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Old 01-06-15, 02:13 PM   #16
CosmicOwl
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Re: Oook where do I have to go to legally own a paleosuchus palpebrosus? (dwarf caima

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Off subject of reptiles but I was brutally attacked in the face by a "family" pitbull and did nothing to provoke it when I was just a small girl. The dog was not abused and grew up in a great home. If no one was there it would've killed me. Look up dog bite stats for the US. Why do pitbulls hold the majority for maimings, bodily harms and deaths to humans but yet make up a small percentage of the US/Canada dog population. ? Check out dogsbite.org. I am sure that there are very sweet pitbulls that would never do such because I've meet them but I still exercise more caution with this breed as well as A few others. We all recognize certain kinds of snakes to be more aggressive/nippy than others why is it any different for certain dog breeds? I don't advocate for an entire ban on the breed because they have the potential to be great animals, I just don't think it's a great idea that a prone breed can be obtained by anyone.
There is a fundamental flaw with your logic. We do acknowledge that certain species(all dogs are the same species) of snakes are more aggressive, but we also acknowledge that individual snakes can have their own personalities. Most corn snakes are docile, but sometimes you get one who is a complete maniac that bites anything that enters it's cage. Some individual dogs are going to do unpredictable and violent.

The dog bite statistics are another thing. I don't know the veracity of the statistics. However, there is a flaw with the idea of tracking the dog bite statics of "pitbulls." That isn't a breed of dog, it's a vague term used to described a variety of dogs that "look" like pitbulls. I have two dogs that aren't pitbulls but look very much that way. If somebody saw them on the street, they probably be labeled pitbulls. And if they attacked somebody, they'd definitely be considered pitbulls(because people and the media are biased against these dogs).
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Old 01-06-15, 02:37 PM   #17
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Re: Oook where do I have to go to legally own a paleosuchus palpebrosus? (dwarf caima

I would be very interested to know the numbers of these pit bull attacks that were trained fighting dogs. I find it disturbing that the author feels free to qualify the shepherds and other working dogs have a purpose to their bite. American Pit Bull Terrier is a recognized breed by the AKC separate from the American Staffordshire Terrier.
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Old 01-06-15, 02:46 PM   #18
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Re: Oook where do I have to go to legally own a paleosuchus palpebrosus? (dwarf caima

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I would be very interested to know the numbers of these pit bull attacks that were trained fighting dogs. I find it disturbing that the author feels free to qualify the shepherds and other working dogs have a purpose to their bite. American Pit Bull Terrier is a recognized breed by the AKC separate from the American Staffordshire Terrier.
I also wonder if those "pitbulls" being bred irresponsibly and raised by irresponsible owners had anything to do to contribute to the numbers.
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Old 01-06-15, 02:54 PM   #19
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Re: Oook where do I have to go to legally own a paleosuchus palpebrosus? (dwarf caima

I thought this thread was about snakes... not a debate about dogs.
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Old 01-06-15, 02:57 PM   #20
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Re: Oook where do I have to go to legally own a paleosuchus palpebrosus? (dwarf caima

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I thought this thread was about snakes... not a debate about dogs.
More than one discussion can go on in a single thread.
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Old 01-06-15, 03:05 PM   #21
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Re: Oook where do I have to go to legally own a paleosuchus palpebrosus? (dwarf caima

I was being semi sarcastic. It's such a huge topic and people feel so differently about it. It's really difficult to have a civil conversation on this. which is too bad sometimes.. I love all dogs and believe its mostly on training and the owner, but some dogs, even little teacup dogs, are just not people friendly..
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Old 01-06-15, 03:10 PM   #22
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Re: Oook where do I have to go to legally own a paleosuchus palpebrosus? (dwarf caima

Agreed. I love pitties. But also know I am not a good owner of one. I know this about myself, but not everyone does, and that's when things get out of hand. -shrugs-
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Old 01-06-15, 03:16 PM   #23
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Re: Oook where do I have to go to legally own a paleosuchus palpebrosus? (dwarf caima

The difference between snakes and dogs is soo different. Dogs have a social hierarchy and will assign themselves to the pack, if there isn't any leadership, they can get out of control. Snakes don't have this at all, if there's a leadership role in their lives it would only stress them out because they aren't social. so to compare snakes to dogs is a LOT different and wildly inaccurate.
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Old 01-06-15, 03:24 PM   #24
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Re: Oook where do I have to go to legally own a paleosuchus palpebrosus? (dwarf caima

I think it was more of a comparison to different behaviors and personality not an actual comparison of social being.

So sating a carpet python has a tendency to nip, would be the same as saying so do dachshunds.

Saying a BP is chill would to say that a golden retriever makes a good family dog.

Or, saying that a responsible owner who has a known nippy snake will yake certain precautions to prevent the snake nipping a child. As should a dog owner, ect.
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Old 01-06-15, 04:39 PM   #25
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Re: Oook where do I have to go to legally own a paleosuchus palpebrosus? (dwarf caima

Also part of the discussion here has to do with responsible and legal ownership of animals. This is the same whether you own dog, snake or caiman.
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Old 01-06-15, 04:45 PM   #26
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Re: Oook where do I have to go to legally own a paleosuchus palpebrosus? (dwarf caima

Very much agreed. =)
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Old 01-06-15, 04:49 PM   #27
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Re: Oook where do I have to go to legally own a paleosuchus palpebrosus? (dwarf caima

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Originally Posted by Cmwells90 View Post
The difference between snakes and dogs is soo different. Dogs have a social hierarchy and will assign themselves to the pack, if there isn't any leadership, they can get out of control. Snakes don't have this at all, if there's a leadership role in their lives it would only stress them out because they aren't social. so to compare snakes to dogs is a LOT different and wildly inaccurate.
^ This. Pitbulls are amazing dogs. Loving canines, loyal to the end. They will do anything to please their owners, and in the right hands, that makes them one of the best companion dogs, however, they ARE NOT for everyone, and that is one of the biggest mistakes people make.

They are a dog that 100% needs a social structure with you at the top, otherwise things can and probably will get ugly, I've seen it happen before, and have seen the mauled victims as a result of a pitbull who decided she was the leader.

I had a pitbull. I do now, but not the same one. This pitbull, Zoey, was my best friend. I had her for years before it was time to move out. We lived happily, shared many good and bad memories. The only place that accepted most of my pets was an apartment that, however, was strictly not pitbull friendly. Being that I loved her, I kept her at my mom's, who lived about 5 minutes away. That way I could still visit her, take her to the dog park, etc.

It was a horrible mistake I made, and I still do not forgive myself. I should have taken her and just hid her, maybe things would of ended for the better... Keep in mind she had lived in this house for years with the victims, and was even around as they were raised from baby to adult.

So, a few months later my mother came home to a mauled cat. Milly, a kitten we rescued and my mother kept in memory of her Himalayan that passed from a tumor and being too old to safely operate. No dogs had blood or fur on them or around their mouths. We didn't want to automatically assume it was the pitbull.

Another month, another cat. This time it was Sable, a cat I raised and she later took to my mother, soon becoming her most beloved cat and the only animal she permitted to stay for hours in her bedroom. Same thing, no indicators of who did it.

Now, for a while we suspicioned it was one of her 3 pugs, at the time, as she was in the laundry room when she heard a commotion down the hall. The door to the laundry room had blocked Zoey from being a part of the commotion, meanwhile Princess initiated an attack against one of her cats and cornered him, and the others followed suit. She was then closely watched and confined when not supervised to see if it changed anything.

Well, one night they were letting everyone out to the back yard to have their final potty break for the night. My stepfather went to let everyone back in when he heard a squalling. He thought maybe Queenie(the eldest pug, leader of the other pugs, and 'second child' to my mother) was stuck under the porch. He pulled out the light on his cell phone to find Zoey with Queenie in her mouth, by the stomach, thrashing her side to side like a ragdoll. He tried to beat Zoey off, but she wouldn't let go. She finally let go when his bulldog rammed her and chased her down the yard. Queenie's blood pressure wouldn't stabilize at the emergency vet, and she later passed that night. Zoey was taken back to the humane society, after many years, and we were promised she would find an animal free home.

It was a mistake I still regret. I wish I had done things differently.. Since I was not a regular, constant part of her day, as leader, she assumed the leader role, as my mother is not the leader of her dogs. She does not place leadership on them, she's not that kind of person. I still miss her, despite what happened... and hope she had a second chance.

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Old 01-06-15, 04:59 PM   #28
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Re: Oook where do I have to go to legally own a paleosuchus palpebrosus? (dwarf caima

I started crying reading this....

And again...love em...but know they are not for me.

Sorry for your many losses.
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Old 01-06-15, 05:04 PM   #29
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Re: Oook where do I have to go to legally own a paleosuchus palpebrosus? (dwarf caima

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I started crying reading this....

And again...love em...but know they are not for me.

Sorry for your many losses.
Thanks... Admittedly I took Sarge in from the streets, hoping I'd fill the void... but he's nothing like my girl. I've, however, grown to love him for who he is. A big ol' lovable lug who just wants a lot of hugs and cuddles. As I told you in private, we think someone may of beaten him into his.. not so smart state.. as he has an extreme fear of belts. No one ever claimed him, so either that person just didn't bother to look online or at the local humane society(where we reported him found), or they simply didn't want him and kicked him out. Who knows... and I know I will never make that mistake ever again, no matter how 'dumb' or sweet he may act.

Admittedly, I still feel my heart drop when I see a dog that looks like her... and match photos to see if that's her, so I at least have closure that she got another chance.. or maybe even be reunited, risky though that may be... but I have not had such luck, yet, finding my old friend...

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Old 01-06-15, 05:06 PM   #30
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Re: Oook where do I have to go to legally own a paleosuchus palpebrosus? (dwarf caima

This is my friend Jacque's dog. He has an amazing story to tell.
Ray, Kanab, UT | I'm Not a Monster
'Vicktory dogs' travel road to rehabilitation seven years later ? Metro
If you are on Facebook he has his own page where you can follow his progress. Ray the Vicktory Dog
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