Baby Ball problems eating. - Page 2

Joe · 08-07-07, 11:15 AM

another good point about putting the rodent directly in the water is alot of times when a snake has gone without food for some time it can become a little dehydrated, the more moisture he gets the better for the animal, if all else fails and u notice the snake loosing weight I would suggest assist feeding it, generally always works, dont confuse this with force feeding where only a well versed herper should attempt, assist feeding is easy though, take a much smaller prey item then usual, have it wet, and warm, not hot, hold the snake gently by the back of its head and gently pry the mouth open with the nose of the rodent, push the rodent in only enough that the snakes teeth are stuck to it and close to the back of his mouth, release the snake and generally the snake will continue to consume the prey on its own, if you have any questions email me and I can email you pics on the proper procedure if you dont understand exactly from my explenation, good luck and best wishes,

I would also like to add, sierrabravo, that is completly cruel, no animal should be treated like that, rodent or snake or anything for that matter, all animals, pets or feeders should be kept with respect and the animals best interest in mind

mykee · 08-07-07, 01:56 PM

I agree with Joe. Not cool. If a ball is hungry, he will eat the food item whether it is injured or not. Not cool.

stacyclaire · 08-07-07, 02:16 PM

My bp wouldn't eat for a month after I first got him (he was about 18 inches long). Someone suggested I heat the defrosted mouse in the microwave for 3-4 seconds (no longer! you don't want it to start decomposing). That seemed to make it the right temperature. He went after it fast when I dangled it at that temperature and has been eating them great ever since.

Joe · 08-07-07, 02:44 PM

Only prob with microwaves is they heat the prey from the inside out, no way to determin the actual core temperature and could serriously hurt your snake

Herpkid101x · 08-07-07, 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mykee

If that ball doesn't eat, there is no way hes ever going to see 20 inches, so your point is moot.
I would do what SG mentioned, but leave out the baggie, and throw the food item right into the hot water. The warmer the food, the better chance that your baby will take it. Good luck.

oh yea i forgot about that part

moonsongs · 08-07-07, 04:20 PM

Well, I thank everyone for their great advice but unfortunately my snake died on Saturday from IBD. Even though he was only part of the family for a short while, he was a great companion and he will be missed.

R.I.P.
Reggie

fionak · 08-07-07, 07:03 PM

That is very sad. I haven't been on the forum for a while so missed your original post.

Who told you your snake had IBD? Was it your vet?

If you get another Royal Python (Ball) you will need to make sure the viv is thorough disinfected and all the viv furniture is disinfected too, along with the water bowl. Even better would be to scrap the whole lot and start again.

I keep Royals and have three of them. One rescue approximately 3 years old who is just under 4ft long, one Royal I have had since he was a hatchling - he's 2 years old now and a baby we've had for the past 2 months. She is eating and growing well.

Perhaps the most important thing with Royals is not handling them when you first get them. Very difficult because we all want to handle our new snakes but not doing so is very important until you establish a good feeding routine.

Temps should be 92 deg F warm end, going down in a gradient to around 78 - 80 deg F cool end.

Make sure the snake has plenty of hides to go into. Royals don't like too much space so don't have a viv or hides that are too big for the snake.

Basic I know but always make sure he has a good supply of fresh water.

Unless you live in a very dry atmosphere humidity should be no higher than 50 - 55% except when the snake is shedding when you can give the viv a fine misting (a plant sprayer comes in handy) once or twice a day. Once the snake has shed, stop misting the viv. Don't mist so much that there's water running down the walls or glass. Royals do not need high humidity and high humidity could very quickly cause scale rot. We're quite lucky in the UK because we have a natural humidity and it very seldom gets too dry here.

For the first week do not handle and do not attempt to feed the Royal. They are shy snakes and can take a little time to settle into their new surroundings.

After a week, offer him a frozen/thawed fuzzy mouse. In the UK it is illegal to feed a snake live food and I would not feed live as I have seen a heartbreaking pic of what can happen when a mouse (mouse, not rat) turns on the snake. It killed the snake.

I find warming up the mouse with the hairdryer is the best way. Sometimes heating mice in a plastic bag in water leaves their fur wet, although this is the way I warm up rats for my Boas. None of my Royals will eat a wet mouse or rat. Blow-dried mouse is obviously tastier!

Hopefully (and most likely) the snake will eat. If he does not, then bin the mouse and try again a few days later with a freshly thawed mouse following the same procedure as above.

Only handle your snake briefly to change soiled substrate and put him back immediately with as little fuss as possible. Still a difficult time for you because you want to handle the snake. Desist! Most important.

Once your snake has had at least 4 feeds you can then start handling him gently for a few minutes, gradually building up handling time. This gives both you and the snake time to gain confidence with each other. If your snake bites you don't put him down as he'll quickly learn that biting you means you'll put him down and that is what he wants. All baby snakes see anything bigger than themselves as a predator that's going to eat them. They don't know that snake is not on our menu. A defensive strike the snake will strike then let go. A snake in feeding mode tends to hold on until he decides your not very tasty at all.

Never handle your snake after he's eaten. I always give my snakes 48 hours after their meal before handling them and with the bigger snakes at least 3 days.

I was given this advice when I first started keeping Royals and it is the best advice I was given and am happy to pass on that advice to you and anyone else who's never kept a Royal before or is not sure of its care.

They are lovely snakes and if these basic rules are followed your snake should have a long and healthy (and happy) life.

The Royal I've had since he was a hatchling did his first public display a few weeks ago at our vet's open day. I wondered if it would put him off-feed (a common occurrence with Royals) as he'd never been among so many people before. It obviously didn't worry him at all as he ate a meal of a good sized rat a few days later. He is very bold for a Royal, not in the least bit shy whereas my rescue Royal is very shy, probably due to the bad start in life he had (he nearly died). He's a very healthy snake now but still shy.

If you get another Royal, I'm sure things will turn out better next time.

Mátthew · 08-14-07, 09:12 AM

Hey I'm pretty new to this forum and I could be wrong but my ball python wouldn't eat for about two months when i first got him, but after that it ate fine. I just thought it was because of it getting settled in. So ya i could be wrong but thats my opinion.

fionak · 08-15-07, 08:49 AM

Sometimes Royals do take a while to settle. They also go off feed for reasons only known to themselves. If temps and humidity are correct and you follow the rules above, your snake should settle in well. Royals are also notoriously fussy. My rescue Royal has decided he doesn't like rats and has been eating large mice for the past 6 months now. Then he'll get fed up with them and go back to rats. My other Royal won't eat mice but loves rats. Our baby Royal is quite happy to eat mice but after another couple of feeds I'm going to try her on rat pups.

Although Royals (Ball Pythons) are often said to be good beginner snakes, my opinion is they are not because of their fussiness with food. Often part of the problem is the owners get really worried when the snake won't eat (natural - I got worried when mine went off feed). It's a Royal thing and something owners of these beautiful snakes will have to live with.

For a first time snake I don't think you can do better than Cornsnakes. These lovely snakes come in so many different colours, tend to be good eaters and are usually very friendly. Kingsnakes are also good as are Boa Constrictors - but, of course, Boas grow very large. Handled regularly Boas are usually gentle giants.

mykee · 08-15-07, 03:50 PM

Though I do agree with most of the information that Fionak has given, I don't agree with this:

Quote:

"For the first week do not handle and do not attempt to feed the Royal"

The last part at least.
I have found from owning quite a few balls for quite a few years that it's stressful enough for a ball to be relocated to a new home, with new surroundings and such. Why stress him out by holding back food? I have ALWAYS fed any new ball to my home as soon as I get it, and 90% of the time, they'll eat and they're off to the races.
I would also suggest a clean, easy to use substrate like paper towels at least until your ball is eating consistently, but ideally, forever.
Good luck.

fionak · 08-15-07, 06:40 PM

Don't agree 100% with that purely because baby Royals are so easily stressed. They need a bit of time to settle into their new home. Most snakes will have come from a shop and they should have a feeding record. Most times they will have been fed two or three days before you collect them so the chances are they won't be that hungry anyway. When I get a new snake I always make sure I find out when they were last fed and what they were fed on. We use reputable shops who give you this information usually before you ask it.

When I got my first Royal I offered him food in the first week. That was a mistake. He wouldn't look at it and I turned to a well known American snake forum for advice. The advice I was given is what I've reproduced above. It took my first Royal 3 weeks to start eating. He eats all the time now. Loves his food. My rescue I had about 5 days and as I was feeding the rest of the snakes I offered him food and he ate it. He's also a good eater. Our youngest Royal (we've had her about 8 weeks now) we let settle in for about 5 or 6 days, no handling just going into her viv to give her fresh water and she eats like she's never seen food before. Great little feeder and like my other Royals, sheds like a dream.

Every snake is different. My two snakes I got on Sunday - a baby Cross Pinesnake/Bullsnake and a Cali Kingsnake I've let settle in but they're showing signs of being hungry - they're both out and on the prowl so they'll get fed tomorrow. Don't envisage any problems with them.

I always use paper towel in all of my vivs. The paper towel company must think I've got shares in them! Best thing I think as it's quick and easy to change and hygienic and quickly shows up any nasties like mites if you get a new snake.

The Snake Guru · 08-15-07, 07:45 PM

To tell you the truth...a week of "settling in" without food is not going to stress out a snake, snakes aren't like other critters that go through -hunger pains- from skipping a week here and there...it's part of thier natural function, they are made to go expanses without food. On this point I have to agree with "fionak" I do believe feeding too early in the "settling in" process can actually cause more harm than good. In fact as a general rule I don't feed any of my new snakes for the first week....not just balls.

At anyrate, just my opinion.
~B~

fionak · 08-16-07, 10:12 AM

Absolutely agree Snake Guru. It's a mistake many people (including myself) make when they first get a baby Royal, the second is handling it too much too soon. So difficult to keep you hands off them when all you want to do is handle them but waiting until they've established a good feeding routine (at least 4 feeds) pays dividends.

My new Pine/Bullsnake and Cali babies are out on the prowl again now so later on this evening I'll offer them food. I have a feeling that they won't disappoint me

The Snake Guru · 08-16-07, 11:59 AM

LOL, yeah isn't that the truth!

And yeah you just gotta love bulls....one of the snakes I know that can eat one day, crap it out on day 2 and be ready and willing to go again! LOL Fun snakes though, I just love Pits.
~B~

fionak · 08-17-07, 10:14 AM

Well, I offered them food last night and they didn't disappoint me. The Pine/Bullsnake went all shy, wouldn't strike so I left the mouse (f/t) just infront of his hide. Five minutes later mouse gone. Second mouse went the same way.

The baby Kingsnake is a good striker. I only defrosted 2 pinkies for her which she disposed of very quickly - and was still looking for more. I love it when a new snake feeds for the first time with me. They'll get fed again on Monday evening. This time I'll defrost 4 pinkies for the Kingsnake. I have a feeling she'll eat them all. I think she's just on the small side to handle fuzzies at the moment but I don't think it will be long before she does.