Questions from a newbie

[maiden_canada]

why on earth would you start off a baby ball in a 50gallon? (not sure if you are but someone said so)

[Jeff_Favelle]

When I say make due, at your standard yes it would be considered making due but for me it is what I think is going to make a good enclosure

You're missing the point. It doesn't matter if I think its a good cage, or if you think its a good cage, or if the Ball Pythons Gods think its a good cage. All that matters is if YOUR Ball Python thinks its a good cage, and history has shown that the best cage for a Ball Pythons is NOT a fish aquarium (redundant, I know) with a screen top. Just a fact.

Also just as final note to you Jeff I would have expected a much nicer attitude toward your members considering you are a moderator and a representation of the people who are supposed to be on this message board.

I'm not here to be your friend man, sorry to disillusion you! I'm here to give advice on how to house the snakes that I know about. Whether or not you choose to use that advice is up to you. Just because you do not agree with that advice does not imply that I am being mean, nor does it portray me as having a bad attitude. I could care less about what you do, or how you feel. My concern lies with the animals we discuss. Nothing more. If you do not like learning things you obviously know nothing about, and feel the need to chastize those who give you advice, then indeed, you're time here will be short-lived.

Again, its always people who make things personal. This has nothing to do with you. In 2 days, I will forget this thread even existed, simply because I have answered these very questions 400 times here in the last 6 months. But you know who won't forget these questions? Your Ball Python. While its living in a fish aquarium with a screen top. Perhaps a vertical pole (Festivus-style) is in order?

Cheers.

[Ron]

Festivus...Ha Ha....time for the feats of strength!

[Syco]

Vengeance,
From what I understand, you are planning on starting out with a baby BP.
Despite the fact that you think Jeff is not very friendly or courteous with his answers, he is exactly right. A 50 gal aquarium is not going to be a good home for your new BP. For one thing it is way to large, BPs want to feel secure and your new BP is not going to appreciate the extra space it's just going to make him or her nervous and more likely to go off feed. The second thing is a 50 gal aquarium is going to be very hard to heat and keep the humidity in. Why not try the rubbermaid, they are cheap and you won't be out a lot of extra money and you will find that your BP will be a lot happier. You will be happier too if you are not having to deal with him going off feed or bad sheds. If you look on the enclosure forum , you will find a post about some rubbermaid cages that look really cool!
As for the 50 gal.... why not buy some fish?

[Syco]

Here's the link for the rubbermaid enclosure. http://www.ssnakess.com/forums/showt...threadid=25763
Hope it helps!

[Vengeance]

I'm not here to be your friend man, sorry to disillusion you! I'm here to give advice on how to house the snakes that I know about. Whether or not you choose to use that advice is up to you. Just because you do not agree with that advice does not imply that I am being mean, nor does it portray me as having a bad attitude. I could care less about what you do, or how you feel. My concern lies with the animals we discuss. Nothing more. If you do not like learning things you obviously know nothing about, and feel the need to chastize those who give you advice, then indeed, you're time here will be short-lived.

Again, its always people who make things personal. This has nothing to do with you. In 2 days, I will forget this thread even existed, simply because I have answered these very questions 400 times here in the last 6 months. But you know who won't forget these questions? Your Ball Python. While its living in a fish aquarium with a screen top. Perhaps a vertical pole (Festivus-style) is in order?

I never asked for a friend I ask for some constructive criticisms on how to setup the enclosure. But all you have to say is, you idea is wrong, my idea is right, do it my way or you don't really care about your snake. But you haven't provided me with anything. Why not tell me why Rubbermaid’s make such good enclosures and why glass tanks are not. All I have gotten so far is that Glass tanks suck and Rubbermaid’s are better, well guess what, that’s not helpful. Is it only because glass tanks with wire tops cannot hold the humidity that they are bad, or is it because they can't hold the temperature, what makes a Rubbermaid so good? If a glass tank was built to hold the humidity and the temperature correct why would that glass tank still not be as good as the Rubbermaid, are there actual documented health risks from keeping your Ball in a glass tank.

Coming to a person looking for answers and saying, your wrong and I'm right is of course going to get a defensive reaction, especially when you don't provide anything other then do it my way cause it's the best way. I don't see any benefits of a Rubbermaid over glass. Rubbermaid’s seem small and lacking on space for the snake to move about. While glass seems to offer much more space for the snake to move around in and with what I hope to be a more stimulating environment. Now if the only bad thing you have to say about glass is that it won't hold the humidity, rest assured that there are ways to fix that. But unless you can actually provide someone with actual facts and reasons why one is better then the other, then why would anyone want to listen to you?

[Tigergenesis]

Sorry I forgot to post the link to the discussion I mentioned.

http://ballpython.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=49


When I was doing my research on Ball Pythons, I too saw all the care sheets that said an aquarium was okay. I even read tons of posts on various message boards - none mentioned tanks as being bad. I guess my timing was off because it wasn't until after I had bought everything that I started seeing posts by others having problems with heat & humidity in the tank. I remember thinking "why didn't anyone have this problem before I got my tank so I'd have known what to expect". I saw tons of posts about feeding problems but none on tanks. Anyway, it's all worked out for me and my temps and humidity stay good. As I said just took some plaing around with various ideas.

I will admit that I too started with my little guy (2 months old at the time) in the 50 gallon. However, I had plenty of hides for him - per the recommendation of many people. I placed hides on both sides so he could still thermoregulate while feeling secure in an appropriately sized hide.

[Tigergenesis]

Opps!

As I said just took some plaing around with various ideas

Should be "playing" around.

[Vengeance]

Syco

Much more helpful. I was not thinking about a hatchling but maybe a 1 year old Ball. The idea being that if the breeder is a good breeder the Ball would already be feeding and that it wouldn't be too stressful moving into the new environment. When I was going to build the new enclosure I was taking into account that the space may stress the snake out, the idea being to provide enough cover and I was thinking something like 4 - 6 hides spread out across the enclosure to make sure that it always felt secure. If this isn't the case and no matter what I do to try and make the Ball comfortable I won't be able too then I will have to reconsider my approach and start over. Also I've been looking into many different ideas on how to keep the temperature and humidity up in a glass enclosure and it does sound plausible. I know it may be more difficult to maintain then a Rubbermaid but I think I can do it. Rest assured until I have the humidity and temperature correct and holding over a weeks period I will not be purchasing the snake.

[Tim_Cranwill]

Vengeance, I'm not here to support Jeff. I am here to tell you that he is giving you the best advice. Starting out with 4-6 hides in a glass tank with a screen top and adjusting from there is way too complicated. Start out with the very basics like Jeff said and then learn what you should and shouldn't do from there. The fewer variables you have in your setup, the fewer corrections you'll need to make and you'll have a lot less guess work.

Nobody is picking on you. If you search through the ball python forum, you'll find dozens of threads discussing this very topic and you'll see that the same advice comes up over and over again.

Why make life more difficult on your snake and on yourself? Just keep it simple and enjoy keeping your snake. You're lucky that there are people on this forum who WILL give you unbiased advice instead of tip toeing around. Take that advice and run with it. Don't take it so personally.


p.s. I'd bet you $13 that if you DO keep your ball like you plan to, your next thread will be titled "Help, my new bp won't eat!!!" Then you'll get all of the same advice all over again. Save your self AND us the hassle... Enjoy...

[foman]

It is possible to make a tank work for a ball python, but a rubbermaid is better. They are only 7-8 bucks at walmart or Zellers, The amount of time and effort wasted to get the tank set up properly you could have a rubbermaid ready to go(in a day or two). Also rubbermaid are easier to clean, move,maintain humidity. Try the rubbermaid method and you won't be dissapointed. If you don't like it you got a feeding bin.

[Vengeance]

Well it would seem that due to overwhelming support the rubbermaid is the best choice. So now the question comes back to myself what to do witht he 50 gallon tank, keep it get 2 snakes one for the 50 gallon and the ball in the rubbermaid, or just stick with 1 in the 50 gallon for now and get a Ball and a rubbermaid at a later time when I'm ready for a second snake.

Thanks for the help guys.

[Tim_Cranwill]

Sell the tank and buy more snakes!

I don't see why if one snake is not suited for a tank, you insist on getting another one to keep in it. With snakes, you need to stop thinking about yourself. They don't care about how much you spent on the tank, the heat lamp, the vertical pole . They care about hiding and eating. Cover their needs, not yours.

Don't be shy, ask more questions. You might not get the answers you like but you'll get good advice....

Thanks,
Tim Cranwill
www.cranwill.com
cranwill@mts.net

[Syco]

Ok.... maybe I'm not understanding this right. You realize that the rubbermaid is the best way to go.... but you are wanting to get another snake for the 50 gal and put the BP in a rubbermaid? Are you wanting to get a different kind of snake for the 50 gal? If so, and you are determined to use this 50 gal for a snake... which it seems that you are, maybe a nice adult corn snake would work. They don't require the high temps and humidity that a BP does, and with proper hides and limbs and such to climb on, a corn might appreciate the extra room.

[Vengeance]

Well basiclly this is where I am, I have the 50 gallon tank and wire top already bought, cant return them, and don't really have the time to try and activly sell them, ok. So I really want a Ball, but from what everyone is telling me, putting him in a 50 gallon is not a good idea, ok cool, that's fine. So now what to do with the 50 gallon, well I love snakes, allways have, so I'll find a type of snake that can best use the 50 gallon and let him have it. I was looking at Corn snakes before, the BloodRed ones I really liked, but I got into a converstaion with a snake owner at a Pet store who has 3 Balls of his own (All in glass tanks) and said corns are horrible, so I kind of got turned off on Corns and started getting more excited about Balls. But if what everyone is saying is true I don't want to get a ball and then have it's health effected if I use the 50 gallon, so ok, for now, no Ball. But back to square one, still have the 50 gallon and I still really want a snake, so the Rosey Boa was also mentioned, guess it's time to go do more research.