Staple diets

[kidchameleon]

haha, well yeah, i guess. what else can you really do? im sure there is some way to set up a trap, but i jut dont know it. good luck

[panther_dude]

YES JUST BUY A BIG FEILD NET AND RUN IT THROUGH SOME LONG GRASS. fROM THERE YOU CAN PICK OUT ANY INSECTS THAT MIGHT BITE, STING, OR BE POISIONIS.

aLSO YOU WONT REALLY HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT PARASITES IN THE BUGS. NOT MANY INSECTS CEPT FOR SOME ANT SPECIES GET PARRASITES.

jUST MAKE 110% SURE THAT NO PESTISIDES ARE USED IN THAT AREA.

iT ALSO SEEMS TO ME THAT PEOPLE ARE JUST REPEATING WHAT i AM SAYING, BUT JUST WORDING IT DIFFERENTLY. i DONT MIND BUT ITS REALLY NOT NEEDED.

GOOD LUCK
WADE

[meow_mix450]

there are indeed ways of catching bugs jsut gotta search

Meow

[panther_dude]

meow mix i woukld not use the silk worms as a staple diet but rather a little treat once in a while. They are very high in fat and protein, too much of these could possibly harm your chameleon. but deffinaTLY make it way over weight.

[dank7oo]

Silks are the BEST staple diet for chams if you can get ahold of them. Crix would be a second best bet. Superworms as a third choice. Superworms reeally arent all that bad, and for chameleond with tongue problems (like Ichiro or Roziel) they aer the only meams of letting those chams catch their food as supposed to force feeding.

Jason

[DragnDrop]

Originally posted by panther_dude
meow mix i woukld not use the silk worms as a staple diet but rather a little treat once in a while. They are very high in fat and protein, too much of these could possibly harm your chameleon. but deffinaTLY make it way over weight.

Silkworms are high in fat??????? Since when? Where did you read that bit of info? I've never seen anything that said silkies are high in fat. They do have more protein, but that doesn't make them a bad food choice. Are you confusing them with waxworms?

Typical analysis comparing crickets and silkworms:

Livefood Supplies from Seritech (U.K.)

Silkworms Fat 10.6% Crude Protein 63.8%

Crickets Fat 22.7% Crude Protein 11.4%


Any silk/web/cocoon producing insect will be high in calcium and probably protein too.



You might get some benefit from reading this article: Nutrition by Dr. Sue Donoghue VMD, DACVN at Chameleon News Online E-zine. The article discusses the use and benefits of silkworms. Personally, I'd use silkworms over crickets if I could afford them as a constant diet.

[vipervenom]

Yeah. Silkworms are a heck of a lot healthier than cricks. If I could find it I would post the nutrition chart I had for cricks and different worms. I think you are thinking about mealies or wax worms. But Silkies are one of the best staple foods (besides wild insects IMO) you can find.

[Kyle Walkinshaw]

panther_dude says : iT ALSO SEEMS TO ME THAT PEOPLE ARE JUST REPEATING WHAT i AM SAYING, BUT JUST WORDING IT DIFFERENTLY. i DONT MIND BUT ITS REALLY NOT NEEDED

LOL, where was this?

Anyhow, about recommending wild bugs, just WHY? Even if your "110% sure" that the bugs came from a non-fertilized area, what makes you think that those bugs you got didnt just travel from 10-20 kilometers away where they just chowed down on a toxic buffet of fertilized grass? The only way to collect wild insects is if you know exactly what they are and how your animal will react to them. If you don't know what your feeding then all your doing is getting free food to avoid the cost of crickets and worms and if you can't afford those, you shouldnt own a lizard. IMO.

[Bartman]

I agree with kyle, theirs absolutly no need to get things from the wild. You can get what they need in stores or online and you can be sure they dont have pesticides.

Heres that chart you were askin about.

http://www.canadianfeeders.com/faq.shtml#nine

[meow_mix450]

a very good point made you really cant be 110% sure there free from pesticies, but maybe WC then bred?? just a thought, we all got our opinions on this

Meow

[panther_dude]

oh my lord. Yes there is a big difference in wild caught and captive bred insects.
For one thing insects unless they are magritory they do not travel for miles. If they are in an area with lots of different sorts of vegitation and are safe from predators they have no reason to travel so far. They only move those far distances when there food supply has run out or feel threatened.
If you go to a farmers feild that has lets say 40 acrse or even 10 that you know doesnt use pestisides there will not be a probleme.

Now your saying well just buy the insects from stores its the same thing, you just dont want to spend the money.
Well actually no its not the same thing. Wild insects are able to gut load themselves. They are constantly eating a healthy food source that makes them really nutritouse. Its been proven over and over that they are better for your chameleons by top vets and herptologists. So I dont see why you guys are trying to argue with me over this

Breeding captive insects is still the same as buying them from the store because they are still eating commercial gut loads. In reality wc insects are only good for a period of 24 hours. after this time they lose the natural gut load they have and start eating the commmercail stuff which is still good but not as good as a wild diet.

oh ya my bad bout the silkies i was thinnking wax worms

Oh ya kyle I make 14 bucks an hour buying feeders is no probleme why dont you keep stupid commments like that to your self. I think you need to do some research on wild caught insects, its not the fact of saving money they are better for you herps. Ask anyone who actually knows what they are talking about.

wade shaw

[meow_mix450]

lets not start aguring here lol, we all got our opinions on this, are butter worms high in fat too???

Meow

[panther_dude]

I am not starting an argument but stating the facts that wild caught insects should be a major part of your chameleons diet.

But for some reason people who havent even studied the issue always have so much to say about it.

[meow_mix450]

i agree but most people here dont own that 10 acrse of land here, most of us live near a town or a city where pesticies are sprayed near the area, but i beleive this is now banned. Next year we should be able to use all the insects, but years before people didnt want to take the risk, of killing your cham. But you do have a good point

Meow

[CHRISANDBOIDS14]

I dont see what Kyle did wrong and what you making 14 bucks an hour buying insects(how do you make money buying things?) has to do with anything? I didnt see any stupid comments either.

I think that captive bred insects, with SPECIALY prepared gutload that has the nutrition all figured out is better than wild diets. Sure, they may get more variety, but with the gutloads we make, we can be assured the nutrients needed will be there, there will be no problems related to toxicity(it is spelled like that) and worrying about parasites can be eliminated. Insects can and do travel. An insect(such as a grasshopper) is not guaranteed to stay on someones 10 acres. It can, and will probably, travel around the surrounding areas too. Did you know that pesticides can and do travel 25km through the air? I have 40 acres myself, and do not harvest any of the bugs, even though I know that the closest farmer/s using pesticides are 6km away.

On the note of meal and superworms. Mealworms have a thicker exoskeleton than superworms, and therefore would carry more of that chitin(sp?), and have less space in their boddies to carry nutritious fibers/foods. Superworms are also available in all sizes mealworms come in, they just arent commonly provided in those sizes.

Also, back on the note of wildcaught insects. As stated by Meow, who would want to take the risk of killing their cham, or any other herp? If you lost a herp due to pesticides on some wildcaught bugs, how would you feel?

C.