Ethics of snake food...

[D Grade]

Originally Posted by pet_snake_78

I do cringe when I see the stereotypical video feed of someone feeding live to the tune of a Screamo band. It's pretty well accepted that snakes should be on F/t when possible for the benefit of all involved. However, when people become so far from the sources of our food, as most are today, we begin to become divorced from the reality of the food chain. Just by existing every human on earth is killing thousands of animals. The house you live in has killed dozens of animals when being built and prevented hundreds of others from having a place to be born and live. The roads you drive on kill and injure tens of thousands of animals daily.. right now there are deer with broken legs waiting to die, turtles about to be smashed by oncoming traffic, etc. Right now there are chickens being killed so you can eat. Cows will be slaughtered today and the meat hung on a hook. SO in retrospect, do I think feeding a thawed mouse to a snake is a moral issue... no way.

Even if you don't eat meat, you will kill thousands of animals. Pesticides, land clear, tractors chopping animals to pieces, water being taken from wildlife habitat and sprayed onto monocultured fields designed specifically to prevent any type of ecosystem from living in there so the plants can maximize their enegy, etc. There is no way any human can exist without resulting in the death of thousands if not millions of other animals in his or her lifetime.

Originally Posted by Albert Clark

Mice and rats have been wreaking havoc on populations throughout history. They spread diseases and destroy crops. They have been a scourge and a danger to infants and children in inner cities for eons. Oh, they do have cute faces and the ability to have higher brain functions but look at the motis operandi of rodents. They live in filth and are always creating enviornments that turn into cesspools and breeding grounds for disease. Reptiles have been keeping rodent populations in check for years and that is a good thing. As well, the kingsnakes deserve credit for the way they keep rattlesnake populations down. Rattlesnakes bite a lot of people adult and child alike. They cause death and disability across the world. What would this world be like without reptiles in general? I shudder to think......

Best two responses in this thread.

Originally Posted by prairiepanda

To be honest, the one that bothers me the most is the cat food. I really have no idea how those meat animals are treated. Unfortunately I don't really have a choice because my cat requires a prescription diet. Otherwise I would be just as picky with her food as with everyone else's. But I'm not going to disown my cat because of questionable meat sources. I know even ethical farms cause other animals to suffer via habitat destruction, so I can't really escape that anyway.

Cat and dog food companies buy their "meal" in bulk from rendering plants. I used to work at one so Ill tell you whats in dog and cat food and hopefully persuade you and everyone here not to ever eat cat or dog food and to never let your kids get into it and decide to try it. Heres a list of everything that goes into dog and cat food.

- Spoiled or expired meats from grocery stores (beef, chicken, seafood, etc)
- Expired meats from fast food chains
- Dead livestock (cows, horses, etc)
- Road kill

So how does it work? Believe it or not there are people who specialize in removing dead livestock from farms and ranches for a living. They are paid by the people to come remove them and then are paid by the rendering plant by the pound for what they bring in. Since that is the case, they will pick up road kill along the way to gain every precious pound for the money. The rendering plants receive these dead animals rotting, decayed, rigamortis (spelling), and occasionally freshly dead. They're thrown into a grinder (full bowels and full bladders as-is). Next, the trucks from grocery stores and fast food chains show up and unload hundreds of pounds of expired meats of all types that the rendering plant buys discounted, they are also thrown into that same grinder. Everything is then sent into a large cooker and ground into a powder. The rendering plant then sells that ground powder to massive cat and dog food chains like Purina, Friskies, Fancy Feast, etc for a large profit. The food chains then add artificial flavoring they desire and mold the powder into whatever little fancy shape they want.

And that folks is where cat and dog food come from. And yes, it was one of the most disgusting jobs Ive ever had.

[prairiepanda]

Originally Posted by D Grade

Best two responses in this thread.



Cat and dog food companies buy their "meal" in bulk from rendering plants. I used to work at one so Ill tell you whats in dog and cat food and hopefully persuade you and everyone here not to ever eat cat or dog food and to never let your kids get into it and decide to try it. Heres a list of everything that goes into dog and cat food.

- Spoiled or expired meats from grocery stores (beef, chicken, seafood, etc)
- Expired meats from fast food chains
- Dead livestock (cows, horses, etc)
- Road kill

So how does it work? Believe it or not there are people who specialize in removing dead livestock from farms and ranches for a living. They are paid by the people to come remove them and then are paid by the rendering plant by the pound for what they bring in. Since that is the case, they will pick up road kill along the way to gain every precious pound for the money. The rendering plants receive these dead animals rotting, decayed, rigamortis (spelling), and occasionally freshly dead. They're thrown into a grinder (full bowels and full bladders as-is). Next, the trucks from grocery stores and fast food chains show up and unload hundreds of pounds of expired meats of all types that the rendering plant buys discounted, they are also thrown into that same grinder. Everything is then sent into a large cooker and ground into a powder. The rendering plant then sells that ground powder to massive cat and dog food chains like Purina, Friskies, Fancy Feast, etc for a large profit. The food chains then add artificial flavoring they desire and mold the powder into whatever little fancy shape they want.

And that folks is where cat and dog food come from. And yes, it was one of the most disgusting jobs Ive ever had.

I'm aware of such meat rendering plants, but I was under the impression that the slurries and powders resulting from that process went elsewhere. After all, if the meat in pet food came from some horrible almagamation of mystery animals, how could they list the ingredients by weight? Many pet foods now are listed as safe for human consumption, so they must adhere to the same food safety standards as our own food. I'm sure plenty of the poultry, fish, rabbit, etc. in my cat's food comes from sources that treat their animals poorly, but I would not expect any to come from a mystery meat rendering plant. I might have believed that back before pet foods become so strictly regulated, but not now. Pet food manufacturers can't legally list "chicken" as an ingredient when they really mean "powdered deer, cow, skunk, horse, etc." Even "chicken by-product meal" has restrictions on what it can contain, and honestly I wouldn't be disturbed at all to see it as an ingredient in human foods even though it looks nasty when they're making it. It's still edible and nutritious.

Expired grocery store meat? Maybe. But I eat that too because it's mega cheap.

[SoPhilly]

Originally Posted by prairiepanda

I'm aware of such meat rendering plants, but I was under the impression that the slurries and powders resulting from that process went elsewhere. After all, if the meat in pet food came from some horrible almagamation of mystery animals, how could they list the ingredients by weight? Many pet foods now are listed as safe for human consumption, so they must adhere to the same food safety standards as our own food. I'm sure plenty of the poultry, fish, rabbit, etc. in my cat's food comes from sources that treat their animals poorly, but I would not expect any to come from a mystery meat rendering plant. I might have believed that back before pet foods become so strictly regulated, but not now. Pet food manufacturers can't legally list "chicken" as an ingredient when they really mean "powdered deer, cow, skunk, horse, etc." Even "chicken by-product meal" has restrictions on what it can contain, and honestly I wouldn't be disturbed at all to see it as an ingredient in human foods even though it looks nasty when they're making it. It's still edible and nutritious.

Expired grocery store meat? Maybe. But I eat that too because it's mega cheap.

You're half right. If the ingredients list says "chicken-by-product meal", then legally, that has to come from chickens. But you're obviously buying expensive to medium priced dog food if that's the worst you're seeing. LOTS of dog foods still contain "animal-by-product meal", which can be ANYTHING, and is a result of the roadkill/expired supermarket/dead farm animal slurry. Also watch out for "Animal fat", Meat-by-products" and "Meat and bone meal". It's in Purina Puppy Chow, Pedigree, Alpo, Beneful...

Legally, they're not lying to you.

Not saying there arent good dog/cat foods out there, but they're expensive and it's hard to tell.

So yeah, feeding my snakes a whole, intact, somewhat humanely killed single rodent is ethically fantastic to me, by comparison.

[D Grade]

Originally Posted by prairiepanda

I'm aware of such meat rendering plants, but I was under the impression that the slurries and powders resulting from that process went elsewhere. After all, if the meat in pet food came from some horrible almagamation of mystery animals, how could they list the ingredients by weight? Many pet foods now are listed as safe for human consumption, so they must adhere to the same food safety standards as our own food. I'm sure plenty of the poultry, fish, rabbit, etc. in my cat's food comes from sources that treat their animals poorly, but I would not expect any to come from a mystery meat rendering plant. I might have believed that back before pet foods become so strictly regulated, but not now. Pet food manufacturers can't legally list "chicken" as an ingredient when they really mean "powdered deer, cow, skunk, horse, etc." Even "chicken by-product meal" has restrictions on what it can contain, and honestly I wouldn't be disturbed at all to see it as an ingredient in human foods even though it looks nasty when they're making it. It's still edible and nutritious.

Expired grocery store meat? Maybe. But I eat that too because it's mega cheap.

You would be suprised. We live in a world where you cant believe everything you read, see, or hear because thats how sad a large majority of the human race is. If the government is REALLY regulating pet food, then why arent they regulating human food? Why are we still allowed to buy "sugar free" soft drinks and food that are loaded with artificial sweeteners which contain aspartime which is well documented to cause cancer and kidney issues? Because they care about animals more than humans? It wouldnt suprise me but I highly doubt it. If the FDA approves such disease causing chemicals in our food, why on earth are they truly going to care about where pet food is sources from?