North Western Hot snake vs Non-venomous snakes? - Page 2

**Pareeeee** · 07-09-13, 04:33 PM

Oh and my comment on the eye thing: I believe slit pupils only mean that the animal is nocturnal, and round pupils mean diurnal. Look at boas and pythons, they both have vertical pupils like a rattlesnake does. Since most other snakes in your area are colubrids (which are, for the most part, diurnal) the eye thing may hold true, but I would NOT trust it as a sole means of identification. You would have to get uncomfortably close to a rattler to look at its eyes.

The same trait transfers over to mammals, cats (nocturnal) have slit pupils and dogs (diurnal) have round pupils.

Mark Taylor · 07-09-13, 04:40 PM

I never knew that learn something new every day

**Aaron_S** · 07-09-13, 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ErikBush97

You're 100 percent right. However if I found a species I haven't seen/heard of, I wouldn't really have any way to I.D whether it's non venomous or hot...

I think you're missing the simple solution to this problem.

Take a picture from a distance. Go home and zoom in on the eye.

No point in taking unnecessary risks because you want to get close. Lots of snakes out there. Just walk away.

MDT · 07-09-13, 05:02 PM

Tons of field manuals (Roger Conant's Guide to Eastern species is still the bomb) available to aid the untrained eye.

Read it....Learn it....Live it.....

ErikBush97 · 07-09-13, 05:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Starbuck

there are also vipers in the US without rattles at all, such as copperheads (not necessarily in your area though), and they do have vertical pupils.
Watersnakes (nerodia) can do an excellent job of mimicking venomous species by flattening their heads etc.
Other non-venomous snakes such as corns and kings will rattle their tails to mimic venomous snakes...
And as mentioned, elapids have round pupils and can resemble non-venomous colubrids.

i think your best bet is to know the snakes in your area and be reasonably cautious. thankfully, you (and i) live in the US, not somewhere like australia

And thankfully I live in Oregon specificly. We don't have anything too crazy here

ErikBush97 · 07-09-13, 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aaron_S

I think you're missing the simple solution to this problem.

Take a picture from a distance. Go home and zoom in on the eye.

No point in taking unnecessary risks because you want to get close. Lots of snakes out there. Just walk away.

I'm not going to kiss a snake to see it's eyes... I am not fond of hot snakes so if there was something I found that I couldn't I.D I wouldn't get close to it.

ErikBush97 · 07-09-13, 05:35 PM

ODFW Wildlife Species - Reptiles
Here's a list of reptiles native to Oregon.

SSSSnakes · 07-09-13, 07:24 PM

The OP says in his post that the Diamondback is the only venomous snake in Oregon. Oregon only has two venomous snakes and they are the Northern Pacific Rattlesnake and the Great Basin Rattlesnake. Also it was mentioned that you can ID a Rattlesnake by it's rattle, this is not true. A baby Rattlesnake has only a button, that does not rattle, and a adult Rattlesnake can break off it's rattle and be left with a rattleless tail.

ErikBush97 · 07-09-13, 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SSSSnakes

The OP says in his post that the Diamondback is the only venomous snake in Oregon. Oregon only has two venomous snakes and they are the Northern Pacific Rattlesnake and the Great Basin Rattlesnake. Also it was mentioned that you can ID a Rattlesnake by it's rattle, this is not true. A baby Rattlesnake has only a button, that does not rattle, and a adult Rattlesnake can break off it's rattle and be left with a rattleless tail.

Rattle snakes have their own look, though. And their own behavior. They act like they know that they are dangerous. Anyways, I know what rattle snakes look like and they are only in southern Oregon I think. I'm up by Portland.

**Pareeeee** · 07-09-13, 09:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ErikBush97

Rattle snakes have their own look, though. And their own behavior. They act like they know that they are dangerous. Anyways, I know what rattle snakes look like and they are only in southern Oregon I think. I'm up by Portland.

Only rattler I've ever encountered here in the wild (Massassauga Rattler) didn't act dangerous at all. Just sat there. The whole time. Did nothing.

...a bunch of oriental tourists came along and were holding their KIDS over it, they didn't speak English and it took me a couple minutes to convey to them that it was a dangerous snake...then they freaked out. Luckily for them it just sat there sunning itself without a care in the world...

PS: Animals are known to be encountered outside their apparent range. I suggest studying up on both snakes.

Crashcrashboom · 07-09-13, 10:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ErikBush97

Well.. I mean.. one has rattles o e doesn't. That'd be enough for me to tell the difference. But I was just using bull snakes as an example of how I might confuse two snakes. The only pattern I can remember to stay away from is coral snakes. 'If black touches yellow, it'll kill a fellow'. LOL

"Red on yellow, kill a fellow; Red on black, friend of Jack"
Don't want you to have a nasty mixup. Black on yellow would be a kingsnake.

Amadeus · 07-09-13, 11:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pareeeee

Only rattler I've ever encountered here in the wild (Massassauga Rattler) didn't act dangerous at all. Just sat there. The whole time. Did nothing.

...a bunch of oriental tourists came along and were holding their KIDS over it, they didn't speak English and it took me a couple minutes to convey to them that it was a dangerous snake...then they freaked out. Luckily for them it just sat there sunning itself without a care in the world...

PS: Animals are known to be encountered outside their apparent range. I suggest studying up on both snakes.

Rattlers are fairly calm while cooled down but they become very pissy and active when warmed. A few years ago I was screwing with a timber I found upstate by my mom's house (I had some but limited venomous handling knowledge.) and I was trying to take pictures on a nice warm rock and the little thing got pretty pissed off..... Narrowly avoided a bite to the face...

I sure learned a valuable lesson.

ErikBush97 · 07-10-13, 12:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pareeeee

Only rattler I've ever encountered here in the wild (Massassauga Rattler) didn't act dangerous at all. Just sat there. The whole time. Did nothing.

...a bunch of oriental tourists came along and were holding their KIDS over it, they didn't speak English and it took me a couple minutes to convey to them that it was a dangerous snake...then they freaked out. Luckily for them it just sat there sunning itself without a care in the world...

PS: Animals are known to be encountered outside their apparent range. I suggest studying up on both snakes.

Saying that act like they are dangerous was wrong. I am bad at wording things at times. I haven't seen any wild rattle snakes but there's a reptile store in Portland that has a few rattle snakes and they are always ready to strike. It seems like they are saying 'I am armed! Leave me alone!'. I only got to see one and it was through it's glass enclosure. Really cool snake, but again... I am not into hot snakes. Beautiful snakes either way though.

ErikBush97 · 07-10-13, 12:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crashcrashboom

"Red on yellow, kill a fellow; Red on black, friend of Jack"
Don't want you to have a nasty mixup. Black on yellow would be a kingsnake.

Thanks, man. Back to what I original ly said... I am no good with remembering patterns. We have don't have Coral Snakes here so that's good.

KORBIN5895 · 07-10-13, 12:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ErikBush97

I'm not going to kiss a snake to see it's eyes... I am not fond of hot snakes so if there was something I found that I couldn't I.D I wouldn't get close to it.

If you're close enough to see an eye that is less than a quarter inch in diameter you are probably close enough to get bit. Learn the looks (common color, build and patterns) body and be confident before you head out.