Resuced Hog island boa and a few questions - Page 5

**Minkness** · 08-16-16, 05:33 PM

Vape isn't smoke. It's water vapor laced with nicotine and flavor.

As for same room, probably not, just because of the potential nicotine. Also, make sure you wash your hands before handling if you have vaped at all that day so that the chems don't transfer that way either.

**Aaron_S** · 08-17-16, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigsnakegirl785

Because when people say they use racks, they normally use them for life, and although a juvenile or subadult is fine in one it seems a little restricting to keep a full grown adult in one.

Oh so you've lumped all boa keepers who use a rack system into one category. Gotcha. You're making blanket assumptions about people based of a few bad apples you've "experienced".

In MY experience, all my boa friends use racks for neonates, juvies and a select few smaller adults. I've been in enough boa rooms to see enclosures for larger adults.

Don't make assumptions.

Quote:

... I have seen very few, if any boas reach 6' before they turned 3 without some sort of overfeeding.

Your previous posts all draw a line in the sand that any boa reaching 6' at 3 years of less are overfed with NO exception. You have no way of 100% verifying this by the way.

Quote:

My own boa wouldn't have even reached 6' at 3 years if he hadn't gotten meals twice the size he should have been getting for over a month.

Really? A single month attributed how much growth? How can you say this as fact? How do you know the boa wouldn't have grown XX inches in a month with smaller meals or was just about to hit a growth spurt in general?

As for your snakes. Too small of a sample size. But sure, go ahead and eat your hat. I have a time believing any results from you though.

bigsnakegirl785 · 08-17-16, 06:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aaron_S

Oh so you've lumped all boa keepers who use a rack system into one category. Gotcha. You're making blanket assumptions about people based of a few bad apples you've "experienced".

In MY experience, all my boa friends use racks for neonates, juvies and a select few smaller adults. I've been in enough boa rooms to see enclosures for larger adults.

Don't make assumptions.

Your previous posts all draw a line in the sand that any boa reaching 6' at 3 years of less are overfed with NO exception. You have no way of 100% verifying this by the way.

Really? A single month attributed how much growth? How can you say this as fact? How do you know the boa wouldn't have grown XX inches in a month with smaller meals or was just about to hit a growth spurt in general?

As for your snakes. Too small of a sample size. But sure, go ahead and eat your hat. I have a time believing any results from you though.

It's hard not to when I see it all the time, good for you and your friends though.

Well seeing as he grew half a foot in a matter of a couple months...yeah pretty sure on that one. He was at the end of his growth spurt when that happened, went from growing 2"-3" every other week (he went from 2.5' at 1 year to 5' at 2) to growing maybe an inch or two a month for a short time until that happened. He was well past 2 years old, and past the usual growth spurt period.

I'm just saying usually when I see that, it's people feeding their 6' boa 1-2 jumbo rats every week or something equally ridiculous, which is definitely overfeeding. If I see a snake being fed conservatively and still reach 6' at 3 I'll probably believe it's more normal than I do now, but quite a few boa breeders have told me the same thing, that 6' at 3 years is oversized, and they also have the extensive experience you say you have. Being told exactly that is what is causing me to be more conservative with my feeding, because Cloud was called out as being large for his age by several experienced keepers.

**Aaron_S** · 08-18-16, 09:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigsnakegirl785

It's hard not to when I see it all the time, good for you and your friends though.

Well seeing as he grew half a foot in a matter of a couple months...yeah pretty sure on that one. He was at the end of his growth spurt when that happened, went from growing 2"-3" every other week (he went from 2.5' at 1 year to 5' at 2) to growing maybe an inch or two a month for a short time until that happened. He was well past 2 years old, and past the usual growth spurt period.

I'm just saying usually when I see that, it's people feeding their 6' boa 1-2 jumbo rats every week or something equally ridiculous, which is definitely overfeeding. If I see a snake being fed conservatively and still reach 6' at 3 I'll probably believe it's more normal than I do now, but quite a few boa breeders have told me the same thing, that 6' at 3 years is oversized, and they also have the extensive experience you say you have. Being told exactly that is what is causing me to be more conservative with my feeding, because Cloud was called out as being large for his age by several experienced keepers.

Yeah I didn't read this. I'm done with the discussion. I've said my piece. You've said yours. Readers can decide at this point what they want to take away.

I grow tired of circular discussions. Thanks though.

**Tsubaki** · 08-18-16, 11:00 AM

Not all that interested in joining this discussion as most things have been said already, but one thing rubbed me the wrong way a bit.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigsnakegirl785

Because when people say they use racks, they normally use them for life, and although a juvenile or subadult is fine in one it seems a little restricting to keep a full grown adult in one.

There are many full grown boas who can be kept in a rack just fine, just depends on your rack system. A friend of mine has two of these, they work fine for most adult boa constrictors.

**Andy_G** · 08-18-16, 12:47 PM

Those are really nice racks.

Not gonna dance around and write out a long winded post. The following is not aimed at anyone in particular but if anyone takes it personal, so be it.

Properly sized racks are fine for properly sized boas. To state anything else would be based on inexperience, self-perceived moral high ground, and opinion...not fact. If you hate racks...good for you.

Growth rates also vary between individuals of the same lineage, husbandry and feeding regimens. That's a fact.

Take from that what you will but please stop beating this dead horse.

bigsnakegirl785 · 08-18-16, 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tsubaki

Not all that interested in joining this discussion as most things have been said already, but one thing rubbed me the wrong way a bit.

There are many full grown boas who can be kept in a rack just fine, just depends on your rack system. A friend of mine has two of these, they work fine for most adult boa constrictors.

6" is barely taller than their bellies, though. :/ My 6.5' boa is 3"-4" tall, he wouldn't be able to curl up in that.

Once OP posts their re-done lengths and weights, we can get back on topic. If the snakes is indeed 3'3" it's definitely a bit undersized, but being so young I'm sure it will still get to a respectable size, but feeding it healthily is more important atm.

Whoops it's 9"...that's a lot better. haha Pretty terrible with numbers. Still too short for me, but people can do as they will as long as the snake is offered ample room for it to move around. They don't really need mental stimulation, but they're still vertebrates with bones and muscles that need to move around or stretch.

acidonangles · 08-18-16, 08:07 PM

I think my scale might be ****ed(?) I reweighed him and it saying he is around 210 grams this time around. I put a container that fit on the scale with nothing handing over, put him in, and it was bouncing between 200-220. And he is indeed almost 3'3"

bigsnakegirl785 · 08-19-16, 11:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by acidonangles

I think my scale might be ****ed(?) I reweighed him and it saying he is around 210 grams this time around. I put a container that fit on the scale with nothing handing over, put him in, and it was bouncing between 200-220. And he is indeed almost 3'3"

Ok that weight sounds a lot better. Still low, but better. If SerpWidgets says he's 3'3", he could be as large as 3.5'. I don't put much stock in SW, it's usually off by 2"-4" (I've had it be off by over a foot before). If you measured him by hand then that's a more accurate measurement.

At 3'3", a jumbo mouse is probably best, at most a weaned rat. Just feed one of those every 2-3 weeks until he puts on a little weight. Small rats will definitely be too large for the time being, I'd wait until he's 4'+ for those.

acidonangles · 08-19-16, 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigsnakegirl785

At 3'3", a jumbo mouse is probably best, at most a weaned rat. Just feed one of those every 2-3 weeks until he puts on a little weight. Small rats will definitely be too large for the time being, I'd wait until he's 4'+ for those.

I usually order my f/t feeders online so I might order some weaned rats and small rats. Or is that not a good idea?

bigsnakegirl785 · 08-19-16, 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by acidonangles

I usually order my f/t feeders online so I might order some weaned rats and small rats. Or is that not a good idea?

Unless you have a snake on smalls, I'd stick to the weaned rats. My sunglow girl is about your snake's length and she's still on jumbo mice as weaned rats are still a tad too large for her. Last I measured her she was 3' even but she could have grown a few inches. Hence why I advised getting both jumbo mice and weaned rats, if your snake is underweight it's probably not going to have a lot of girth, but since it could be bigger than what SW is saying, it could potentially still take weaned rats. I would get jumbo mice and weaned rats, and see which one is more appropriate. It should leave at most a small bulge with no scale separation, and I'd try for smaller at first if the snake is underweight as you don't want to shock their system. Generally, in cases of underweight snakes, you start out with much smaller prey items than normal and slowly work up.

**Minkness** · 08-19-16, 11:48 AM

A weaned or small small rat would be better and should be offered once every 7 days. Once he is about 4-4.5 feet then you can do 1 med every 2 weeks.

bigsnakegirl785 · 08-19-16, 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Minkness

A weaned or small small rat would be better and should be offered once every 7 days. Once he is about 4-4.5 feet then you can do 1 med every 2 weeks.

If the snake is underweight, it's best for them to go with a smaller meal. Small rats are too large for a 3' snake, I doubt it could get one down. They should be aiming for the smaller meal until the snake gains some weight.

Smalls are good for boas around 4', mediums 5'-6'.

bigsnakegirl785 · 08-19-16, 12:07 PM

Also, a small rat is 21-38% of the snakes weight. That's ridiculous to be advising.

**Minkness** · 08-19-16, 12:08 PM

That's why I said small small. It wasn't a typo. Not all sized rats are equal. And at this point rats would be better because of the higher content of fat vs an adult retired breeder mouse (which is what jumbo mice are).

So, same size/weight as a jumbo mouse with a better nutrient load.