Your view of the reptile hobby

[Aaron_S]

Originally Posted by Mikoh4792

My fault, I chose the wrong words.

I did not mean to say the people running the expos were to blame. I should have just said "There are too many ball pythons at expos".

Here's a good question, instead of complaining about it on the internet, what are you currently doing to change it?

[Mikoh4792]

Originally Posted by Aaron_S

Here's a good question, instead of complaining about it on the internet, what are you currently doing to change it?

Not exactly complaining, just expressing my views on the forum. Do I need to take action for every view I have? I personally don't see the overwhelming number of ball pythons at expos as a big deal. It's just something I'm stating while we are on the subject.

[Aaron_S]

Originally Posted by Mikoh4792

Not exactly complaining, just expressing my views on the forum. Do I need to take action for every view I have? I personally don't see the overwhelming number of ball pythons at expos as a big deal. It's just something I'm stating while we are on the subject.

Originally Posted by Mikoh4792

Ball pythons at expos are like collectors items. Oh look! a new and shiny toy! Same with non-locale morph boas.

If I ever get a ball python I'm owning a normal one.

Hmm if that's just a "view" it's rather negative and judgemental to a particular group within the hobby don't you think?

It followed a number of posts with the same sentiment about ball python keepers and their mentalities. I am not putting words into anyone's mouth because this is the context of which the poster's used.

...when I gave my opinion on how I think people are viewing these animals in the wrong way...

This is another quote of yours.
You want to give your opinion that people have a "wrong view" of these animals then what are you doing to help change that?

This is YOUR question essentially at the start of this thread. It's clear you want this "wrong view" to change so what are you doing to help change it?!

[Mikoh4792]

Originally Posted by Aaron_S

Hmm if that's just a "view" it's rather negative and judgemental to a particular group within the hobby don't you think?

It followed a number of posts with the same sentiment about ball python keepers and their mentalities. I am not putting words into anyone's mouth because this is the context of which the poster's used.

This is another quote of yours.
You want to give your opinion that people have a "wrong view" of these animals then what are you doing to help change that?

This is YOUR question essentially at the start of this thread. It's clear you want this "wrong view" to change so what are you doing to help change it?!

Judgmental and negative? Yes. It was meant to be. If I think something is "wrong" it means I am judging and viewing it in a negative light. It's common sense and self explanatory.

What am I going to do about it? To tell you the truth I'm not so sure. I don't breed snakes yet, nor can I tell people to stop breeding ball python morphs.

I am just here to discuss people's views and opinions, I don't need to take any action. Again, the fact that expos are overrun with ball pythons is an annoyance, it's not a serious problem. Why do I have to do anything? Are you trying to stop me from expressing my views here with a similar philosophy of "If you're not going to do something about it, don't say anything bad about it"?

Well what I am doing about it is spreading ideas by discussion. That's as far as I'll go.

[Mikoh4792]

Originally Posted by Aaron_S

It followed a number of posts with the same sentiment about ball python keepers and their mentalities. I am not putting words into anyone's mouth because this is the context of which the poster's used.

Nothing against ball pythons keepers, breeders, fans...etc. Just with the overwhelming fascination with morphs. And if it were to go the same way with my favorite genus Morelia, I'd be saying the same thing. It just so happens that right now my view is aimed towards ball pythons... since it's a good example

And to add to my last post, the reason why I won't do much about it is because it's peoples' freedom to keep and breed what they want. If I don't like it, I'll just say it, I'm not going to actually try to stop people from doing what they do as long as others are not harmed.

[Aaron_S]

Originally Posted by Mikoh4792

Nothing against ball pythons keepers, breeders, fans...etc. Just with the overwhelming fascination with morphs. And if it were to go the same way with my favorite genus Morelia, I'd be saying the same thing. It just so happens that right now my view is aimed towards ball pythons... since it's a good example

And to add to my last post, the reason why I won't do much about it is because it's peoples' freedom to keep and breed what they want. If I don't like it, I'll just say it, I'm not going to actually try to stop people from doing what they do as long as others are not harmed.

A lot of people express the same "annoyance" with ball pythons and other commonly bred species being prevalent at expos. Yet none of those people are willing to change that. So why even mention it? Especially in a thread about changing the hobby. It's odd to talk about change then say there's no reason not to. Kind of makes the discussion moot if no one is willing to change anything...

You must be fairly new to the hobby. Carpet pythons had their time in the sunlight and people were buying them like crazy to make Jaguar this and that. It actually picked back up a few years ago with the zebra's and granites and albinos.

Nothing quite like the ball python world but it sure did happen where people were buying them up for the "next big thing". So it already happened with your favourite.

[Mikoh4792]

Originally Posted by Aaron_S

A lot of people express the same "annoyance" with ball pythons and other commonly bred species being prevalent at expos. Yet none of those people are willing to change that. So why even mention it? Especially in a thread about changing the hobby. It's odd to talk about change then say there's no reason not to. Kind of makes the discussion moot if no one is willing to change anything...

Never said there's no reason not to. Just saying I probably can't make much of a difference myself since a) I'm not a big name breeder b) I can't tell others not to breed ball python morphs. But the change is something I would like to see....which was actually the original theme of the thread. I can discuss this can I not? Call it moot if you want, I'm just here to discuss. If you don't see a point in this, you don't need to participate.

Again you seem to be missing my point. What I'm doing about it is discussing it, spreading ideas, sharing ideas....etc. Conversation goes a long way. I'm not going to be a hero and take radical action against this trivial annoyance. Stop trying to get me to do something about it! LOL

You must be fairly new to the hobby. Carpet pythons had their time in the sunlight and people were buying them like crazy to make Jaguar this and that. It actually picked back up a few years ago with the zebra's and granites and albinos.

Nothing quite like the ball python world but it sure did happen where people were buying them up for the "next big thing". So it already happened with your favourite.

Fairly new yes. Not completely new.

I am well aware of how carpet pythons were then and are now . However as you said yourself, it's not nearly as bad. Not so bad it takes up the majority of most expos. Not so bad since there is still a valuable market for "normals and locales". Within any given genus/species....etc there are people who will just like the species for the morphs. When it comes to jags and such... I also view that aspect of carpet pythons in a negative way, and I talk about it when it is relevant.

But since it is relevant now, yes even with carpet pythons I don't get the whole craze over jaguars... but I'm not trying to stop people from keeping/breeding them.

[Aaron_S]

Originally Posted by Mikoh4792

Never said there's no reason not to. Just saying I probably can't make much of a difference myself since a) I'm not a big name breeder b) I can't tell others not to breed ball python morphs. But the change is something I would like to see....which was actually the original theme of the thread. I can discuss this can I not? Call it moot if you want, I'm just here to discuss. If you don't see a point in this, you don't need to participate.

Again you seem to be missing my point. What I'm doing about it is discussing it, spreading ideas, sharing ideas....etc. Conversation goes a long way. I'm not going to be a hero and take radical action against this trivial annoyance. Stop trying to get me to do something about it! LOL



Fairly new yes. Not completely new.

I am well aware of how carpet pythons were then and are now . However as you said yourself, it's not nearly as bad. Not so bad it takes up the majority of most expos. Not so bad since there is still a valuable market for "normals and locales". Within any given genus/species....etc there are people who will just like the species for the morphs. When it comes to jags and such... I also view that aspect of carpet pythons in a negative way, and I talk about it when it is relevant.

But since it is relevant now, yes even with carpet pythons I don't get the whole craze over jaguars... but I'm not trying to stop people from keeping/breeding them.

You want to know why carpet pythons never caught on like ball pythons? Nobody fricking wanted to buy them. People grow tired of the "different" and all that species entails. They go back to the ball pythons or other "easy" species.

Secondly, this has been discussed for YEARS about change. You've brought nothing new to the table. Conversation DOES NOT go a long way because this conversation has been done at least yearly for the past 5 years. Yet, there's still no change....I've been around long enough to actually know this by the way.

If it's so trivial then why even make a thread about changing the landscape of the hobby? You clearly are talking out two sides of your mouth just to always try and keep your self in some positive light.

What makes anyone think that because they aren't a "big name" they can't change something? You know you could raise up some snakes of whatever species. Get a table at a show and change just that single table from xx common morph to something "different". Simple as that.

Don't come asking others to change when you yourself aren't even open to doing it yourself.

You're also the only one currently even talking in this thread and it's an open call to be honest. ANYONE who doesn't like ball pythons being so prevalent at expos should step up and make a change themselves. Heck just go and get 2 other friends to buy a pair of a different species too and you can all split on a table at a show and hock 3 "brand new" and "different" species.

[formica]

Originally Posted by Aaron_S

Here's a good question, instead of complaining about it on the internet, what are you currently doing to change it?

here is a better question, what exactly is your point? what have you brought to this discussion which is of any value to the topic? all I can see are comments designed to belittle anyone with an opinion, with no participation in the discussion itself. they have a word for that you know.

sounds to me like you are being contrary just for its own sake. and there is little value in that - it certainly has less value than the discussion itself.


and FYI, in a world which values intelligent decision making; discussion's, come before actions.

[Aaron_S]

Originally Posted by formica

here is a better question, what exactly is your point? what have you brought to this discussion which is of any value to the topic? all I can see are comments designed to belittle anyone with an opinion, with no participation in the discussion itself. they have a word for that you know.

sounds to me like you are being contrary just for its own sake. and there is little value in that - it certainly has less value than the discussion itself.


and FYI, in a world which values intelligent decision making; discussion's, come before actions.

My point is simple. People came to this thread and belittled MY hobby. I defended it.

and FYI this "discussion" has been going on for YEARS. When does action occur?

Here are two instances where I was involved in the discussion. You can stop trying to paint me in one particular light that you see me in.

http://www.ssnakess.com/forums/900946-post39.html

http://www.ssnakess.com/forums/900945-post38.html

I await my apology for lying about me and my participation in the discussion.

[formica]

Originally Posted by Aaron_S

My point is simple. People came to this thread and belittled MY hobby. I defended it.

and FYI this "discussion" has been going on for YEARS. When does action occur?

Here are two instances where I was involved in the discussion. You can stop trying to paint me in one particular light that you see me in.

http://www.ssnakess.com/forums/900946-post39.html

http://www.ssnakess.com/forums/900945-post38.html

I await my apology for lying about me and my participation in the discussion.

neither of those links are about this topic.

this is not YOUR hobby, it is all of ours, and nothing ever progresses without criticism, i dont see why you feel the need to take it personally and then attack everyone who points out things which need to be pointed out....because currently, people are happy to just forget those problems exist. Its really no wonder there are so many direct action and lobby groups attacking OUR hobby.

[Mikoh4792]

Originally Posted by formica

neither of those links are about this topic.

this is not YOUR hobby, it is all of ours, and nothing ever progresses without criticism, i dont see why you feel the need to take it personally and then attack everyone who points out things which need to be pointed out....because currently, people are happy to just forget those problems exist. Its really no wonder there are so many direct action and lobby groups attacking OUR hobby.

It's alright, there's no need to continue this. This back and forth started from him feeling personally attacked at people criticizing the ball python morph craze. Whatever you or I say will not make him stop. I've tried to make him understand that the point of my statements were to just express my opinions but apparently he felt attacked and wants me to feel bad for not "doing anything about it".

He labels it "complaining, "whining", "lazy" when I'm just expressing my thoughts on a thread.

[Aaron_S]

Originally Posted by formica

neither of those links are about this topic.

this is not YOUR hobby, it is all of ours, and nothing ever progresses without criticism, i dont see why you feel the need to take it personally and then attack everyone who points out things which need to be pointed out....because currently, people are happy to just forget those problems exist. Its really no wonder there are so many direct action and lobby groups attacking OUR hobby.

The topic is about change? How were those not about change? I answered someone's further inquiry into changing a specific topic in the current hobby.

Are you now telling me what I can and cannot discuss and how it's irrelavent to what YOU want to talk about? Nothing has to be railroaded into a specific topic...if it was considered detrimental to the conversation then the mods would deal with it.