Champagne pricing?

[Albert Clark]

Originally Posted by Aaron_S

I believe this to be misinformation. I am friends with the largest breeder of champagnes in Canada and I've never seen it in one of his animals or has he mentioned it while I've been over.

This is absolutely true and not misinformation. The facts are taken from OWAL reptiles genetic web page. One that is reputable and known worldwide. You can peruse the info @ www.owalreptiles.com>issues

[Albert Clark]

As a matter of fact champagne X champagne breeding is known to be a lethal combo. Super Champagne is considered lethal. As is Champagne X spider.

[Albert Clark]

Issue
Spider Wobble
Woma Wobble
Hidden Gene Woma Wobble
Champagne Wobble
Super Sable Wobble
Powerball Wobble
Sable x Spider Difficult to hatch, severe wobble
Champagne x Hidden Gene Woma Severe wobble
Champagne x Spider Lethal
Pearl Normally Lethal
Super Champagne Lethal
Desert Female fertility issues
Caramel Albino Kinking and female sub-fertility
Super Cinnamon/Super Black Pastel Duckbill & rare kinking
Super Lesser Platinum/Super Butter Bug eyes
Lesser Platinum x Piedbald Small Eyes
Banana/Coral Glow Males produce weird sex ratios
Homozygous Spider Mysteriously non-existent

Wobble/Neuro: owalreptiles/issues... This info taken from the OWALREPTILES genetic issues page.

[Albert Clark]

Originally Posted by Eragon3

Thank you guys! I pick him up tomorrow with a complete health guarantee. I'll be sure to post pictures

That's great Er! I was only putting it out there so you can be forewarned and armed with information that is credible and documented by ball python genetic experts. I hope your guy is fine and you enjoy him for many years to come. Good luck.

[Albert Clark]

This. www.owalreptiles.com>issues

[RAD House]

I am under the impression that while the other genes you listed have been reported to have a wobble it is not nearly as prevalent as in spiders, with the exception of woma. Meaning there are fewer offspring displaying symptoms and to a much lesser degree. That being said you should avoid breeding two morphs connected to the wobble because the offspring are more likely to have a severe wobble not because it lethal, at least in my opinion.

[JellyBean]

Did you get him home yet??
Don't forget the pics

[Aaron_S]

Originally Posted by Albert Clark

This is absolutely true and not misinformation. The facts are taken from OWAL reptiles genetic web page. One that is reputable and known worldwide. You can peruse the info @ www.owalreptiles.com>issues

I stand slightly corrected. I spoke with my friend again he mentioned he's had 2 in his collection with a mild wobble. He's still has bred dozens and dozens of champagnes.

Other people report other things.

Originally Posted by Albert Clark

As a matter of fact champagne X champagne breeding is known to be a lethal combo. Super Champagne is considered lethal. As is Champagne X spider.

In fact, this came up after one person tried to produce one. My friend again did the breeding and produced a thriving baby. I believe the male has bred too.

I can't find a picture though at this time on the forums. However, since it's one or two babies at this time I wouldn't consider it more than worth looking into further breedings.

I simply don't like that website, or people in general, label genetic defects with only one or two breedings.

[dannybgoode]

Originally Posted by Aaron_S

I stand slightly corrected...

Is this a first?!

[Minkness]

Lol probably

[Albert Clark]

I simply don't like that website, or people in general, label genetic defects with only one or two breedings.
_______

Reply: There are many more than a just a couple of reported cases of champagne X champagne eggs either never hatching and dying in the egg. It's always better to pair a champagne with a completely different morph. The champagne is a codom gene that goes very well with almost anything besides itself, spider, hgw, woma, sable and super sable and also powerball.

[Albert Clark]

I have NOT done it because I think I know better and i think it is a FAIL. The Champagne does not combo well with several morphs such as HG Woma, Woma, Spider... I think Sable...... I have a bad feeling about it and I am going to avoid it.

I have made enough gimpy HG Woma x HG Woma to know better!!! Excerpted.from Kevin McCurley from NERD...In response to the question of breeding Champagne x champagne...

[Aaron_S]

Originally Posted by dannybgoode

Is this a first?!

Shh, don't tell anyone. I've got a reputation to uphold.

Originally Posted by Albert Clark

I simply don't like that website, or people in general, label genetic defects with only one or two breedings.
_______

Reply: There are many more than a just a couple of reported cases of champagne X champagne eggs either never hatching and dying in the egg. It's always better to pair a champagne with a completely different morph. The champagne is a codom gene that goes very well with almost anything besides itself, spider, hgw, woma, sable and super sable and also powerball.

1. It's an incomplete dominant gene, it is not co-dominant.

2. Show me all these breedings. I've followed the ball python world pretty extensively over the past 2 decades. In particular, I've seen many morphs and the documentation of first time breedings. I know super champ was tried a few years ago by one breeder and as soon as it didn't live everyone made up their mind.
Corey Woods then did it (probably the second biggest producer of Champagnes in the world) and he got 1 out of 2 to thrive from only a couple clutches. So it wasn't like he bred everything together.
As I stated, it's not enough to say one way or other, it simply means more information is needed.

Originally Posted by Albert Clark

I have NOT done it because I think I know better and i think it is a FAIL. The Champagne does not combo well with several morphs such as HG Woma, Woma, Spider... I think Sable...... I have a bad feeling about it and I am going to avoid it.

I have made enough gimpy HG Woma x HG Woma to know better!!! Excerpted.from Kevin McCurley from NERD...In response to the question of breeding Champagne x champagne...

McCurley is a theif, a hack, a liar and not to be very bright. He's been shown to not understand genetics or what he's really doing by actual scientists who deal with genetics as a day job.
I'll given Kevin credit for what he built and some of his business decisions but otherwise he's simply not very bright when it comes to the actual genetics.

He has claimed that two genes got "stuck" together from one breeding. That's not how genetics work.

For record of a liar, he's also the guy that said the only way to make soul suckers is to use HIS "hidden gene lessers" (which were 3 times as much as any regular lesser) which in reality people proved a hidden gene woma bred to any lesser produces soulsuckers. (he also stated it wouldn't reproduce itself but it in fact does)

[Albert Clark]

18 out of 18
DESCRIPTION
We haven't got any description for Champagne

Do you want to write a text? Contact us for more information.
MUTATION
Basic morph
GENETICS
CO-DOMINANT
Champagne
FIRST PRODUCED
2005
EB Noah
Is this information incorrect?
AKA
Puma
RELATED MORPHS
CHAMPAGNE ENCHI GHOST
PASTEL CHAMPAGNE BANANA
CHAMPAGNE MOJAVE HET RED AX...
CHAMPAGNE ENCHI SUPER PASTEL
ACE BALL
GENETIC WIZARD
Use this morph as:

Male
Female
Ball pythons morphs for sale
Alu Racks
Dynasty Reptiles
Xclusive Snakes
Kickballs
RepStylin

[RAD House]

Co dominant is an inaccurate hobby term that is synonymous with incomplete dominant, a genetic term that much better describes the gene behavior. Some say co dominant is short hand for incomplete dominant but that doesn't make much sense.