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Old 06-14-13, 06:53 PM   #1
arnoldosu1
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Re: Varanus melinus husbandry (help!)

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Originally Posted by varanus_mad View Post
Varanids can survive long periods of time in sub-standard condtions ive know of savs live to be 10 when kept on newspaper however that does not mean it is right nor is it proof of health.

Most dont make it that far and die a slow torterous death i have no doubt had that melinus been kept as above it would of lived much longer.
Really? I have heard that they can survive maybe one or two years in substandard conditions, but 10? That's a long time to show no signs of poor health...if that is true than I could keep a monitor for a good portion of my life and never know that I am torturing him?

It would also mean the majority of monitor owners might have no idea what they are doing raising their monitors?..because how many people really have monitors that are 10+ years old?

I expect that under ideal conditions they could live 15-20 years...maybe more is that correct? Please don't take my questioning this response as an insult...I am not saying you are wrong, just that really is a surprising response. Thanks for the input
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Old 06-15-13, 11:00 AM   #2
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Re: Varanus melinus husbandry (help!)

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Really? I have heard that they can survive maybe one or two years in substandard conditions, but 10? That's a long time to show no signs of poor health...if that is true than I could keep a monitor for a good portion of my life and never know that I am torturing him?

It would also mean the majority of monitor owners might have no idea what they are doing raising their monitors?..because how many people really have monitors that are 10+ years old?
Hi, they don`t need to be 100% fit to live relatively long periods in captivity, and they don`t show ill health to any great degree. Most keepers have a very limited amount of experience and knowledge when they first get them (usually bought on impulse), and wouldn`t know what a healthy/unhealthy monitor looked like anyway).
The Savannah monitor for instance, is usually bought as a first monitor, thousands upon thousands of them die every single year because the conditions offered are so unsupportive (dreadful). They have become "disposable objects".....
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Old 06-19-13, 11:12 PM   #3
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Re: Varanus melinus husbandry (help!)

I've just skimmed over this thread and read bits and pieces here and there, but have a few comments to make. I apologise in advance if I sound curt and rude, for that is not my intent. I'm just short on time and want to save you some heartache and grief.

1. For someone just starting out with monitors that wants a monitor for a bit of a free roaming 'pet', buying a wild caught Indonesian species like melinus is generally not a good idea. Aside from being wild caught (or hatched from eggs from wild caught females), they come from areas of high humidity and tend not to do well long term. They are also fairly shy.
2. You can search through youtube and find all sorts of videos, often from people with nicknames like 'dancingkitty', that support any preconceived ideas you have about how you want to keep your monitor, but that doesn't make them correct. I'd be willing to bet that if you told us you wanted to keep your monitor in a blue bucket with a flower pattern you'd be able to find a youtube video showing someone else keeping their monitor in a blue bucket with a flower pattern. Exciting, but not vindicating. It just means two of you are doing it incorrectly, that's all
3. Regarding the following statement...
Quote:
Originally Posted by arnoldosu1 View Post
Really? I have heard that they can survive maybe one or two years in substandard conditions, but 10? That's a long time to show no signs of poor health.
.. are you sure the monitor showed perfect health and then dropped dead at 10 years of age for no apparent reason? Is it possible that it declined slowly, either internally or externally/visibly, before dying? 10 years is just a number. It doesn't give any indication of the health of the animal. It is also a low number when discussing lifespan of a large monitor species. I've heard many people boast of long-lived monitors under poor conditions, but when I've seen videos of those monitors during their last few years it was obvious the health was deteriorating. A post mortem of that 10 year old melinus would have revealed visceral gout from chronic dehydration. People that own the monitor will invariably say "everything was perfect, then it died", but if everything were perfect the animal would not be dead.

Now, to answer your questions:

Quote:
Originally Posted by arnoldosu1 View Post
if that is true than I could keep a monitor for a good portion of my life and never know that I am torturing him?
Yes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by arnoldosu1 View Post
It would also mean the majority of monitor owners might have no idea what they are doing raising their monitors?
Yes.

I've kept monitors for a fair number of years and have spent a lot of time around assorted monitor forums. Over the years there have been many keepers posting about long-term, free roaming 'pet' monitors dying apparently suddenly, usually at the age of 5-6 years, sometimes longer. The keepers always seem surprised and claim it must have been some congenital condition (which, strangely, doesn't leave the wilds strewn with the carcasses of monitors which have died from similar random-death congenital issues). Almost always it is long term dehydration related issues.
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Old 06-20-13, 05:36 AM   #4
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Re: Varanus melinus husbandry (help!)

Nice to see you again david, any updates or pics for us?
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Old 06-20-13, 03:55 PM   #5
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Re: Varanus melinus husbandry (help!)

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Originally Posted by crocdoc View Post
I'd be willing to bet that if you told us you wanted to keep your monitor in a blue bucket with a flower pattern you'd be able to find a youtube video showing someone else keeping their monitor in a blue bucket with a flower pattern.
Point well taken crocdoc...I will go find a pretty bucket and keep a monitor in it!...haha no but that is why I wanted to discus these things with experienced keepers, so as to not just go by what supports my preconceived notions. It makes the most sense to emulate a monitor's natural habitat as closely as possible...anything else like you said could lead to health concerns and would be selfish on my part. So with that in mind I agree there is no reason to risk poor health or worse death.

Thank you for your input crocdoc, I've seen your name on other forums and such. It would appear you know what you are talking about.
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Old 06-20-13, 11:40 PM   #6
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Re: Varanus melinus husbandry (help!)

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Originally Posted by arnoldosu1 View Post
Thank you for your input crocdoc
You're welcome. I'm glad you didn't take it the wrong way. Have you considered any of the species from slightly drier areas, like gouldii or even panoptes (which, admittedly, are found both in dry and humid areas)? They are not only a bit more tolerant of dry conditions but are also less shy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by smy_749 View Post
Nice to see you again david, any updates or pics for us?
It's winter here, so not much happening with my monitors or the wild ones. This is the time of year I have a break from monitors.
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Old 06-21-13, 12:15 PM   #7
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Re: Varanus melinus husbandry (help!)

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Originally Posted by crocdoc View Post
Have you considered any of the species from slightly drier areas, like gouldii or even panoptes (which, admittedly, are found both in dry and humid areas)? They are not only a bit more tolerant of dry conditions but are also less shy.
I do not know too much about either of those...but I will look into them more. I briefly looked at the varanus panopetes and they seem to be very bold in nature as you said. It also seems that they would do well free roaming part time if they do well in both humid and dry areas, so maybe that would be a good option!

So to answer your question; no I hadn't considered them before, so thanks for the tip! Any place with good info on them that you know of?
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Old 06-21-13, 04:32 PM   #8
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Re: Varanus melinus husbandry (help!)

It depends on what sort of info you are after. There's a guy called Justin in Florida that breeds panoptes on a regular basis. Buying captive bred is always a better idea than wild caught.

They're really bold animals with one hell of a feeding response, so keep that in mind.

They also tripod, which is way cool.
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Old 06-21-13, 10:04 PM   #9
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Re: Varanus melinus husbandry (help!)

Well I was thinking in terms of educational information...but that's definitely useful to know a breeder! I was planning to get a captive bred monitor for sure, I understand how big of a difference that makes, not to mention I'm not a fan of capturing animals from the wild any more than necessary. I appreciate it! When the time comes how could I get in touch with Justin? Does he have a website?

O and I've seen them tripoding, that is pretty cool!
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