above, you've certainly taken a drink from the sheep kool-aid they serve at giant keeper meetings didn't you? Think your somehow the most integral part of this hobby. The sad truth is that you are a minority. There's what truly 6? 10? giant species. I'm sure the hobby will live on with the dozens upon dozens of other ones.

I've spoken to many people frightened of snakes. A lot of bad information is out there but it's up to all of us to continue education.

My laws allow them to be legal. No one is going to lose their hobby because of me.

Have an escape and I beg to differ...

Giant keepers are on the front lines of this fight, we are the most passionate, driven, group of reptile keepers I've met alongside experienced varanid keepers. You don't see this level of passion, drive, etc out of most average bp or corn keepers. We bust our asses to keep our animals and protect YOURS from becoming next. If you think they will stop with giants- you need a serious reality check, you don't belong in this hobby.

It's all laughable. You aren't protecting squat. I've changed my by laws to allow the species I currently keep. Sorry kid, that's how it is. You've done nothing for me. I did it myself. The difference is that I have fact backing me. You don't have fact that they won't pursue ball pythons, I have facts that say they have.

In a local city they've recently changed their by laws from outright ban on boas and pythons and gone to the 3 meter rule. Guess things aren't so bleak as you make them out to be?

Lastly, as I've stated, I've owned and worked with giants. I've had a myriad of species throughout my life and I've been really lucky in the chances to work with what I have. Just because I choose a species that fits my current lifestyle doesn't mean I lack passion or love for my snakes.

Honestly, I have yet to see any true passion from a giant keeper. No drive really. Just taking large animals and shoving them into boxes. All I see are the same meat heads that park in parking lots with their stupid "suped" up cars. Just one big giant Richard size contest.

I'm now done with you.

[Sherman]

I guess it's different for you folk up in Canada, where you don't know what freedom is I guess.

I can make the analogy for anything, why own xyz when you don't NEED it? I've never asked ball python people to save my ***, I've lobbied and worked hard to show my big snakes in a positive light. I inform everyone I come across that of course their are bad keepers just like their are bad dog owners. Doesn't matter how smart a dog is- they still have killed people have they not?

Fact is, I make sure to let everyone know, and everyone see that every animal I have is behind a locked cage, in a triple locked room, I show the methods I use to ensure mine and others safety. Just become something has the potential to be dangerous doesn't mean it should be outlawed, that logic is the exact same garbage as the idiots who "want to ban guns" just because some criminals use them to commit crimes.

Guess what, ban the snakes, stupid people will still find ways to get them and mess up, that won't change. Ever.

[KORBIN5895]

And yet again Kyle has recruited someone to come and fight his battles for him. I think it's time to send Kyle packing as all he does is bring ******** here to save his pathetic hide.

Originally Posted by Sherman

Giant keepers are on the front lines of this fight, we are the most passionate, driven, group of reptile keepers I've met alongside experienced varanid keepers. You don't see this level of passion, drive, etc out of most average bp or corn keepers. We bust our asses to keep our animals and protect YOURS from becoming next. If you think they will stop with giants- you need a serious reality check, you don't belong in this hobby.

You sir are a complete moron. Nice dig at Canadians but it obvious that you don't know what you're talking about.

Giant keepers are a special breed of ignorant idiots with a healthy mixture of pure assholes. You guys think you are saving our hobby by championing your giants when in reality you are endangering the whole hobby just to keep what you feel entitled to keep. You are all a bunch of arrogant fools that are trying to compensate for your wee willies. Please go back to bigticslittledicks as you're not welcome here. We don't need any ignorant bigots.

[smy_749]

We are all sheep, some of us don't care, others try to look like goats to be different but... your still a sheep in the end despite thinking a retic or burm makes you eligable for a role on sons of anarchy

[red ink]

You boys.... you guys really have a knack for turning a 2 foot hognose and escalating it into a 18 foot retic.

[lady_bug87]

Originally Posted by Sherman

I guess it's different for you folk up in Canada, where you don't know what freedom is I guess.

I can make the analogy for anything, why own xyz when you don't NEED it? I've never asked ball python people to save my ***, I've lobbied and worked hard to show my big snakes in a positive light. I inform everyone I come across that of course their are bad keepers just like their are bad dog owners. Doesn't matter how smart a dog is- they still have killed people have they not?

Fact is, I make sure to let everyone know, and everyone see that every animal I have is behind a locked cage, in a triple locked room, I show the methods I use to ensure mine and others safety. Just become something has the potential to be dangerous doesn't mean it should be outlawed, that logic is the exact same garbage as the idiots who "want to ban guns" just because some criminals use them to commit crimes.

Guess what, ban the snakes, stupid people will still find ways to get them and mess up, that won't change. Ever.

If you think you're free than the education system down there is worse than I thought. The only thing you're 'free' to do down there is get fat and die poor.

You may champion for your big snakes but you and your kind have terrible attitudes and animosity towards the rest of the hobby.

Why should I and people like myself and other non-giant- keeping meatheads ally ourselves with you when you try to hard to alienate us? I hope they not only take all your animals I hope they destroy them. Acting like you all do towards others tells me you have the integrity of a boiled potato.

You and people like you are bottom feeders who use these animals to prove a point that you have no business proving. Pull your head from that dark smelly place and realize that without cooperating and not insulting the rest of us you're never going to win. Know why? Because people like me are going to keep signing whatever I have to to get giants banned. If that means I need to jump through hoops to save my own animals when the time comes so be it. There are more of me than there are of you.

And one more thing? I'd rather live in Canada then be a part of the melting pot of gross obesity you call home.

[Aaron_S]

Originally Posted by Sherman

I guess it's different for you folk up in Canada, where you don't know what freedom is I guess.

I can make the analogy for anything, why own xyz when you don't NEED it? I've never asked ball python people to save my ***, I've lobbied and worked hard to show my big snakes in a positive light. I inform everyone I come across that of course their are bad keepers just like their are bad dog owners. Doesn't matter how smart a dog is- they still have killed people have they not?

Fact is, I make sure to let everyone know, and everyone see that every animal I have is behind a locked cage, in a triple locked room, I show the methods I use to ensure mine and others safety. Just become something has the potential to be dangerous doesn't mean it should be outlawed, that logic is the exact same garbage as the idiots who "want to ban guns" just because some criminals use them to commit crimes.

Guess what, ban the snakes, stupid people will still find ways to get them and mess up, that won't change. Ever.

When you can refute actual points I make instead of taking digs at Canadians (truly shows your character and immaturity) then we can continue this discussion.

As it stands now, it's clear your agenda is to continue to not only make giant keepers look bad (Can't you guys send someone smart?)but your entire nation. Congrats you're now stupid for two groups!

[smy_749]

I love how americans think we are free too, thats good stuff.... as he talks about why he cant have big snakes and eventually any snakes

[Aaron_S]

This is what the latest post reminded me of...

"Freedom"

[guyabano]

Originally Posted by Aaron_S

"Freedom"

That pic made me giggle.

[MDT]

Silly Aaron...it's not A-murica.....it's just flat out 'MURICA....
I'm pretty sure you gotta spit after saying it too.


(disclaimer....I'm 'Murican)

[Sherman]

Originally Posted by KORBIN5895

And yet again Kyle has recruited someone to come and fight his battles for him. I think it's time to send Kyle packing as all he does is bring ******** here to save his pathetic hide.



You sir are a complete moron. Nice dig at Canadians but it obvious that you don't know what you're talking about.

Kyle didn't recruit me to come here, I came here on my own accord, nothing to do with Kyle, he just happened to be here. Here in America I have certain rights, while a lot of you may not believe in freedom anymore here, I do, and I fight to keep it from the oppressive idiots like Obama in office. I'll keep what animals I like, I'll own what guns I like, and I'll do what I want with my life. Don't like it? Tough luck.

Giant keepers are a special breed of ignorant idiots with a healthy mixture of pure assholes. You guys think you are saving our hobby by championing your giants when in reality you are endangering the whole hobby just to keep what you feel entitled to keep. You are all a bunch of arrogant fools that are trying to compensate for your wee willies. Please go back to bigticslittledicks as you're not welcome here. We don't need any ignorant bigots.

Why do you need to keep Boas? There have been deaths to boas. Why hots? Death by hots. All snakes are demonized. You are the ignorant idiot if you actually believe that once giants fall- your snakes won't be soon after. did you not see the original list of snakes proposed and pushed for on the lacey act? One of the highlights for those too inept to read- BALL PYTHONS. Guess what, they went after the most harmless, popular, paraded snake IN THE ENTIRE HOBBY. They've already tried to go after your snakes. Yeah, they go after BPs, found in every petco, petsmart, reptile store, making up 80% of almost every reptile show, owned by children everywhere.

Part of the reason here in America you're permitted to keep your ball pythons is because so many of us giant keepers fought tooth and nail to keep ALL these snakes off the Lacey act. We rallied and we fought for you, we didn't abandon every reptile keeper despite what you may think, we still don't. We know full well that we are the front line, and if we let that fall, the rest of this hobby will be steamrolled.

Originally Posted by lady_bug87

If you think you're free than the education system down there is worse than I thought. The only thing you're 'free' to do down there is get fat and die poor.

You may champion for your big snakes but you and your kind have terrible attitudes and animosity towards the rest of the hobby.

I'm skinny, and I'm far from poor. Sorry I'm not a socialist and if you work hard here it's plenty easy to make something for yourself- although yes a lot of people get fat and sit on welfare, and that's no good.

I don't have a terrible attitude, except when bp keepers try to ram-rod their boring snakes down my throat, saying "get another animal". Guess what, I like my big dogs too, I'm a certified animal trainer. Guess what, I'm an exotics handler who has hands on zoo experience with nearly every species under the sun. I work hard to keep my rights to have these animals and have them safely. There is zero reason to punish the whole because of a few mad keepers who are terrible.

Why should I and people like myself and other non-giant- keeping meatheads ally ourselves with you when you try to hard to alienate us? I hope they not only take all your animals I hope they destroy them. Acting like you all do towards others tells me you have the integrity of a boiled potato.

Do you have children? If so, I hope they are taken and destroyed. Lucky you're not here to my face on my property saying that, you disgusting sack of trash.

I don't alienate most keepers. I'm good friends with nearly every bp/corn/etc breeder in my area. I have problems with the know it all mongoloids on the internet who know nothing yet think they can ram-rod their hate for giants down my throat. I've fought tooth and nail for bps just as much as giants, you fools are too ignorant to realize your bps are in danger of being taken too. So ignorant.

You and people like you are bottom feeders who use these animals to prove a point that you have no business proving. Pull your head from that dark smelly place and realize that without cooperating and not insulting the rest of us you're never going to win. Know why? Because people like me are going to keep signing whatever I have to to get giants banned. If that means I need to jump through hoops to save my own animals when the time comes so be it. There are more of me than there are of you.

And after my giants are banned (I'll still own them). I'll make sure we all just sit down and watch them ban your species too. No worries. I have these animals because I enjoy them, because their interaction with me is different than any other snake besides a king cobra. Go actually own, raise, and interact with a adult female retic, they are a hell of a lot smarter than you give them credit for, THAT is why I keep them- and monitors on the lizard spectrum.

And one more thing? I'd rather live in Canada then be a part of the melting pot of gross obesity you call home.

6'0 155lbs, I hate obesity too, but I'm not obese so who cares. Let others make their own choices.

Originally Posted by smy_749

I love how americans think we are free too, thats good stuff.... as he talks about why he cant have big snakes and eventually any snakes

Lololol.

As for the guy making the tiny **** comments.

I'll put $10,000 cash and we can send pictures to a mutual party, timestamped with our names next to a ruler- that mine is bigger than yours.