border
sSNAKESs : Reptile Forum
 

Go Back   sSNAKESs : Reptile Forum > Community Forums > General Discussion

Notices

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 04-01-13, 05:42 PM   #1
Stephan Grundy
Member
 
Join Date: Feb-2013
Location: Shinrone
Posts: 13
Country:
Re: Reptillian Theories

There's also the issue of brooding behaviour, e.g., the way a female python will "shiver" to raise heat for her eggs. This kind of behaviour fits with bird brooding behaviour, and birds certainly tend to show the close bonding we think of as "love".
While this is very rudimentary in terms of social bonds, it implies some instinct-guided capability to be aware of the well-being of creatures beyond oneself. I think snakes are pretty short on this capability, though other reptiles can demonstrate it to a surprising degree in parental behaviour.

As far as happiness in snakes - we probably do need to learn a lot more before we can even tell from a brain scan. As a keeper, I consider eating on schedule, being in good physical condition, and not engaging in obvious discontented behaviour to be pretty much a win! I don't know if we'll ever know when a snake is genuinely happy, if snakes even can feel what we consider to be happiness, but I don't doubt at all that I can usually tell when one of mine is *unhappy*.
Stephan Grundy is offline  
Login to remove ads
Old 04-01-13, 06:57 PM   #2
StudentoReptile
Member
 
StudentoReptile's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr-2012
Location: Alabama
Posts: 1,850
Country:
Re: Reptillian Theories

Personally, I think the brooding aspect is a stretch. It's just a mechanism the female uses to help increase the chances of her eggs surviving = successful passing of genetic material. Its millions of years of instinctual behavior; the female snake does it because her body/hormones tell her its what she is supposed to do. She is not making any conscious decision or choice to be near the eggs. In some cases, the eggs may turn bad and her body will tell her this, and she will move on.
__________________
www.MDCrabtree.com
StudentoReptile is offline  
Old 04-02-13, 04:03 AM   #3
Stephan Grundy
Member
 
Join Date: Feb-2013
Location: Shinrone
Posts: 13
Country:
Re: Reptillian Theories

Quote:
Originally Posted by StudentoReptile View Post
Personally, I think the brooding aspect is a stretch. It's just a mechanism the female uses to help increase the chances of her eggs surviving = successful passing of genetic material. Its millions of years of instinctual behavior; the female snake does it because her body/hormones tell her its what she is supposed to do. She is not making any conscious decision or choice to be near the eggs. In some cases, the eggs may turn bad and her body will tell her this, and she will move on.
Well, yes, but you could make the exact same argument for mammalian mothering behavior - and note that mammal mothers of many species will instinctively eat their babies if there is a severe food shortage or ongoing threat-stress, and move on without, as far as we can tell, ever looking back.
Ultimately, one could argue that *all* parental-care behaviour is a mechanism used to increase the chances of genetic material surviving, with the capacity for what we most usually call "parental love" (in its ultimate form, the parent's willingness to sacrifice themself for a child - which is very much culturally determined; the closer to the edge a human population is, the more likely it is for cultural norms to include various forms of sacrificing the infant, non-contributive for years and with the lowest chance of survival, in order to preserve the healthy adult who can help keep the tribe alive and may produce more children in better times) increasing with increased time-binding ability and social character of the species.
I am by no means suggesting that mama python feels the same way about her eggs that mama human, or even mama rabbit, does about the child or litter in her womb - it is fairly certain that she doesn't, and I think extremely certain that, unlike just about any mammalian species, mama python is very highly unlikely ever to transfer any aspect of those rudimentary family instincts to anything other than her eggs. But the presence of instinctive parental behaviour is the first necessary step in developing the wider complex of hormonally-supported instinctive behaviour that we think of as "love" - the big difference with us being that humans can and constantly do transfer the initial instinctive emotion to all sorts of non-reproduction-related beings, objects, and even abstract ideals! Are snakes ever going to take another step in that direction? I doubt it, unless the world changes in ways rather more severe than gently shifting back towards another period of climactic optimum.
Stephan Grundy is offline  
Old 04-03-13, 11:37 AM   #4
Trollbie
Member
 
Trollbie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar-2012
Location: Hippieland
Age: 36
Posts: 2,321
Country:
Re: Reptillian Theories

I want a King Cobra best friend!


I am actually interested in researching this stuff. Maybe I could use my degree towards it.
__________________
Trollin'
Trollbie is offline  
Closed Thread

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 09:27 AM.

Powered by vBulletin®
©2000 - 2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 2002-2023, Hobby Solutions.

right