Rat kills all of her pups?

[Zoe]

The trampled/injured baby rats seems to me like too small of a cage and not enough substrate to make an adequate nest.

The babies werent' trampled or injured, they had bites through their backs and necks and legs ripped off with guts coming out. I've checked around, the size is fine and only 1.1 rats live in it (its a giant litter box thing), and they have tons of subtrate.

Zoe

[reptilesalonica]

...*and i was thinking start breeding rats to avoid such problems...*
~Greg~

[Lisa]

If the mother rat is too weak to nurse she will kill them off. what are you feeding her?

[Zoe]

They eat a mix of dog food, cheerios and other cereals, peas and beans, some nuts, and rodent mix.

Zoe

[reptilesalonica]

dog food is for dogs. Am i wrong or rodents must not eat so rich food?
~Greg~

[Lisa]

what kind of dog food? otherwise the diet looks good. we had problems when we put our rats on mainstay. they weren't as plump, had smaller litters, were dirtier and as well our mice did terrible on the same food (they went canibalistic).

[Zoe]

Lisa, it's the brand Linds suggested, I don't remember what it is. It came in a big bag, I think it was red?

Zoe

[Lisa]

Originally posted by reptilesalonica
dog food is for dogs. Am i wrong or rodents must not eat so rich food?
~Greg~

here some dog food has NO meat in it. there is a post where i compared the ingreadients of dog food and mazuri rat chow (#6 i think) they were almost identical. Also rats and dogs are omnivores and eat just about anything just like bears and humans.

We give our rats Super C dog food. it's about $11 canadian for a 16kg bag. that's less then $1CAD/kg. feeds about 80 rats and a couple handfuls of mice for 2 weeks or so. if you look at http://rats.lexxdog.ca you can see how big our rats are. one of our biggest is about 720g.

[reptilesalonica]

says The page cannot be found
Dogs are not omnivorous, they are carnivorous. Dogs don't eat fruits or veggies. Mostly meat. They are hunters. Rodents just eat whatever you offer to them, that not means that we must offer them meat. I don't know about those dog cans though...
~Greg~

[Zoe]

http://rats.lexxdog.com is the proper URL.

Dogs in the wild eat whole animals, greg, which means they also benefit from the vegetation that their prey (dear, rabbits, whatever) feed on (much different than eating a slab of meat). Besides, fruits and vegetables offers obviously beneficial nutrients and vitamins that aren't necessarily found in meat. Why deprive them of that, because they are carnivores?

No, you don't have to offer a rat meat, but once again, meat has many things (protein and fat, for example) that isn't necessarily found in all fruits and vegetables, so why deprave rats of that?

Same as with leopard geckos... they don't eat from dishes of calcium or eat dusted bugs, but if calcium and vit powders can offer much needed supplements, why feed them bugs alone?

Zoe

[paul_le_snake]

whatever ppl think rats should be fed or not. i have seen many females kill their pups. the only thing i have noted is that it only happens in the summer when room and cage temps can get too hot. some females i work with have litters of 15-20. some produce hairless. some dont produce any. the only thing i feed mine is a lab quality chow, just for rodents. it has everything in it that the rats need.
cheers
paul

[reptilesalonica]

Dear Zoe,
Dogs in the wild eat whole animals as you said, eat meat.
Veggies or fruits are not beneficial when they are not eaten fresh AND with the peel (for the fruits). All vitamins and minerals are in the peel. Throwing the peel we throw all the vitamins away. With that logic, cows don't have to eat grass, they can eat meat...
Btw, giving meat to rodents their poops smell realy bad.
~Greg~

[Zoe]

I said they eat whole animals, which is far different than eating a steak. They are eating, in essence, half digested plant matter.

So you're saying a piece of dried has aboslutely NO nutritional value whatso ever? And what rice, which is great for dogs, along with eggs and other vegetables.

With that logic, cows don't have to eat grass, they can eat meat...

I don't see how you came up with that? Wolves are made to eat meat just as they are made to eat the innards of their prey (half digested vegetable matter). If they ate muscle matter only, don't you think they'd be lacking?

I'm sure vegetarian human feces don't smell as strongly, but that doesn't mean its as healthy as eating meat (in proportion, of course).

Zoe

[reptilesalonica]

I said they eat whole animals, which is far different than eating a steak. They are eating, in essence, half digested plant matter.

Half diggested plant matter as you say, is NOT plant or veggie.
As i said B4 veggies & fruits are beneficial ONLY when they are eaten fresh.
'

And what rice, which is great for dogs, along with eggs and other vegetables.

Now you are telling me that eggs are veggies...!...!
rice is good for them but conducted with meat. Dogs cannot live healthy by eating only rice, whereas, eating only meat they can live healthy.

If they ate muscle matter only, don't you think they'd be lacking?

NO, they don't dear zoe...cause they are MADE to eat basicaly MEAT....
'

I'm sure vegetarian human feces don't smell as strongly, but that doesn't mean its as healthy as eating meat (in proportion, of course).

Ok...please poop and leave it in your room...
If the next hour don't that smell drop you unconsious, then don't reply to this message...
Because you-me-they-all, use the flusher it doesn't mean that ours don't smell bad...they hell a LOT smell bad!
~Greg~

[Zoe]

Half diggested plant matter as you say, is NOT plant or veggie.

Well, it isn't meat, either. It is still the fiber of the grass or whatever the animal ate, which IS plant matter. It certainly isn't meat or rock or wood.

Now you are telling me that eggs are veggies...!...!

No I didn't. I mean OTHER vegetables, as in other than RICE. Bad wording, perhaps, but why point out something so obvious?

NO, they don't dear zoe...cause they are MADE to eat basicaly MEAT....

Greg please don't call me dear. So a wolf or dog would survive without calcium?

Ok...please poop and leave it in your room...
If the next hour don't that smell drop you unconsious, then don't reply to this message...
Because you-me-they-all, use the flusher it doesn't mean that ours don't smell bad...they hell a LOT smell bad!

I'm not sure I understand the relevance? I didn't say vegetarian feces smelled good, but that I doubt they smell as bad as of those who eat a lot of meat?

rice is good for them but conducted with meat. Dogs cannot live healthy by eating only rice

What do you mean by conducted with meat? Obviously, Greg, dogs aren't going to survive eating apples and rice. But you are saying that they pull NO benifit, WHATSOEVER by eating anything other than muscle meat.

Zoe