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06-18-13, 08:45 AM
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#1
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Banned
Join Date: Apr-2013
Location: Milwaukie, Oregon
Age: 27
Posts: 1,398
Country: 
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Garter snake emergancy!!!!!!!!!
Hello everyone! Quick question... My garter is laying on her back and seems to have lost control of her muscles or something... I don't know... maybe she was climbing and fell off her rock & is having trouble getting on her belly? She is actually slithering around of her back... Again. she's fighting to try and flip herself onto her belly and has not suceeded. The closest reptile vet is 45 minutes away in a car, and two hours on the bus + I don't think they'd let me on the bus with my snake. I do not have a car... Is she just being silly or is she sick?? She has been acting very odd lately. She's been a bit fussy during handling and usually she'll explore my hands and arms but she has just been laying in my hands, without much response to me. I am pretty scared, and nervous and I don't know what this is. I haven't experienced anything close to this in the past. And she's struggling, trying to flip herself, as if she's exhausted. She's wild caught so I thought it could potentially be some sort of parasites she picked up or something?? Again... Any input on what this could be is VERY VERY much appreciated. also... should I help her get back onto her belly or leave her alone???
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06-18-13, 08:46 AM
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#2
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Member
Join Date: May-2012
Posts: 533
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Re: Garter snake emergancy!!!!!!!!!
What are you feeding her? Small fish?
__________________
0.2.3 Corn (2 normal/1 anery/1 anery motley/1 snow) / 0.0.1 KSB / 1.0 Yuma King / 1.0 Durango Mountain King / 0.1 BCI / 1.1 Oregon Garter / 1.0 Everglade Rat Snake / 1.0 Coastal Carpet / 0.1 Bull Snake
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06-18-13, 08:47 AM
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#3
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Banned
Join Date: Apr-2013
Location: Milwaukie, Oregon
Age: 27
Posts: 1,398
Country:
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Re: Garter snake emergancy!!!!!!!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kettennatter
What are you feeding her? Small fish?
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Yup.. Cloud Fish (no thiamine)
Really scared 
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06-18-13, 09:01 AM
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#4
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Member
Join Date: May-2012
Posts: 533
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Re: Garter snake emergancy!!!!!!!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by ErikBush97
Yup.. Cloud Fish (no thiamine)
Really scared |
Cloud fish are a kind of minnow, to my knowledge. So I would consier them suspect.
I'm not sure if this link is against the forum rules or not, but this is a very decent write-up:
All About Thiaminase - Gartersnake.info
__________________
0.2.3 Corn (2 normal/1 anery/1 anery motley/1 snow) / 0.0.1 KSB / 1.0 Yuma King / 1.0 Durango Mountain King / 0.1 BCI / 1.1 Oregon Garter / 1.0 Everglade Rat Snake / 1.0 Coastal Carpet / 0.1 Bull Snake
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06-18-13, 09:05 AM
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#5
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Morelia Enjoyus Maximus
Join Date: Oct-2011
Location: Kitchener
Age: 54
Posts: 4,615
Country: 
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Re: Garter snake emergancy!!!!!!!!!
A snake on it's back is nothing silly. Your snake is knocking on deaths door. I hope you figure it out. What are your temps?
__________________
0.1 BCI 1.1.2 Jungle Carpet Pythons 1.0 Jungle Jag 1.0 Goins King Snake 0.1 Leopard Gecko 0.1 Albino Gopher Snake 1.0 Pastel Ball Python
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06-18-13, 09:09 AM
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#6
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Banned
Join Date: Jun-2013
Location: City
Posts: 0
Country: 
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Re: Garter snake emergancy!!!!!!!!!
All About Thiaminase - Gartersnake.info
Also where were you advised those fish don't contain thiaminase? I have found no resources indicating whether white clouds are safe or unsafe....
Either way I'd call that reptile vet if I were you... Like.. Now
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06-18-13, 09:10 AM
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#7
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Banned
Join Date: Jun-2013
Location: City
Posts: 0
Country:
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Re: Garter snake emergancy!!!!!!!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kettennatter
Cloud fish are a kind of minnow, to my knowledge. So I would consier them suspect.
I'm not sure if this link is against the forum rules or not, but this is a very decent write-up:
All About Thiaminase - Gartersnake.info |
Lol I took so long saving my post you beat me to it =D
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06-18-13, 09:13 AM
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#8
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Member
Join Date: May-2012
Posts: 533
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Re: Garter snake emergancy!!!!!!!!!
The snake looks like one that is thiamine deficient. (No way to know for sure unless you are able to administer thiamine. The snake would recover quickly if it was thiamine deficient.) A vet is the safe bet.
__________________
0.2.3 Corn (2 normal/1 anery/1 anery motley/1 snow) / 0.0.1 KSB / 1.0 Yuma King / 1.0 Durango Mountain King / 0.1 BCI / 1.1 Oregon Garter / 1.0 Everglade Rat Snake / 1.0 Coastal Carpet / 0.1 Bull Snake
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06-18-13, 09:37 AM
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#9
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Banned
Join Date: Apr-2013
Location: Milwaukie, Oregon
Age: 27
Posts: 1,398
Country:
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Re: Garter snake emergancy!!!!!!!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Terranaut
A snake on it's back is nothing silly. Your snake is knocking on deaths door. I hope you figure it out. What are your temps?
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For the garter, a little higher than room temp since she's native and doesn't need extra heating. (around 75-80F) And I think the guy who replied before you was right. I think's it's thiaminase. The thing that's really bothering me about this, is I asked the guy at the pet store if they had any small feeders WITHOUT thiaminase and he, WITH 0% HESITATION, said "Cloud fish are fine for Garters! That's what we feed our Ball Pythons"... He said Cloud Fish so quickly that you'd think he had studied it and had been asked a million times before. Guess that's what I get for trusting someone who works with animals for a living...
The reason I said acting silly is because she often climbs on top of her hide, falls onto her back (3 inch drop, so it isn't going to cause any damage if she falls), and twirls her way back onto her belly. I thought she'd just flip right over... But she's still there. I am working on finding a ride to a vet, so now that I have a $100 vet bill, stop riding my *** about buying a thermostat.
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06-18-13, 09:43 AM
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#10
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Banned
Join Date: Apr-2013
Location: Milwaukie, Oregon
Age: 27
Posts: 1,398
Country:
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Re: Garter snake emergancy!!!!!!!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ourobouros
All About Thiaminase - Gartersnake.info
Also where were you advised those fish don't contain thiaminase? I have found no resources indicating whether white clouds are safe or unsafe....
Either way I'd call that reptile vet if I were you... Like.. Now
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The guy at the pet store. He said "Cloud fish are fine for Gartes" without ANY... A.N.Y hesitation as if he had researched it, and knew exactly what he was talking about.
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06-18-13, 09:49 AM
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#11
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Member
Join Date: May-2012
Posts: 533
Country:
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Re: Garter snake emergancy!!!!!!!!!
Erik, I don't blame you. There are plenty of websites who list minnows as safe, and they are safer than goldfish, yet obviously not safe. What you descibe sounds like thiamine deficency. A vet will be able to give the snake a shot of B1, if this is what it is. You could try to administer thiamine yourself, but it takes some experience.
I also believe that the temperatures are not a likely cause in this specific case.
__________________
0.2.3 Corn (2 normal/1 anery/1 anery motley/1 snow) / 0.0.1 KSB / 1.0 Yuma King / 1.0 Durango Mountain King / 0.1 BCI / 1.1 Oregon Garter / 1.0 Everglade Rat Snake / 1.0 Coastal Carpet / 0.1 Bull Snake
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06-18-13, 09:49 AM
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#12
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Banned
Join Date: Apr-2013
Location: Milwaukie, Oregon
Age: 27
Posts: 1,398
Country:
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Re: Garter snake emergancy!!!!!!!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ourobouros
All About Thiaminase - Gartersnake.info
Also where were you advised those fish don't contain thiaminase? I have found no resources indicating whether white clouds are safe or unsafe....
Either way I'd call that reptile vet if I were you... Like.. Now
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I did... They said they could have me in tomorrow evening. I informed them that by the looks of it... the snake might not be alive tomorrow evening but that didn't seem to matter. The only vet that will see me today is in Washington (no buses go to Washington from here)
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06-18-13, 09:49 AM
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#13
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Banned
Join Date: Apr-2013
Location: Milwaukie, Oregon
Age: 27
Posts: 1,398
Country:
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Re: Garter snake emergancy!!!!!!!!!
again.. should I assist the snake on getting it back onto it's belly, or just let her be??
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06-18-13, 09:51 AM
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#14
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Banned
Join Date: Apr-2013
Location: Milwaukie, Oregon
Age: 27
Posts: 1,398
Country:
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Re: Garter snake emergancy!!!!!!!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kettennatter
I also believe that the temperatures are not a likely cause in this specific case.
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I keep her at the recommended temps for a N.W Garter, though.
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06-18-13, 09:51 AM
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#15
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Banned
Join Date: Jun-2013
Location: City
Posts: 0
Country:
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Re: Garter snake emergancy!!!!!!!!!
Dude relax. I know you're frustrated and worried. Just do the best you can and get priorities taken care of first. No one here is dealing with this issue right now in person as you are at this very moment so it's easy for people to call you out for things in hind sight. Even if it's good advice and they care you have to do whatever is in your power to do and not let yourself feel helpless or put down. Your snake needs you to keep your cool and take control.
We're it possible I would help...but instead all I have are useless words. If i truly believed it was going to die and had to wait a day for a vet I'd get the thiamin supplement for it and follow the instructions on the posted link...
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