Natural plants/sticks vs fake

[Aaron_S]

Originally Posted by formica

lots of people do. infact some of us believe that we have a responsibility to provide as much enrichment as possible for captive animals, its not just about looking nice.

Son, when you can prove to me that ball pythons need enrichment and actually get something from it I will listen to your point.

I breed them. In bins. I have animals almost 3 times older than my kid. Enrichment is not needed.

[drumcrush]

Originally Posted by Aaron_S

Here's a question for you, if it can't be exact like their nature then why even try? To make yourself feel better about keeping it?

My point is simple. Balls live in TERMITE mounds in the wild. If you have plants, grapevines and other things in their then you're not even close to what their natural habitat is.

My first post was just being cheeky because I am awesome like that.

I try because trying is worth something. not necessarily to me, but to the animal.

[formica]

Originally Posted by Mellik's mamma

it made me realize i probably don't have the time for this :/

Its not as much work as I may have made it sound! its well worth the effort, the effect is beautiful from a display point of view. look up bio active substrates, to see what might be involved, its not hard i promise!

bio active enclosures are far less work than sterile enclosures, except for the initial setup. but once it has got up and running, you dont need to clean all the time, disinfect, throw away substrates, pick up poop and urates, the plants keep a good level of humidity, so no having to spray all the time, live moss will provide nice natural damp hides for the snakes to shed.

plants provide good cover for snakes, they can hide amongst them, crawl over them to explore, drink water droplets from them, sleep amongst the roots or among the leaves. growing plants provide an ever changing environment to explore, they provide stability for humidity levels, they help absorb nutrients (ie waste) from the snake to keep the enclosure clean.

there are too many reasons not to do bio active enclosures do it!

Originally Posted by Aaron_S

Son, when you can prove to me that ball pythons need enrichment and actually get something from it I will listen to your point.

I breed them. In bins. I have animals almost 3 times older than my kid. Enrichment is not needed.

someone younger than me, calling me ''son'', is a little insulting, from a British perspective.

[Aaron_S]

Originally Posted by formica

Its not as much work as I may have made it sound! its well worth the effort, the effect is beautiful from a display point of view. look up bio active substrates, to see what might be involved, its not hard i promise!

bio active enclosures are far less work than sterile enclosures, except for the initial setup. but once it has got up and running, you dont need to clean all the time, disinfect, throw away substrates, pick up poop and urates, the plants keep a good level of humidity, so no having to spray all the time, live moss will provide nice natural damp hides for the snakes to shed.

plants provide good cover for snakes, they can hide amongst them, crawl over them to explore, drink water droplets from them, sleep amongst the roots or among the leaves. growing plants provide an ever changing environment to explore, they provide stability for humidity levels, they help absorb nutrients (ie waste) from the snake to keep the enclosure clean.

there are too many reasons not to do bio active enclosures do it!




someone younger than me, calling me ''son'', is a little insulting, from a British perspective.

You're welcome to take it as you like Son.

Maybe when you grow up I will stop calling you that.

[Aaron_S]

Originally Posted by drumcrush

I try because trying is worth something. not necessarily to me, but to the animal.

Actually on the contrary. All scientific facts would prove you wrong.

If you don't like science then how about all the snakes living in bins for the past decade or more? Obviously it means nothing to them.

That's a different argument though so I'm done because what you think doesn't hurt the animal.

[formica]

not everyone gets their scientific facts from the side of a box of cereal.

[drumcrush]

Originally Posted by Aaron_S

Actually on the contrary. All scientific facts would prove you wrong.

If you don't like science then how about all the snakes living in bins for the past decade or more? Obviously it means nothing to them.

That's a different argument though so I'm done because what you think doesn't hurt the animal.

do you think snakes are going to straight out say "I hate living in bins?" I dont think so. I give my animals the choice to climb around and explore or just chill if they want, an oportunity they don't really have in bins. I give them this choice. This is my way. If you keep yours in bins, then cool. That is your way.

[Terranaut]

I have to agree with Aaron here. The snake is not intelegent enough to know what is natural and what is not. I would think neither a tub nor a nice natural viv is like their natural habitat. But that being said if you do a natural viv for you and to display your snake then cool. I like display vivs as well.


As far as being insulted by being called "son" please...I have seen much worse from you than this.

[smy_749]

That is Ghana...

BP's do leave the termite mounds, and have been spotted in areas other than inside termite mounds. Just sayin...

As far as needing or not needing enrichment, don't know, don't care. I like display vivs, but I like them for selfish reasons.

[formica]

Originally Posted by Terranaut

I have to agree with Aaron here. The snake is not intelegent enough to know what is natural and what is not. I would think neither a tub nor a nice natural viv is like their natural habitat. But that being said if you do a natural viv for you and to display your snake then cool. I like display vivs as well.


As far as being insulted by being called "son" please...I have seen much worse from you than this.

when have i insulted someone? disagreeing with an opinion, is not an insult. i'm not perfect, i get annoyed, but i am not insistently rude every time someone disagrees with what I say.

[lady_bug87]

Originally Posted by formica

when have i insulted someone? disagreeing with an opinion, is not an insult. i'm not perfect, i get annoyed, but i am not insistently rude every time someone disagrees with what I say.

No you're self-righteous, condescending, and full of unearned hauty derision.

[lady_bug87]

Getting back to the enclosures and the question I keep multiple species some I keep in bins and some I keep in display enclosures. My boas all live in bins my green tree lives in a planted vivarium. My pit lives in a very boring tank set up

What's better generally depends on the animal. I have some that are too defensive to live comfortably in display enclosures hence the bins

[formica]

Originally Posted by lady_bug87

No you're self-righteous, condescending, and full of unearned hauty derision.

i've been keeping reptiles nearly as long as you have been alive. dont tell me about 'unearned'. the only time i condescend, or deride people, is when they are insulting and take my difference of opinion as a personal insult. i give what I get, and i do not put up with people who believe they have the right to troll, bully and hound people out of forums, in the manner in which occurs on on this forum FAR to often.

[Aaron_S]

Originally Posted by formica

not everyone gets their scientific facts from the side of a box of cereal.

No that's just you.

We all get ours from actual sources considering we always share them.

[lady_bug87]

That's called ageism just in case you were unaware