Chillin' Like a Villain

[ilovemypets1988]

hi jeepers, i dont know if you should take the feeders out tbh, simply because he currently has fish on tap upon which he hunts, like he would in the wild.

have you tried "wriggling" tonged food items in the water to simulate a struggling or injured fish, he might get attracted to the vibrations created, id suggest trying that tbh

[Jeepers]

Originally Posted by ilovemypets1988

hi jeepers, i dont know if you should take the feeders out tbh, simply because he currently has fish on tap upon which he hunts, like he would in the wild.

have you tried "wriggling" tonged food items in the water to simulate a struggling or injured fish, he might get attracted to the vibrations created, id suggest trying that tbh

True true... They do need to hunt...

I did try wiggling it, but he didn't really seem overly interested. He eats really healthily on the fish, they disappear quite frequently with a large SPLASH in the water as he snaps them up. I'm thinking he's full even when I try to entice him with a wiggling item.

[ilovemypets1988]

(before i say this, this is gunna sound cruel and wrong but its the only way i think tongs will work), try this:

catch a feeder fish in a net, grab it with the tongs on the tail. this will stress out the fish enough to try to wriggle free and as its his usual food, he should go for it quickly, seeing it as an injured food source

[Jeepers]

Originally Posted by ilovemypets1988

(before i say this, this is gunna sound cruel and wrong but its the only way i think tongs will work), try this:

catch a feeder fish in a net, grab it with the tongs on the tail. this will stress out the fish enough to try to wriggle free and as its his usual food, he should go for it quickly, seeing it as an injured food source

I suppose that could work... The tongs I have shouldn't injure the fish, should he not take it, but it would cause it to squirm a lot, obviously, which may better fit his interests.

[Azrael]

Originally Posted by lady_bug87

Just because you own something doesn't make you qualified to educate others.

Education in this field, as with many other areas, is a matter of telling people what works for you and praying it works for them too. It's not a case of "this is what I do, so this is what you should do". It's, "this is what I do, and it works for me, maybe you should give it a shot". What works for one animal may not work for another, and helping people with their own should always take this into account.

This is a place for the education and general discussion of reptile ownership and care. Not a place for biased and/or opinionated mudslinging. Can we please maintain a professional, educational environment, and leave the silly schoolchild's picking and poking to our personal lives? What one person does with their reptile does not necessarily make them wrong, unless of course the animal suffers somehow from it. So long as the animal is healthy and appears to be generally pleased with their life, as is the case with our Ammit, I fail to see where the problem lies.

Please keep in mind as you read this that I have absolutely no experience with reptiles, and I am not about to try to educate anybody. I am a mechanic, not a vet. I am simply stating that in my eyes, it appears that some of the members of this forum are more content to simply shove their opinion down someone's throat than to try to help them in a friendly, non-opinionated manner. We get enough of that from religious extremists.

I came to this forum to learn about reptiles, but all I have taken away so far is that there are two kinds of reptile owners: the truly helpful and the truly arrogant. I have learned plenty about people, but nothing about reptiles.

[ilovemypets1988]

thats what i was thinking, this way, your doing the feeding and "training" around him and his usual diet and using that to your advantage in the sameway he uses the filter flow to his advantage, kind of, beating him at his own game. if that makes any sense

[Aaron_S]

Originally Posted by Jeepers

So I'm assuming you're calling all alligator/crocodile owners wrong, even the zoos that own them?

Zoos are known to not keep reptiles correctly all the time. So I wouldn't use them as a definite source of knowledge.

I think I just call you wrong.

And no, I did not bite off more than I can chew. I've heard positives from daily handling and I know Wayne knows what he's doing, so if he finds more success with the feeding method(with the LARGE reptiles), then who am I to say it's wrong and I shouldn't try it? I can understand the thought process of,"I'm too small to do anything now." and then,"Now I can defend myself." It makes sense to me and after seeing it in that light, I'd be willing to try the feeding method. Plus, I did take stress into account, that's why I also decided to toss the daily handling and go with frequent handling to still get him used to the idea in case I ever do -need- to handle him. Why would I want to continue handling him and stressing him out? That'd be stupid and an atrocity for me to knowingly continue to stress him out.

Well you definitely did bite off more then you could chew. You have no exerience in how to handle this animal with complete hands off. Maybe you should have learned that so you don't need to handle it ever? I don't handle any animals of mine, never need to. You're lucky you've got a crocodillian who happen to be hardy creatures to keep.

P.S. if you consider savannah monitors large and not a dwarf caimen of same size I would re-check your information....

Also, I'd intended to get training for public wildlife teaching when I was ready. You think I'm some sort of idiot that just takes my animals out without any form of professional training or license and show them off to small children? No, I do not, thanks for assuming crap of me. It takes more than just years of experience to teach the public about wildlife, as in professional training. I happen to have a friend in this business that can help me, so, once again, thanks for assuming things.

Until you actually do it then yes, I'll happily assume you're 'some sort of idiot'. Of course everyone has a "friend in the business to help." Maybe they should have helped you learn how to deal with wild animals with keeping complete hands off?
Again, a caimen isn't for you. Maybe a blue tongue skink. Oh, you probably don't like them either and prefer the "uncommon" and "weird" and "cool" animal to be "different".

Jeez louis, this used to be a friendly community that assisted people as best as possible, but you people are just shooting down people trying to learn. First you want me to try the feeding method, and the moment I say,"Fine, I'll give it a shot," after looking at everybody's remarks on it and thinking on it, you flipping shoot me in the foot. It's a wonder that a lot of the newer members don't just walk out the door with people like you.

You've been here 3 minutes. How do you know what happens around here? If you read enough threads you'll see a lot of people learn things. Most of them just sit back and read first instead of jumping in with both feet then crying when someone points out their foolhardy ways.

[Azrael]

Originally Posted by Aaron_S

Zoos are known to not keep reptiles correctly all the time. So I wouldn't use them as a definite source of knowledge.

I think I just call you wrong.



Well you definitely did bite off more then you could chew. You have no exerience in how to handle this animal with complete hands off. Maybe you should have learned that so you don't need to handle it ever? I don't handle any animals of mine, never need to. You're lucky you've got a crocodillian who happen to be hardy creatures to keep.

P.S. if you consider savannah monitors large and not a dwarf caimen of same size I would re-check your information....



Until you actually do it then yes, I'll happily assume you're 'some sort of idiot'. Of course everyone has a "friend in the business to help." Maybe they should have helped you learn how to deal with wild animals with keeping complete hands off?
Again, a caimen isn't for you. Maybe a blue tongue skink. Oh, you probably don't like them either and prefer the "uncommon" and "weird" and "cool" animal to be "different".



You've been here 3 minutes. How do you know what happens around here? If you read enough threads you'll see a lot of people learn things. Most of them just sit back and read first instead of jumping in with both feet then crying when someone points out their foolhardy ways.

She's been a member for quite some time, she has just been inactive.

And if you must know, she does like blue-tongued skinks.

And who are you to say a caiman isn't for us? I suppose you'd be more than willing to tell us what kind of car to drive, what brand of clothes to wear, and what colour paint we should use for our house too, hmm?

You're nothing more than an arrogant fool whose head is too far in the clouds to see the people you're stepping on. A good day to you, you have caused me to despise this forum.

[Jendee]

I now you just got this animal. handling it often is a bad idea, handling a baby often is a bad idea as well. I agree with the sleeping being stress/fear bc animals especially baby/vulnerable ones "play dead" so they don't get eaten!! your never going to have a "relationship" with your caiman l have this discussion with boa people all the time. they will never enjoy your company or trust you. I see people getting caiman/alligators as the equalivant of people getting tigers and lions lol not pet type animals..professional type animals only.

and P.S a healthy, happy predatory animal will be active and always always feisty!!

[Aaron_S]

Originally Posted by Azrael

Education in this field, as with many other areas, is a matter of telling people what works for you and praying it works for them too. It's not a case of "this is what I do, so this is what you should do". It's, "this is what I do, and it works for me, maybe you should give it a shot". What works for one animal may not work for another, and helping people with their own should always take this into account.

This is a place for the education and general discussion of reptile ownership and care. Not a place for biased and/or opinionated mudslinging. Can we please maintain a professional, educational environment, and leave the silly schoolchild's picking and poking to our personal lives? What one person does with their reptile does not necessarily make them wrong, unless of course the animal suffers somehow from it. So long as the animal is healthy and appears to be generally pleased with their life, as is the case with our Ammit, I fail to see where the problem lies.

Please keep in mind as you read this that I have absolutely no experience with reptiles, and I am not about to try to educate anybody. I am a mechanic, not a vet. I am simply stating that in my eyes, it appears that some of the members of this forum are more content to simply shove their opinion down someone's throat than to try to help them in a friendly, non-opinionated manner. We get enough of that from religious extremists.

I came to this forum to learn about reptiles, but all I have taken away so far is that there are two kinds of reptile owners: the truly helpful and the truly arrogant. I have learned plenty about people, but nothing about reptiles.

Go read most of my posts. You'll see a lot about reptiles. Clearly you read the wrong threads if you aren't learning.

I've got a lot of experience, as do others here. I say things my way and a lot of people have learned from it. I say my piece because I try to stop people who think they are so clever trying to re-invent the wheel when there's CLEAR ways of doing things in a simple, healthy and SAFE way for the animals.

[Jeepers]

Originally Posted by Aaron_S

Well you definitely did bite off more then you could chew. You have no exerience in how to handle this animal with complete hands off. Maybe you should have learned that so you don't need to handle it ever? I don't handle any animals of mine, never need to. You're lucky you've got a crocodillian who happen to be hardy creatures to keep.

Oh, so I guess you refuse to touch yours whenever it would best to take it to the vet? Nice job. And I guess you never inspect them for any kind of problems, either? Wonderful.

As I recall, you don't keep reptiles that get large enough where it would be a problem to put them into your car, so butt out. I can't just transport a huge honking enclosure in the back of my car to the vet.

P.S. if you consider savannah monitors large and not a dwarf caimen of same size I would re-check your information....

They're a larger lizard than most people keep, so in generalization they are considered large, yes, but not as large as some others can get. As I recall, some dwarf caimans can get larger than a savannah.

Oh, you probably don't like them either and prefer the "uncommon" and "weird" and "cool" animal to be "different".

Congratulations on making a complete jerk of yourself and assuming more crap. I totally want to be a weird, different person. That's so what I aimed for in getting him. I'm glad you know so much about me.

You've been here 3 minutes. How do you know what happens around here? If you read enough threads you'll see a lot of people learn things. Most of them just sit back and read first instead of jumping in with both feet then crying when someone points out their foolhardy ways.

Pardon? I've been here since 2011 and read most threads, thanks.

[Aaron_S]

Originally Posted by Azrael

She's been a member for quite some time, she has just been inactive.

And if you must know, she does like blue-tongued skinks.

And who are you to say a caiman isn't for us? I suppose you'd be more than willing to tell us what kind of car to drive, what brand of clothes to wear, and what colour paint we should use for our house too, hmm?

You're nothing more than an arrogant fool whose head is too far in the clouds to see the people you're stepping on. A good day to you, you have caused me to despise this forum.

lol you despise a whole forum because someone doesn't blow smoke up your butt about a bad decision?

You clearly want an animal that you WANT to interact with and that may enjoy it. Caimen are NOT the answer to that. I don't even think you know what you're doing based on the fact you prefer to make a large enclosure more land space than water space. That's a joke and a half. Do some research.

Again, go get a blue tongue skink. I think you'd be happier.

[ilovemypets1988]

hey jeepers, let me know how the tongs on the fish tail works as im interested in the out come.

there are a few people on this planet that interact with larger animals, take lions for example and go look up the name Craig Busch or even just " the lion man" in New Zealand and ull see what i mean.

[Aaron_S]

Originally Posted by Jeepers

Oh, so I guess you refuse to touch yours whenever it would best to take it to the vet? Nice job. And I guess you never inspect them for any kind of problems, either? Wonderful.

As I recall, you don't keep reptiles that get large enough where it would be a problem to put them into your car, so butt out. I can't just transport a huge honking enclosure in the back of my car to the vet.



They're a larger lizard than most people keep, so in generalization they are considered large, yes, but not as large as some others can get. As I recall, some dwarf caimans can get larger than a savannah.



Congratulations on making a complete jerk of yourself and assuming more crap. I totally want to be a weird, different person. That's so what I aimed for in getting him. I'm glad you know so much about me.



Pardon? I've been here since 2011 and read most threads, thanks.

You're a joke.

I don't need to take mine to the vet because I don't have improper husbandry.

No, your animal won't die if you grab it, wrap it's mouth and cover it's eyes and take it the vet in a proper transport carrier. Again, nice try. Do some research.

I used to keep large animals but they no longer fit my lifestyle so I chose a better fit. What a freakin' concept? Actually thinking more about the animal than my own wants!

SOME dawf caimen. I said my piece because it was mentioned that if he wants to use tongs with "LARGE lizards" then it's his decision. I took that as meaning that a caimen isn't a large lizard.

I like making assumptions. I've been here forever and I've seen your kind come and go. It's always the same. "I need to be cool."

Lastly, again, you never read the right threads. Plenty to learn from and if you haven't learned an iota from this forum yet then there's something wrong.

[Jeepers]

Originally Posted by Jendee

I now you just got this animal. handling it often is a bad idea, handling a baby often is a bad idea as well. I agree with the sleeping being stress/fear bc animals especially baby/vulnerable ones "play dead" so they don't get eaten!! your never going to have a "relationship" with your caiman l have this discussion with boa people all the time. they will never enjoy your company or trust you. I see people getting caiman/alligators as the equalivant of people getting tigers and lions lol not pet type animals..professional type animals only.

and P.S a healthy, happy predatory animal will be active and always always feisty!!

Ok then. See, after other people had mentioned the sleeping thing, I'd decided against handling unless necessary and maybe just a unfrequent short one every now and then, should there ever be a time when I need to, but I won't be handling him frequently anymore, I'll leave him to his habitat, maybe get some form of cover for the tank sides facing outwards, because the only time that I catch him sleeping in his tank is after I've been standing around for a moment, trying to find him and check on him, so he's probably just playing dead 'cause he saw me. Otherwise he's always alert and active.