Man dies from snake bite... - Page 3

CrotalusR#1 · 12-06-14, 07:55 PM

Quote:

I don't believe it is derailing, and I think it was an excellent post. I'm sorry that a man died. But I think that this is an important issue to discuss, as incidents like this can be potentially damaging for hot keepers, and I was really surprised to see how many hot keepers are apparently ok with this. All the articles I've seen are filled with comments like "no one should be allowed to keep dangerous reptiles as pets" or "snake keeping should be illegal". Whether or not I agree with the religeous beliefs behind the practice is irrelevant. As a reptile owner, this kind of thing makes me worry about the future of reptile keeping, and I while have zero intention of ever keeping hots, it worries me for those who do.

What hot keepers have said they were ok with this? I'm not saying that's not true I am just curious what hot keepers commented on this that you know of?

Georgia · 12-06-14, 09:00 PM

I may get reprimanded for this but im gonna say it bc it needs said.

This situation involves not only freedom of religion but freedom to keep your choice of snakes. Its a lose lose situation here. I neither agree nor disagree with what he was doing...the reason i say that is bc i have no right whatsoever to tell a man how he can practice his choice of faith. Regardless of it hurting our hobby, i feel we have no right as long as it is not hurting innocent bystanders.

pet_snake_78 · 12-06-14, 09:36 PM

Is the snake OK?

Mikoh4792 · 12-06-14, 11:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Georgia

I may get reprimanded for this but im gonna say it bc it needs said.

This situation involves not only freedom of religion but freedom to keep your choice of snakes. Its a lose lose situation here. I neither agree nor disagree with what he was doing...the reason i say that is bc i have no right whatsoever to tell a man how he can practice his choice of faith. Regardless of it hurting our hobby, i feel we have no right as long as it is not hurting innocent bystanders.

Yes you do. You do if it infringes upon the lives of other people. What you do NOT have a right to do, is to make a post on a public forum and tell people to keep their opinions to themselves. No double standards please.

Besides, no one here ever said the man could not free handle his snakes. We are only showing our disagreement of his practices. Let's not confuse two different things.

Freedom of religion(without delving too much into a religious discussion) only goes so far. These practices do hurt other people;those people being us, the reptile keepers. We don't need another example for anti-reptile people to use against us in trying to take away our pets.

**Minkness** · 12-07-14, 12:00 AM

I have to agree with Shann.

Also not a hot keeper, but who am I, or anyone, to tell you not to just because I wouldn't do it.

Where I am, I have no real reptile community let alone for snakes, and all ready have been dealing with anti-snake attitude...and I'm just getting a kingsnake.

As others have said though, the controversy of this thread seems to be that the OP submitted a link they knew would stir others then said keep comments/opinions to ourselves...

This brings up multiple issues all in simple thread...hot keeping, free handling, religious beliefs, and keep your mouth shut....to put it bluntly.

As a forum we should speak freely within the rules of that forum, as a community we should support eachother in oyr combined passion.

<3

Mikoh4792 · 12-07-14, 12:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Minkness

Also not a hot keeper, but who am I, or anyone, to tell you not to just because I wouldn't do it.

I agree. No one here is saying people can't free handle their snakes. We're just showing disagreement. Two different things.

Georgia · 12-07-14, 12:51 AM

The entire point of this thread was to inform on what happened. That simple. The reason i said to keep opinions to yourself is...because i knew it would turn into this. A ridiculously stupid debate about stuff you cant change.

Mikoh4792 · 12-07-14, 01:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Georgia

The entire point of this thread was to inform on what happened. That simple. The reason i said to keep opinions to yourself is...because i knew it would turn into this. A ridiculously stupid debate about stuff you cant change.

So you knew in advance this topic would stir a similar reaction but you chose to do it anyways and on top of that to tell people not to do the very thing you expected of them? I'd say it was a ridiculously stupid post to make.

**Minkness** · 12-07-14, 01:08 AM

Perhaps not the smartest but I can understand the reason. Let's not make this personal.

CrotalusR#1 · 12-07-14, 01:11 AM

Quote:

The entire point of this thread was to inform on what happened. That simple. The reason i said to keep opinions to yourself is...because i knew it would turn into this. A ridiculously stupid debate about stuff you cant change.

Exactly! This thread wasn't made for ever one to debate the mans practice, it was more or less to inform us of what happens. The second Mikoh4792 made his comment this thread was derailed. I personally try not to judge especially without personally knowing the person so unless you personally new this man, saying anything about the man would be arrogant and ignorant. Like Georgia said this man didn't just Handel snake during his sermons but he was also a fellow hot keeper...not saying I agree with the practice but that's not the point of this thread. I feel like knowing he asked us to please keep our opinions to our selves and then to challenge that and go on with ignorant comments was simply immature.... Where not talking about which substrate to use or what's the write temps, where talking about a man who lost his life, a man who had a wife and kids. Can you guys seriously not see this is not the time to debate???

Georgia · 12-07-14, 01:19 AM

Thank you Crotalus... i was not trying to start an argument. It was an informative thread. If you dont like the topic...bypass it and post on a different one.

Mikoh4792 · 12-07-14, 01:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CrotalusR#1

Exactly! This thread wasn't made for ever one to debate the mans practice, it was more or less to inform us of what happens. The second Mikoh4792 made his comment this thread was derailed. I personally try not to judge especially without personally knowing the person so unless you personally new this man, saying anything about the man would be arrogant and ignorant. Like Georgia said this man didn't just Handel snake during his sermons but he was also a fellow hot keeper...not saying I agree with the practice but that's not the point of this thread. I feel like knowing he asked us to please keep our opinions to our selves and then to challenge that and go on with ignorant comments was simply immature.... Where not talking about which substrate to use or what's the write temps, where talking about a man who lost his life, a man who had a wife and kids. Can you guys seriously not see this is not the time to debate???

The point of my post in a way was to derail this thread's intended purpose, which was to post a controversial topic on a public forum and tell people to keep their disagreements to themselves.

Where do I judge this man? I don't. I judge his actions. Where did I make an ignorant comment?

It's sad when a person dies, but as said before reckless and stupid behavior isn't to be excused from criticism. This isn't a funeral and this isn't a family gathering. This is a public forum full of reptile keepers. Criticism is totally appropriate. Why don't I post a news story on a gun forum where a person died from playing russian rulette, tell the forum members to keep to themselves and see how it plays out.

CrotalusR#1 · 12-07-14, 01:34 AM

Mikoh4792, he asked us to pleases keep our opinions to out selves because this thread wasn't made to be a debate. Why couldn't you just bite your damn tung and not reply???... I just can't justify being rude and disrespectful and doing the exact thing he asked us not to do, it's bull **** and ****ing immature.

Mikoh4792 · 12-07-14, 01:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CrotalusR#1

Mikoh4792, he asked us to pleases keep our opinions to out selves because this thread wasn't made to be a debate. Why couldn't you just bite your damn tung and not reply???... I just can't justify being rude and disrespectful and doing the exact thing he asked us not to do, it's bull **** and ****ing immature.

No, let's not sugar coat this with phrases like "asked us to please". You don't go on a public forum, post a contraversial topic which has stirred negative feedback each time, and then tell the forum members to keep their disagreements to themselves. That's not how open discussion works. I could pull up a hundred news stories of people who died within the last week because of rash decisions, where criticism would be perfectly deserved. I don't see what makes this one special. Criticism... is totally appropriate and neither rude nor disrespectful. Had this been a funeral or other private gathering I would have refrained.

**Minkness** · 12-07-14, 01:47 AM

I can surely see Crotalus's point on it being an informational piece. Perhaps it was just the delivery, or words chosen that ruffled some feathers.

What's been said is said though. No point in beating a dead dog. As mentioned this was meant to be informational, not a debate.

lets try and keep our words neutral at least, even if we disagree. Which really, there is nothing to agree or disagree on since it's not intended to be an argument in the first place.