Acrylic - poisonous fumes? - Page 2

formica · 09-11-13, 09:32 AM

all the parts ordered now, looks like i'll have everything by the 18th

decided to try some automatic push-latches, like those used on some cabinet doors, gentle push and it opens, although the one I picked it more heavy duty (for loft space doors), means no handle on the outside which leaves the front window/door as clear as possible - and hopefully secure...

thanks for the hinge links LarryS, I found the same brand here in the UK in a few shops, only one shop had the hexagonal counter sink holes and wanted to charge silly amounts in postage, which is a shame, but got a nice pair anyway!

I still havent settled on a cement to use, Weldon 725 may be the best choice, as i no longer need to glue acrylic to pvc, its what is recommended by the manufacturer for upto 16mm joints (mine are 10mm) - going to check some shops and try and avoid £20 postage

last thing, i was hoping 1W of LED's leave my voltage regulator pretty cool, but its hitting 60C, so thats not safe to install inside the enclosure with the PVC melt temp of 65C, shame, would have been a nice clean solution - i guess i'll have to make an outboard enclosure for it

formica · 09-11-13, 09:35 AM

3 way LED lighting: day(blue-white) | off | night(red)

LarryS · 09-11-13, 10:47 AM

Did the plastic manufacturer give you that melting point? It seems very low.

A lot of the manufacturers don't put melting point on their MSDS, but since most expanded PVC is similar in chemical make up I reference Sintra's document.

http://www.substratum.org/wp-content...intra-MSDS.pdf

It states 350 degrees F which is more than twice what you are at.

None the less, it is always best to keep heat producing items that are not thermostatically controlled out of the cage.

Looking forward to build pics!

Oh edit to add: you may want to try conventional pvc pipe cement. I am guessing that would be available locally to you. I did some testing years back comparing it to some weld-on products and super glue for PVC sheet and it performed just as well. Only draw back is that it yellows over time. Only a problem on white cages.

formica · 09-11-13, 11:10 AM

the data sheet for my brand says 65C for heating to bend etc, the melting point was higher, but if any structural changes are going to occur at close to 65C then I dont want to risk anything close to that - and I cant find out what the HCL emissions are at 65C, which is another concern - heat mat will be pulsed at 32C (dont really want a 60C heat source in the enclosure anyway lol)

LarryS · 09-11-13, 01:28 PM

I agree, better to be as safe as possible!

Perez Turner · 09-12-13, 10:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LarryS

I don't want to discourage you because PVCX really is great to work with. If you do a few practice glue ups to get the feel for it you should be fine.

I have found that most of these plastic adhesives will form a bond within the ten minute spec, but I never put much pressure on a glue up until it has cured overnight. The key as I mentioned is to make sure you have enough adhesive and use adequate clamping. Again this is for PVC.

What did you have in mind for latches?

Impressive. Actually I was searching the solution what you mentioned in detail and it added my knowledge to do work according to your instructions. Thanks for sharing worthy knowledge.

formica · 09-28-13, 01:41 PM

a strange thing has come up since finishing my build, the areas where the cement left a visible area inside the enclosure, seems to have reacted with either the water or the light, turning the area a bit white/lighter - has anyone seen this before?

i've been stablising the enclosure ahead of planting up, it'll be another month before my CRB goes into the enclosure - but i'm wondering if anyone has come across this issue before? could this be a HCL-water reaction, or something else? the cement should have been well cured long before I started humidifying the enclosure, so its a bit strange tbh...

I think my next build will be done with some kind of glue sealant (GB Pro maybe) and screws, I think i'll get a better result than trying to cement them; another option could be welding, but I dont really like the idea of not having a solid join except on the outside of the joint

LarryS · 09-28-13, 05:33 PM

Unfortunately some of these adhesives seem to blush in humid conditions. I live in Florida so have just learned to live with it. Maybe someday I can air condition my workshop!

It may also turn yellow over time, something to consider if working with white plastics.

formica · 09-29-13, 07:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LarryS

Unfortunately some of these adhesives seem to blush in humid conditions. I live in Florida so have just learned to live with it. Maybe someday I can air condition my workshop!

It may also turn yellow over time, something to consider if working with white plastics.

I used a cement, rather than an adhesive, technically, all that should now be between and around the joint, once cured, is PVC, well obviously not because its reacted lol maybe it just needs longer than 2 weeks - ah well, done now

LarryS · 09-29-13, 08:05 AM

Sorry I meant solvent cement.

I have been searching for alternatives to the solvent cements, for the reasons above. Some of the products do state that they remain clear over time, but my method of construction could use adhesives.

There is one cement I used that remained clear but I can't remember right now the part #. It was a 3M product, medium/heavy body and it never blushed on me. I'll go back in my records and see if I can find it.

I have built several 12mm thick PVC cages with mechanical fasteners only. Use a counter sink/drill and then drive the fastener by hand to set the depth. I prefer SS fasteners. A sealant can be used on the inside if needed.

formica · 09-29-13, 08:28 AM

I think thats what I'm going to do for the next one, using ''BondIt GB Pro'' I can apply a tiny amount on the edges, it takes 10minutes to skin, so no issues with it curing before i've got it all glued, then screw it together, and do a final seal inside, it works both as a super strength adhesive and a sealant, much like Silicone, but doesnt contain any silicone (comes in black, white and clear - it says that it will Yellow if it cures in the dark)

its a fantastic glue and sealant, used it in a few enclosures including my Sav's enclosure, despite his best efforts, his big monitor claws have been unable to unstick/damage it. it seems to have stuck and sealed the false cieling in my PVC enclosure very well, going to test it a bit more before doing it full scale, but it is designed to stick most things including PVC

only reason I used cement this time, was to have a single piece of plastic at the end, in the hope it would add something to the insulation and seal, but i dont think it adds enough to be worth the hassle of using

LarryS · 09-29-13, 04:59 PM

I was wrong again. The 3M product I had used was an adhesive, not a cement.

I did some strength resting a few years ago with Oatey pipe cement, WeldOn 2007 and 3M Scotch Grip 4475

I liked the way the 3M product went on, I apply the adhesive after the cage is assembled so aesthetics is important. It never blushed but I didn't keep any of the white cages long enough to know if it yellowed.

The 2007 is very thin and watery, bonded about the same as the 3M, but soaked into the joints leaving gaps.

The Oatey actually made the best bond, as you can see it broke next to the joint not on the joint itself like the others. It also is a heavy bodied cement so it lays on the seam and looks nice. I use this on all my cages, even though I apply it after assembly it still has held up extremely well.
With the cage parts in a routed groove and this cement on both sides it makes for a very strong and water tight assembly. It does blush when it is humid though.

Now.... I really like the looks of the BondIt GP Pro! It even comes in white and black. Unfortunately I can't seem to find a supplier here in the states. Dang it

I'm looking forward to your next build to see how it works.

HoldenC · 09-30-13, 02:46 AM

Informative thread! Sorry to change the subject, but what kind of LED are you using?

formica · 09-30-13, 03:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LarryS

I was wrong again. The 3M product I had used was an adhesive, not a cement.

I did some strength resting a few years ago with Oatey pipe cement, WeldOn 2007 and 3M Scotch Grip 4475

I liked the way the 3M product went on, I apply the adhesive after the cage is assembled so aesthetics is important. It never blushed but I didn't keep any of the white cages long enough to know if it yellowed.

The 2007 is very thin and watery, bonded about the same as the 3M, but soaked into the joints leaving gaps.

The Oatey actually made the best bond, as you can see it broke next to the joint not on the joint itself like the others. It also is a heavy bodied cement so it lays on the seam and looks nice. I use this on all my cages, even though I apply it after assembly it still has held up extremely well.
With the cage parts in a routed groove and this cement on both sides it makes for a very strong and water tight assembly. It does blush when it is humid though.

Now.... I really like the looks of the BondIt GP Pro! It even comes in white and black. Unfortunately I can't seem to find a supplier here in the states. Dang it

I'm looking forward to your next build to see how it works.

nice bit of research there! I was thinking about the 2007 (and the 275), until I recieved the plastic and found that it was a fraction of a mm bent - looks like that was a good decision!

I think the Oakey stuff is the equivilant to the Everbond I used, perhaps a faster cure with the everbond

with the 3M, does that liquify and go inside the joint, or was it just a bond on the outside?

Quote:

Originally Posted by HoldenC

Informative thread! Sorry to change the subject, but what kind of LED are you using?

I used strips of 5050 and 3528 smd LED's, the 5050's are larger and brighter than the 3528, I picked the 3528 by mistake, they do a great job of lighting the enclosure, but as I use bioactive and live planted substrates, I really need the brightest light possible

do a search in ebay for strip LED, u'll find a wide variety - avoid the cheap Chinese voltage regulators however, they are a serious fire and electrocution risk, the led strips themselves can be bought as cheaply as you like, but buy the voltage regulator from a US company who is governed by your saftey standards - the cheap chinese ones are known also to have illegal and fake saftey stamps! some people have had the explode here in the UK

HoldenC · 10-01-13, 03:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by formica

I used strips of 5050 and 3528 smd LED's, the 5050's are larger and brighter than the 3528, I picked the 3528 by mistake, they do a great job of lighting the enclosure, but as I use bioactive and live planted substrates, I really need the brightest light possible

do a search in ebay for strip LED, u'll find a wide variety - avoid the cheap Chinese voltage regulators however, they are a serious fire and electrocution risk, the led strips themselves can be bought as cheaply as you like, but buy the voltage regulator from a US company who is governed by your saftey standards - the cheap chinese ones are known also to have illegal and fake saftey stamps! some people have had the explode here in the UK

Excellent, thank you. Do the LED strips get hot to the touch? I wonder if waterproof tubes would work better for a nosy python.