Not fair really but...

[Freebody]

Originally Posted by Reptile_Reptile

the only problem i have with this thread is the oh i give my info for free. free this free that so what if you didnt want to share info then why are you on a forum u know become a herpetologist and get paid for what you know on snakes. it just bothers me when people say they do things for free when compensation is non existent on a forum (usually) and most everyone knows that. baby rant over

I for one have learned in the few years i have been on this earth, it is Always a bad idea to bit the hand that feed you. I for one am always gratefull for any help anyone is willing to give me and have nothing but respect and thoughts of good karma for that person/s who wishes to go out of their way to help somone. I live in a very cut thoat place, that if you not carfull you will get jumped robbed and killed, everyone hear is out to rip you off or get paid for info about somthing you have that could be worth money to somone willing to take it,and no one hear will help you at all, in no way shape form or fasion, so when people like the people hear are so kind hearted to me, i am very happy to acept andy thing to have to offer with open arms. in my honest opinion, you always take for granted the things you have until you no longer have them. my mini rant <

[Feebo]

LOL Here here! J.R., I`m afraid we`re all just so very passionate about the wellbeing of captive snakes that we can barely contain ourselves when we see husbandry practices that we know from years of experience aren`t in the best interest of the snake. Be it in the long run or the short term. As you know I`m totally fed up with getting involved in these sort of situations but for what its worth, regardless of any animosity, regardless of egos and regardless of anyone sounding a bit short in thier posts. He is right. Snakes and fish tanks do not mix well AT ALL and by the time you come to see that as the truth it is, the damage is already done. I would also very very highly recommend that you get your snake/snakes into plastic or wooden vivariums as soon as humanly possible. If I could just use a metephorical example here... If you were to keep a fish in a bowl of water and add a single drop of vinegar to that water each month, that fish may well look absolutely fine. Maybe even for ages and ages (You see where I`m going with this don`t you...) But you know that fish would eventually die right? So you would tell someone like maybe an alien or child or something "you really don`t want to do that!" That fish need not get ill, or die. I`m sure you see my point mate. I promise you, sincerely, fish tanks do snakes damage and even kill them. Even if it seems fine right now. Aaron has probably explained this to people as many times as I have, and he sounds just as irritated by new keepers ignoring the experienced words of us long term keepers as I am. Try to appreciate that mate, honestly we mean no malice or harm, we are purely concerned about snakes and we know our stuff back to front and inside out.

[Feebo]

Freebody, If, at the end of my life I am asked "what was the most important lesson you learned in life?" It would be just that You don`t know what you`ve got until you lose it....

[Reptile_Reptile]

Originally Posted by Freebody

I for one have learned in the few years i have been on this earth, it is Always a bad idea to bit the hand that feed you. I for one am always gratefull for any help anyone is willing to give me and have nothing but respect and thoughts of good karma for that person/s who wishes to go out of their way to help somone. I live in a very cut thoat place, that if you not carfull you will get jumped robbed and killed, everyone hear is out to rip you off or get paid for info about somthing you have that could be worth money to somone willing to take it,and no one hear will help you at all, in no way shape form or fasion, so when people like the people hear are so kind hearted to me, i am very happy to acept andy thing to have to offer with open arms. in my honest opinion, you always take for granted the things you have until you no longer have them. my mini rant <

me too i just dont want to be made to feel bad because you (in general not you in specific) complain about doing things for free. if your going to complain that you do it for free then dont do it cause you obviously dont enjoy it. i do not want to feel like a jerk cause you feel like something you did for free was worth money and want to complain about it

[Reptile_Reptile]

Originally Posted by Feebo

LOL Here here! J.R., I`m afraid we`re all just so very passionate about the wellbeing of captive snakes that we can barely contain ourselves when we see husbandry practices that we know from years of experience aren`t in the best interest of the snake. Be it in the long run or the short term. As you know I`m totally fed up with getting involved in these sort of situations but for what its worth, regardless of any animosity, regardless of egos and regardless of anyone sounding a bit short in thier posts. He is right. Snakes and fish tanks do not mix well AT ALL and by the time you come to see that as the truth it is, the damage is already done. I would also very very highly recommend that you get your snake/snakes into plastic or wooden vivariums as soon as humanly possible. If I could just use a metephorical example here... If you were to keep a fish in a bowl of water and add a single drop of vinegar to that water each month, that fish may well look absolutely fine. Maybe even for ages and ages (You see where I`m going with this don`t you...) But you know that fish would eventually die right? So you would tell someone like maybe an alien or child or something "you really don`t want to do that!" That fish need not get ill, or die. I`m sure you see my point mate. I promise you, sincerely, fish tanks do snakes damage and even kill them. Even if it seems fine right now. Aaron has probably explained this to people as many times as I have, and he sounds just as irritated by new keepers ignoring the experienced words of us long term keepers as I am. Try to appreciate that mate, honestly we mean no malice or harm, we are purely concerned about snakes and we know our stuff back to front and inside out.

you know just my imput here next time explain the trickle effect thing cause i had no idea im actually working on new vivs you can see my various threads on different ideas

[marvelfreak]

Originally Posted by Feebo

Can you put a link to that thread here please Marvel? It was a she was it? Actually lets have a link to Reptile Reptile`s thread in question aswell. So it WASN`T you that was the final straw Reptile Reptile! It was who ever this girl is, and SHE was the one that was rude to me, not you. Sorry about that... I`ve just had a look through all of your posts and I can`t actually find a single instance where I even advised you about anything at all?! All I can find is the yawning python and me congratulating you for going to the vet when it was needed.... Maybe you saw this thread and just presumed it was about you? I didn`t really register the persons name when it happened, it was just another instance of the same old thing happening as a load of others have agreed with. Yeah Chuck I saw she had buggered off almost immedeatly. There`s one person that will fit in just fine on one of the rubbish forums that`s full of trolls i think.......

This was the one i believe that led up to this thread.(final straw of rude people) This was not the first time some one was rude to Feebo either. When all he trying to do is help.
http://www.ssnakess.com/forums/gener...et-python.html

[presspirate]

I for one, have received advice from Feebo, and I do appreciate it. His advice usually comes with a bit of wit and humor. Which I always enjoy. (Even though he comes from a backwards country. )

[Feebo]

The cheeky hillbilly is right

J.R., if this is going to degenerate into an argument I`ll just stop posting, lets just understand that here. Listen very carefully ok, if if don`t understand it when I tell you very carefully, then you`ll never understand and I can only put that down to your tender years. I love helping people with thier new found snake hobby. What I don`t like is being treated with disrespect or utter contempt. My mention of tha fact we do this for free is merley an attemot to make you understand just what you have.I have tried, in vain, to explain this before to people that treat us disrespectfully. You have our years of experience and full attention to draw on, you don`t have to pay us, WE ARE ALL MORE THAN HAPPY TO DO IT FOR FREE. But (and here`s my point, pay attention...) But, why would we wish to continue doing it if we are constantly faced with this attitude? Why would we sit up at all hours helping people with thier problems and explaining to them how to do things properly if we just get spoken to the way you are starting to talk now? Why would anyone want to put up with that? That makes us want to say well you know what? Sod it I can`t be arsed helping an ungrateful, cheeky, argumentative, disrespectful person. But then you have to also understand that that in itself puts us in a VERY difficult situation because at the end of the day, when it comes down to it, it`s not YOU that we care about. It`s the snake you have put yourself in charge of. We see people doing all sorts of silly things with snakes because they just don`t know any better. We try to help out, we are actually ASKED to help out, but if they don`t want to hear "fish tanks are VERY bad for snakes" because they just don`t want to buy a proper VIVARIUM (ESSENTIAL FOR SNAKES) They are just rude, or they just ignore us BUT THEN continue to expect us to help with other things!! Well that just drives us up the bloody wall when we know from the experience we have over the years, that a fish tank is VERY bad for snakes. Fish tanks are for fish. Snakes need a VIVARIUM. J.R..... Mate, please, pretty please with sugar on top, just try to understand that. Put all your annoyances aside, all your presumtions about our motives aside, and understand that we only care about the care and wellbeing of captive snakes and the sort of attitudes we encounter all too often in our collective quest to educate and inform really don`t help matters at all. That is why this thread was started. It was unfortunatly started to inform my fellow experienced herper friends that I have had enough of being treated like crap, I have had enough of arguing! I have had enough of trying to compete with the attitudes of some of the new keepers that only care about themselves and not the poor snake who`s very life depends on thier decision making! If you can`t see my point mate after the reams and reams of text in this thread explaining it time and again in simpler and simpler terms, you never will. This thread isn`t for you to come in and start telling me what I should and shouldn`t be feeling anyway mate to be honest. I`ve started it to say i`ve had enough of arguing and failing to get through to people that just don`t want to listen, and here I am, in that very thread, arguing with someone that doen`t want to listen! I give up mate, I no longer care what you do. I`ve been foolish to spend so much of my precious time trying to help and being treated like sh*t anyway. Do what you want, keep it in a fish tank, keep it in an old fuel tank, whatever you want. I no longer argue with lost causes such as people that refuse to get a snake out of a fish tank. You can all learn the hard way just as kids need to learn the hard way, it`s just such a terrible shame that snakes need to suffer because so many new keepers refuse to listen to experience when entering the hobby. I give up arguing with that sort of ignorance and I give up arguing with you. There`s another lesson in life, never argue with the ignorant, they`ll drag you down to thier own level and beat you on experience.

[percey39]

Originally Posted by Feebo

\ never argue with the ignorant, they`ll drag you down to thier own level and beat you on experience.

Love that one its all to true!!

[marvelfreak]

LMAO iagree.gif So so very true. Sometime they beat so bad with experience it's like a th_nutkick.gif

[Freebody]

LOL its so true.

[Reptile_Reptile]

Originally Posted by Feebo

The cheeky hillbilly is right

J.R., if this is going to degenerate into an argument I`ll just stop posting, lets just understand that here. Listen very carefully ok, if if don`t understand it when I tell you very carefully, then you`ll never understand and I can only put that down to your tender years. I love helping people with thier new found snake hobby. What I don`t like is being treated with disrespect or utter contempt. My mention of tha fact we do this for free is merley an attemot to make you understand just what you have.I have tried, in vain, to explain this before to people that treat us disrespectfully. You have our years of experience and full attention to draw on, you don`t have to pay us, WE ARE ALL MORE THAN HAPPY TO DO IT FOR FREE. But (and here`s my point, pay attention...) But, why would we wish to continue doing it if we are constantly faced with this attitude? Why would we sit up at all hours helping people with thier problems and explaining to them how to do things properly if we just get spoken to the way you are starting to talk now? Why would anyone want to put up with that? That makes us want to say well you know what? Sod it I can`t be arsed helping an ungrateful, cheeky, argumentative, disrespectful person. But then you have to also understand that that in itself puts us in a VERY difficult situation because at the end of the day, when it comes down to it, it`s not YOU that we care about. It`s the snake you have put yourself in charge of. We see people doing all sorts of silly things with snakes because they just don`t know any better. We try to help out, we are actually ASKED to help out, but if they don`t want to hear "fish tanks are VERY bad for snakes" because they just don`t want to buy a proper VIVARIUM (ESSENTIAL FOR SNAKES) They are just rude, or they just ignore us BUT THEN continue to expect us to help with other things!! Well that just drives us up the bloody wall when we know from the experience we have over the years, that a fish tank is VERY bad for snakes. Fish tanks are for fish. Snakes need a VIVARIUM. J.R..... Mate, please, pretty please with sugar on top, just try to understand that. Put all your annoyances aside, all your presumtions about our motives aside, and understand that we only care about the care and wellbeing of captive snakes and the sort of attitudes we encounter all too often in our collective quest to educate and inform really don`t help matters at all. That is why this thread was started. It was unfortunatly started to inform my fellow experienced herper friends that I have had enough of being treated like crap, I have had enough of arguing! I have had enough of trying to compete with the attitudes of some of the new keepers that only care about themselves and not the poor snake who`s very life depends on thier decision making! If you can`t see my point mate after the reams and reams of text in this thread explaining it time and again in simpler and simpler terms, you never will. This thread isn`t for you to come in and start telling me what I should and shouldn`t be feeling anyway mate to be honest. I`ve started it to say i`ve had enough of arguing and failing to get through to people that just don`t want to listen, and here I am, in that very thread, arguing with someone that doen`t want to listen! I give up mate, I no longer care what you do. I`ve been foolish to spend so much of my precious time trying to help and being treated like sh*t anyway. Do what you want, keep it in a fish tank, keep it in an old fuel tank, whatever you want. I no longer argue with lost causes such as people that refuse to get a snake out of a fish tank. You can all learn the hard way just as kids need to learn the hard way, it`s just such a terrible shame that snakes need to suffer because so many new keepers refuse to listen to experience when entering the hobby. I give up arguing with that sort of ignorance and I give up arguing with you. There`s another lesson in life, never argue with the ignorant, they`ll drag you down to thier own level and beat you on experience.

<--- not arguing (at least not trying) and... you know what nvm idc i'm doing my best to learn and live. but dont give mate when you give up they've all won anyways. (this is an edit) and i do understand if you poke around the forum im all over the place trying to find out what i need

http://www.ssnakess.com/forums/gener...nclosures.html

im past that point of ignorance i had a book that told me to do it so i did now im paying the price and so are my snakes. my time of struggling against your advice and that of others came to an end when i first read this thread my rant was one of a stressed me who got irked cause of previously aforementioned (for free rant) this forum already has a spot in my heart and i plan on staying and learning for quite a while if not indefinitely

[presspirate]

Originally Posted by Feebo

The cheeky hillbilly is right

LOL I resemble that remark.

Really, it's not a game of giving up and letting people win. It's more a matter of etiquette. You come on the forums and ask for advice. People willingly give you advice, then you turn around and tell them, that the advice they have given you is s***. Well if you are not going to take, or even consider taking the advice, just say thank you and go away.

[Feebo]

The cheeky Hillbilly is right again
Being as I`m no longer willing to entertain this shash I think the "aforementioned" Hillbilly can speak for me from this point. He seems a wise fellow, if a bit dribbly...

[infernalis]

Bottom line is this.....

People are different, people have different sets of values.. Manners, etc..

One thing that we all need to realize is that in most cases the interest in reptiles may very well be the only common ground we share.

Many of us know it's polite to say "thank you" when someone offers assistance, yet some people do not.

We all know that sometimes we may say to someone "you are doing that wrong" and sometimes the reply will be "great, Tell me how, thanks!" other times the reply will be "no I'm not" or "shut up" or "bubba does it this way" and then there will always be the silent type who just say nothing.

One should never expect gratitude, Enjoy it when it does happen, but forget about it if it does not. Move on and stay constructive.

Something I have seen on too many forums is all the experienced people bonding into a tight group and then a new person comes along and shares different views, was raised with a different set of manners or just asks a question that touches on a sore subject, suddenly the "vets" deem the "noob" unworthy and all hell breaks loose.

Can we please not allow our forum to sink down to that level?

Sure if those new people would spend a while reading the forum, they would save a lot of unnecessary frustration for all involved (how many times does the same questions pop up that was just answered 2 days ago?) but that is never going to happen on any forum or group that is open to the public.

Big age differences also seem to play a role in all of this too. We have to remember that sometimes there may be a generation gap interfering with good communication.

So what it all comes down to is we have to offer our assistance because we want to and never expect any form of gratitude or acknowledgment and then when it does happen it will be a pleasant surprise.