F/T vs live why do you feed - Page 3

Lankyrob · 07-08-11, 02:03 PM

I have a lovely reptile shop down the road and buy from them - they buy from feeder breeders that they have checked out personally so that they know the conditions the prey are raised in and what they are fed etc

mykee · 07-08-11, 08:19 PM

I feed whatever my snakes will eat.

FeederBreeder25 · 07-09-11, 04:31 AM

Thats a lot of mice in that pic!!!

citysnakes · 07-09-11, 06:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lankyrob

Ball pythons are indian - asf are african - hell of a distance to travel just for dinner

im pretty sure ball pythons are african....

Kayla90 · 07-09-11, 09:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by reptile65

Freezing doesn't actually kill bacteria. All it does is slow the growth of bacteria, but when you warm it up again, the bacteria can still grow and reproduce.

As a former chef student I can actually tell you that when you freeze it, it does in fact kill the bacteria; however, bacteria that cause food borne illness multiply quickest between 4°C and 60°C (40°F - 140°F). This is known as the temperature danger zone and at this temp. you have about 4 hours before it is then consider dangerous. So always make sure you thaw your mice/rat in the refrigerator a day before you plan on feeding your snakes, and make sure not to use something that has been thawing in the fridge for more then 2 days.

stephanbakir · 07-09-11, 09:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by infernalis

I order like crazy from Rodent pro.....

That pic raised my eyebrows :P

Kayla90 · 07-09-11, 09:24 AM

Well okay actually I should say temperatures above 60° kills bacteria. But when you freeze it, it basically prevents any bacteria from growing. It's only once you start thawing that the bacteria will slowly start to grow, and then the more time spent thawing the quicker it starts to grow, but even so as along as you are not in the TDZ (which you have a leeway of about 4hrs) the bacteria shouldn't cause any harm to your snake.

reptile65 · 07-09-11, 06:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kayla90

Well okay actually I should say temperatures above 60° kills bacteria. But when you freeze it, it basically prevents any bacteria from growing. It's only once you start thawing that the bacteria will slowly start to grow, and then the more time spent thawing the quicker it starts to grow, but even so as along as you are not in the TDZ (which you have a leeway of about 4hrs) the bacteria shouldn't cause any harm to your snake.

Exactly. As I said earlier, freezing does NOT kill bacteria. Low temperatures are bacteriostatic, not bacteriocidal.

infernalis · 07-09-11, 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stephanbakir

That pic raised my eyebrows :P

I have 3 more boxes since that picture was taken, I re-use the shipping cartons for storage, I estimate that I feed off close to 10,000 mice/rats a year.

For the record - Most all of my garter snakes eat Pinkies, sometimes up to 5 pinkies in a single meal.. so I thaw out food by the plate loads.

Bacteria?? Snakes have been observed swallowing road kill covered in maggots before.

If one person can honestly step forward and show me one single vet bill attributed to ingested "bacteria" I will eat my words here folks. (not infected cuts or wounds)

Salmonella and botulism effect warm blooded creatures.

The types of parasites we are concerned with here are pin worms, round worms, hookworms and flukes / tapeworms.

These are parasites, not bacteria.

Kayla90 · 07-09-11, 06:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by reptile65

Exactly. As I said earlier, freezing does NOT kill bacteria. Low temperatures are bacteriostatic, not bacteriocidal.

Yes but that doesn't make them any less safe then feeding them live ones, unless the owner is irresponsible. Besides, I really don't many people are going to want to keep thawed mice in their fridge for longer then they need too.

reptile65 · 07-09-11, 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kayla90

Yes but that doesn't make them any less safe then feeding them live ones, unless the owner is irresponsible.

Yes, I know. I was not saying frozen was less safe than live. I believe it is a lot safer than live. I was just trying to clarify the whole bacteria thing.

kellcore · 07-20-11, 07:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by infernalis

I have 3 more boxes since that picture was taken, I re-use the shipping cartons for storage, I estimate that I feed off close to 10,000 mice/rats a year.

For the record - Most all of my garter snakes eat Pinkies, sometimes up to 5 pinkies in a single meal.. so I thaw out food by the plate loads.

Bacteria?? Snakes have been observed swallowing road kill covered in maggots before.

If one person can honestly step forward and show me one single vet bill attributed to ingested "bacteria" I will eat my words here folks. (not infected cuts or wounds)

Salmonella and botulism effect warm blooded creatures.

The types of parasites we are concerned with here are pin worms, round worms, hookworms and flukes / tapeworms.

These are parasites, not bacteria.

Thats why they say dont play with thier poop

kellcore · 07-20-11, 07:40 PM

We actually when we sell to pet stores require them to come and check the rats and the living arrangments and our cages. We have books that note when cages where last cleaned and what rats where in what tanks when. All tanks are sterilized once a month unless there was a sick rat then we clean more frequently. We write down what rat was sick when and what rats came in contact.

I wont sell to a store or to another breeder, or seller unless they check. I like them to know they are healthy happy rats and wont get another rat sick. I have come across a breeder that would freeze a rat if it was sick so he wouldnt have to nurse it back to health. I couldnt believe that they did that as i would never if i fed frozen endanger my snake of that. Who knows what it was sick of and if its airborne.

We actually may have to start feeding frozen so i may be back for advice on something i just never was for.

Kaos · 07-28-11, 10:56 AM

I have not got a snake yet but when i do i will feed frozen because it is illegal to live feed here :P
Something im very happy about

Snakefood · 07-31-11, 04:51 PM

I had read on another website that captive snakes should not be fed a rat/mouse diet exclusively, due to high fat/cholesterol content in "red" meat and the inaility to burn these unused calories could lead to "fatty liver disease". This site said to feed a diet of rabbit pinkies and bird protiens (ie: chicks) with the "occasional" mouse/rat thrown in for variety.

I was wondering what you all thought of that as I am looking at supplying other varieties of "prey types" such as hatchling chicks