For all the cichlid gurus

[Lizzy]

Something has been puzzling me for a few weeks. First I will share a story with you.

A couple of months ago, I had to move some fish around at work (africans). There was one female (hap Ali) in the tank with a huge mouthfull and when I caught her, out came the fry. Cool! I Quickly got out the mesh baby box and put the 1 cm fry into it, then moved mom into the other tank. One hour later, all the fry were dead. I tested the water and everything was fine. Besides, they were exposed to that water in mom's mouth weren't they?

Why did perfectly fat, healthy, moderately mature fry die in the same water and tank that they shared in mom's mouth? This happened again with another cichlid, except the babies were even bigger! Actually one has survived and is now bossing around a tank of convicts 4 times his size!

Lizzy

[corr]

Oh, that's too bad Lizzy The only thing I can think of is stress from being removed. I think sometimes it's better to put the fry in a completely separate tank with no other fish and lots of cover.

[ash]

umm i think the fry would prefer to be with its parents rather.. its nothing to do with water .. it just that the parent take care of them and possibly even feed them from secretions that r important for their survival. u shud'nt have broken the cycle and u dont really need a breeders net c'z the fry r being protected by the parents that more than enuf. plus the parent r adjusted to this situtation .. my guess is u might have streessed the parent too.

[marisa]

Roomates keep a large group of Africans.

They are no experts mind you and these fish were given to them but what they do is when they see a mother "holding" they remove her from the large tank she shares with the others, and place her in a seperate tank. She lives there until the babies are easily seen swimming around on their own. Then she is removed.

I am not sure about all that "needs the parent" thing because my roomates remove her fairly quickly, and they have about 50 1 inch babies doing great right now. Maybe next time you could try this or someone else with more experience might have a better solution. But that works for them. good luck.

marisa

[Shane Tesser]

This is quite common Lizzy, the fact of the matter is that there is several thoughts as to why this happens. I had it happen several times and i really dont have a clear answer. Infact, to be completely truthful, i dont think anyone does. You can guess and speculate, but it is still one of those great unsolved mysteries, that seems to have a different answer from book to book that you read on the subject. Certain cichlid species do have to have almost constant food when young..which would explain the rapid growth in these species...but i would be hesitant to say that is the answer, as often the young die almost immediately. Stress, yet another possible factor....but? Heart attacks? Im not sold on that as an answer either. A change of water is quite possible as the mothers secretions may provide a certain amount of protection to them. Even a very slight bacterial attack of a young fish can be fatal, as the slim coats on theyre body when born is very thin. Personally, if you want my guess, i would have to say that from what ive learned about egg bearing species is probably the same cause as the deaths of now free swimming fry. That is, the parents of suck species are constantly grooming parasites, and further more...constantly fanning the young. If you remove say a leaf or rock in a tank with eggs...they will always almost 100% die if there is not water movement provided by like an air stone. Now if you consider how fast eggs are attacked with mold, think of it in terms of fairly young fish. They really have no protection, now say if you could provide them in an isolated area with constand oxygen running over them, proventing attacking of the skin, and mucus, i personally think you will see a higher brood success rate. Most breeders use completely bare tanks with lots of oxygen movement. And most of the fish will breed in a rainy season where oxygen content is high. Hope this makes sense...just my 2 cents worth