Chillin' Like a Villain

[Pirarucu]

Originally Posted by Jeepers

Stress would cause it to fall asleep?

Anyways, I'm not looking to tame it or make it docile, I'm fine with it being the way it is, but everyone needs to work with their reptiles on a daily basis after they've settled in for a while, otherwise you're going to wind up with a problem. If I never ever EVER worked with this crocodilian in my future years of owning it, I'd reckon the first time I did need to pick it up for whatever reason, I'd get the living crap bitten out of me, and it wouldn't be pretty at future sizes, I can guarantee you that. It'd be better for me to WORK WITH IT, and GET TO KNOW IT, than to be dealing with something I don't know crap about because I didn't take the time to learn its queues, its personality, etc. I wouldn't know jack crap about how mine, in particular, behaves, and that's BAD. For that reason, that's EXACTLY why everyone should work with their reptiles DAILY. Big or small, it doesn't matter.

I'd mentioned daily handling prior but did anyone complain about it? No. All they said was let it acclimate first then work with it daily, which is exactly what I'm doing.

Secondly, I don't like bearded dragons. I don't like them. I don't mind looking at them, but they do not appeal to me in the least.

Also, Cuvier's Dwarf Caimans have a nicer demeanor than others.

Stress will cause it to pretend to be asleep. Essentially it is giving up and pretending to be a bump on a log in the hopes that you won't eat it. You see it with monitors all the time when they are forcefully handled. I would recommend the same treatment you would give a monitor, which is to simply leave it alone and let it come to trust you on its own terms. Treat it like a feral cat. Forcefully handling it will just lead to a Nile Monitor Syndrome. Someone buys a Nile and forcibly handles it all the time as a baby, in the hopes that it won't turn mean. Sure enough, it soon realizes that it can't fight back and simply gives up, and the keeper is put under the impression that they have succeeded. Then the Nile gets bigger. Suddenly it has large teeth and claws, plus a bullwhip for a tail, and it realizes now it can fight back, and it does, since all the handling only built resentment towards its keeper. This probably happens with a lot of reptiles, the only reason many are "tame" is that they simply aren't big enough to fight back.

I am friends with a man who owns a Cuvier's Dwarf Caiman, who simply put it in a large cage and left it alone. It is a very tractable animal most of the time.




I do not forcibly handle any of my animals, except if I need them out to clean the cage. If my snakes display any sign of not wanting to come out, I leave them be. Excepting cleaning and such, I only handle my snakes maybe once every other month. They are very calm animals, and are not at all defensive. My retic will come out of the cage on his own to explore, and will go back in when he wants. So no, you do not have to force your animals to like you, and you certainly don't have to handle them every day. In my experience, you really have better results if you don't.

[Jeepers]

Originally Posted by Pirarucu

Stress will cause it to pretend to be asleep. Essentially it is giving up and pretending to be a bump on a log in the hopes that you won't eat it. You see it with monitors all the time when they are forcefully handled. I would recommend the same treatment you would give a monitor, which is to simply leave it alone and let it come to trust you on its own terms. Treat it like a feral cat. Forcefully handling it will just lead to a Nile Monitor Syndrome. Someone buys a Nile and forcibly handles it all the time as a baby, in the hopes that it won't turn mean. Sure enough, it soon realizes that it can't fight back and simply gives up, and the keeper is put under the impression that they have succeeded. Then the Nile gets bigger. Suddenly it has large teeth and claws, plus a bullwhip for a tail, and it realizes now it can fight back, and it does, since all the handling only built resentment towards its keeper. This probably happens with a lot of reptiles, the only reason many are "tame" is that they simply aren't big enough to fight back.

I am friends with a man who owns a Cuvier's Dwarf Caiman, who simply put it in a large cage and left it alone. It is a very tractable animal most of the time.




I do not forcibly handle any of my animals, except if I need them out to clean the cage. If my snakes display any sign of not wanting to come out, I leave them be. Excepting cleaning and such, I only handle my snakes maybe once every other month. They are very calm animals, and are not at all defensive. My retic will come out of the cage on his own to explore, and will go back in when he wants. So no, you do not have to force your animals to like you, and you certainly don't have to handle them every day. In my experience, you really have better results if you don't.

Wow, is that his set up? Those are the kind of enclosures I -dream- of, I love realism and trying to replicate a natural environment as close as possible. He should really tell people how he managed such a beautiful mini-biome.

Anywho, well, ok then. As far as tong feeding, as I said, he doesn't really get it. Would removing feeder fish help the training process because then he would learn that I'm the one that offers food to him and so that he'd be hungry when I do offer it? Usually he has no interest in whatever I offer him, I assume because he's in there sucking up the fish whenever he wants. That's why I think not having feeders in there may improve the tong training process, so he'd be hungry when presented with food.

Also, I think some handling may be necessary, just not on a really frequent basis... Maybe once a week, once every two weeks, etc. I mean, I say this because everyone needs to take their animals to the vet if absolutely necessary(since vet trips stress reptiles a lot, sometimes does more harm than good depending on the situation), and need to pick them up or physically interact with them to clean their habitat. I know one day I'll physically be IN his habitat when he's older, but,(in light of what you and Ladybug said) by feeding regularly I'm sure he'd know I'm not some form of intruder that he needs to wipe out. At best he'd probably think I have food. Even then, he could still get territorial.

Also, Ladybug, if that were the case, what benefit would there be in people keeping things like corns, ball pythons, etc? It's a collection, plain and simple. Plus, you had no clue I would, one day, like to use him for education purposes. I'd love to teach people about animals, especially the ones that are seen as pests/vermin/what have you. Education is important, especially in the reptile business.

[Pirarucu]

Originally Posted by Jeepers

Wow, is that his set up? Those are the kind of enclosures I -dream- of, I love realism and trying to replicate a natural environment as close as possible. He should really tell people how he managed such a beautiful mini-biome.

Without getting into the rest of this thread.. Wish granted.
The ]v[onster has begun!!!!

[Jeepers]

Originally Posted by Pirarucu

Without getting into the rest of this thread.. Wish granted.
The ]v[onster has begun!!!!

Thanks!

All I have to say, reading all the pages and everything, is -wow-. Simply amazing. I'll be sure to study his design front and back when I'm building Ammit's enclosure and come up with some personal implications I can do. I've already got some alterations in mind!