Nurseries

HeatherRose · 01-20-05, 11:50 PM

Can everyone post pictures of their chameleon nursery cages, or at least help me out with a description of one that works? I'm in the process of preparing to *think* about starting to put together one myself, and am having some trouble with it.

Thanks in advance!

roocat71 · 01-21-05, 07:47 AM

Check out this article in the current issue - "- Experiences in Raising Baby Chameleons: Franco Gagliardi". This is how I setup baby cham enclosures.

-roo

http://www.chameleonnews.com/

Double J · 01-21-05, 08:52 AM

Here is a rundown of the setup I have used for years:

I have generally used ten gallon tanks, of course with screen tops. I have paper towel on the bottom, which is changed every few days. I have always moistened the tank bottom to get the paper towelling to "stick"..... as this prevents crickets from getting underneath.
For climbing apparatus, I have used incredibly thin twigs and fake dollar store plants with very think stalks.
I tend to keep the numbers around 5-7 juveniles per tank... and that said, the tank is densely "planted," and that density of chams is really only for a month or so, as by that time they are wholesaled for the most part.
Though the ten gallon tank is likely to get a questionable response from others as glass tends to be against current dogma, this nursery setup has worked wonderfully for me for years, and such I have successfully hatched out baby veileds in the neighborhood of 500 animals. Let's not forget also that a 12 inch tall ten gallon tank with a screen top results in fabulous ventilation.. so that is of no concern here.
For holdbacks, I split them up after a month or so, and the setups have been the same. They are out of the ten gallon tanks and into larger, screen enclosures around three months.
As I said, this has worked beautifully for me for years.... and I am currently holding back a female... so if I can find the time after my lectures today (you gotta love Anthropology)... I will post a pic of my nursery tank.

meow_mix450 · 01-21-05, 09:06 AM

nop your not gonna get any glass comments, its exceptable when it comes to rasising babys in my opinion. My babys are about to hatch any time soon, but i use 5 gallons because they fit my stand. Pretty much my steup is like what roo's link is. I find that those kritter cages cost a lot more then they really need to be. So i went with tanks instead. The only problem that i have not countered yet is how im gonna stop fruit flys from getter out.

Umm ill post pictures after my exams, its killing me right now. SHouldnt even be on here lol o well

Meow

RDexotics · 01-21-05, 09:47 AM

I use basically the same set-up everyone else described. Except I built these little things to put under the heat light.

I found in the morning, when they'd go to warm up they'd end up crawling all over each other trying to get the best position under the light. This way they just stick to one little branch each and all get a chance to thermo-regulate without the stress of the others climbing on them constantly.

meow_mix450 · 01-21-05, 02:20 PM

haha!!! isnt that kool. I use to amke those for my bird lol

Meow

galad · 01-21-05, 03:36 PM

yea thats all good. But like it expalins in that article on raising nosy be on chameleonnews.

It would be better to raise your chameleons individually. Otherwise how do you know how much each chameleon is eating?

I think The author uses clear plastic rubmaid type bins about 1 foot high and a foot squared. There are a few bundles of fake leaves in there with climbing perches. The bottom has paper towel, and the top is covered with white shade cloth and secured with a rubber band around the edge. They are placed in a rack with a uvb florestent above them. Ambient room temps should be around 80 degrees and anyother heat sorce they need they get from the floresent above.

Again I would sudjest keeping the babies seperate so you can properly monitor how much eachone weighs and eats.

How do you guys determine which chameleon is wich when they are housed together? DOnt they pretty much all look the same?
I havent had babies yet so I dont really know how hard it is to distinguish one from the other.
good luck

peace

ws

Double J · 01-21-05, 03:46 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by galad

It would be better to raise your chameleons individually. Otherwise how do you know how much each chameleon is eating?

......Again I would sudjest keeping the babies seperate so you can properly monitor how much eachone weighs and eats.

How do you guys determine which chameleon is wich when they are housed together? DOnt they pretty much all look the same?
I havent had babies yet so I dont really know how hard it is to distinguish one from the other.
good luck

peace

ws

When you are hatching out 35+ veiled chameleons per clutch and keeping them for over a month...... you realistically cannot house them all individually, especially when if you already have a fair sized collection. That is why I house around 5 per tank. Ideally.. yes, I would house them ndividually if I had the time and money... but my methods have worked quite well for myself and other keepers.. so why change it?

And trust me...... they all eat

Double J

meow_mix450 · 01-21-05, 04:08 PM

good point made, jsut about to say the same thing

Meow

Manitoban Herps · 01-21-05, 04:27 PM

If you do not have the space to house 35 babys you shouldn't breed them. i perfer to house my babys seperately, I know I would with my cham if I ever got a female for him.

EDIT - But since they all eat fine and everything good, my above statement doesn't really matter

DragnDrop · 01-21-05, 05:25 PM

I don't have pictures of the Jacksons nursery, I raised them before I ever thought of getting a digital camera, so all I have is pictures of fuzzy brown things on fuzzier branches.

One thing to stress about raising baby chams no matter what species - get thin branches, vines or whatever you use. They need to be able to grab the branch, if it's too thick they just sit 'on top' and can't hold on very well. For an animal that expects to be able to use it's clasping ability, it can be stressful, and babies don't take stresss well at all. I used branches cut from my butterfly bush (B davidii). They don't have rough bark, the branches are thin and there's enough of them to be able to replace with fresh ones as needed. Any flowering shrub branches would work, and chopping off a large chunk works well. You can just plop the whole thing into the enclosure like a tree, giving them a variation of branch sizes.

My Jacksons were always raised in 65 gallon tanks with screen lids, 3 UV-B fluorescent lights spaced over the top. Since they didn't need high temperatures, I didn't need basking lights, the fluorescents provided the correct temperature range. Using a big tank like I did also helps provide a lot of air circulation, no stuffy little tanks or containers, but wide open top (with screen), nothing stuffy there, and misting water dried during the course of the day.

I suspended small plastic tubs of fruit fly media, added the flies to that and let the chams pick them off at will. For variety they got meadow plankton from safe unsprayed areas. These bugs and whatevers would cruise around the branches, the chams sat there and grabbed them as they went past. Having a lot of branches allowed the babies to reach just about every corner of the tank, no bug was beyond reach of their tongues.

There weren't any live plants, just silk leaves and vines. I didn't want the bugs (specially crickets) to eat the leaves, they were supposed to fill up on the gutload I provided for the lucky (?) ones who lived long enough to get hungry.

Double J · 01-21-05, 11:27 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Manitoban Herps
If you do not have the space to house 35 babys you shouldn't breed them. i perfer to house my babys seperately, I know I would with my cham if I ever got a female for him.

EDIT - But since they all eat fine and everything good, my above statement doesn't really matter

Did you even read my original post?

Have you ever bred chameleons?

Next time, make sure you know what you are talking about before you accuse others of improper husbandry.

I am not the only one here that houses multiple hatchlings per tank on a temporary basis.

HeatherRose · 01-21-05, 11:42 PM

Thank you guys for all of your help! They chameleonnews link was especially helpful. I'm still deciding, but a couple of tanks or kritter keepers might be my best option. I think tanks will allow me to give them better lighting and heat, as opposed to kritter keepers. I will use thin sticks for climbing (as Hilde suggested) lined with paper towels. Housing them seperately or together seems to be up for debate.

Double J, have you ever witnessed any squabbles or injuries when they're housed together? How long do you keep them together for? My hatchlings will be pardalis, if there's any difference.

It's still a LONG way off yet... but I want to do it right!

meow_mix450 · 01-21-05, 11:42 PM

Ya double J has a good point, 35 babys running around is a lot. Housing 35 chameleons in 10 gallons or 5 gallons for each one, that will take half of an average room.

Meow

DragnDrop · 01-22-05, 12:01 AM

I don't know about pardalis, but the jacksons babies were perfectly okay in one tank (15-20 per clutch/litter?)
During the day they did their own thing, wandering around. About the time the lights went off they'd huddle close together in groups of 3 or 4. I'm thinking they did the 'safety in numbers' thing. Once they get older they do prefer to be alone, but babies seem to do very well in groups as long as they're not trampling each other to death. If you have room to house them all separately, go ahead, but it can be a pain to maintain all those small tanks. They can get stuffy, air circulation isn't as good in small enclosures. That's probably why the 65 gallon tank worked so well even for montane species like the Jacksons.