large incubator heat source options

Bristen · 01-05-05, 06:51 PM

Hi everyone,

well I've been reading many posts on ssnakess.com about incubators today. I've found much information from Roy Stockwell, and I'm very grateful for all the information you have provided in this forum on that particular topic. I've collected a bunch of your posts and printed them on paper so I can go through them again and refer to them easily.

I will be using a tall-style incubator. I know that is not ideal, but many have used them successfully and fans should prevent layering. The dimensions are 33"x59"x19", or 2.75'x4.92'x1.58' which amounts to 21.38 cubic feet. Roy recommends 5w to 10w per cubic feet of incubator volume. So accoding to those calculations, a 200w heat source would provide about 9.35w per cubic feet.

What I was planning to use is a ProHeat Radiant Panel that I'm not currently using. ProProducts has recommended that I do NOT use the heat panel for this purpose. I'm not sure why however. This panel is a large 150w panel and would be perfect for the enclosure, in my opinion. I will be using fans (the ones recommended by Roy perhaps) to push down the hot air. Hoping to reduce/prevent layering this way. I also have a Helix DBS1000 that will be used as a thermostat for the incubator.

Does anybody know why I should NOT use the ProHeat panel other than the risk of having water thrown on the panel? I know the panel is designed to be setup on top of an enclosure, but I do not see why it cannot be setup on the bottom of the incubator? Especially that I will be keeping the incubator a tad humid, but not wet. These heat panels are used for arboreal snakes in high humidity all the time it seems to me, no? The egg containers will be responsible for keeping the 100% RH air on the eggs.

Now, let's assume there are valid reasons to not use the heat panel in the incubator. What are other heat source options? A lot of people use heat tape, but 11" Flexwatt is 20w per foot. This means I need 10' of Flexwatt. I also have to wire it up, etc. I thought of ceramic heating elements (CHE). A couple of those on the bottom with a metal deflector to even out the heat could possibly work also. However, in my mind, the heat panel would of been perfect.

Anyways, suggestions would be appreciated.

Note: The box used to be an enclosure. It was on it's side, but it'll be back in it's standard vertical position for the incubator. Here's a picture when it was used for a cage (on it's side):

Future Incubator

Thanks!
Bristen.

concept3 · 01-05-05, 07:06 PM

I dont know how many eggs you plan on incubating but why not just a hova bator for 120 bucks?/ just seems easier to me. Also I cannot answer any of your questions lol, This is just another suggestion/

Jeff_Favelle · 01-05-05, 07:22 PM

Because a Hovabator can only do like ONE clutch of Ball Python eggs. So if you have three snakes, and two are females and they both lay eggs, how exactly is a Hovabator going to help you?

Plus $120 for an incubator that only incubates ONE clutch? Waste of money. I built mine for $30, add an aquarium heater ($30) and a Helix ($105). So for $165, I incubated over 20 clutches this year. Hmmmmmmm.

BoidKeeper · 01-05-05, 07:22 PM

Because one hovabator will not hold many many clutchs of ball eggs. If he's asking how to heat a large incubator it's not so he can incubat one clutch of corn eggs.
Trevor

Jeff_Favelle · 01-05-05, 07:24 PM

Yeah, the heat panel should work. I mean, anything that gives off heat and that can be regulated (Helix) will work. Why wouldn't it?

But far from an ideal incubator for python eggs. Not my first chioce. Heck, not even my 3rd or 4th choice.

Best of luck, let us know how it goes. Pictures too!!

BoidKeeper · 01-05-05, 07:39 PM

I tried to tell him Jeff to go with a water incubator like WE use but he just won't listen to me. He likes to make things harder than they need to be. He needs a dose of KISS!
Cheers,
Trevor

Jeff_Favelle · 01-05-05, 07:46 PM

Seriously. Oh well. Its like the dudes that wanted to use aquariums for the longest time. I can only beat my head against the wall trying to tell these guys the easiest way to do things for so long. There's proven ways to do things and then there's other ways that take more work. Why not do the proven way and spend your time doing something fun like takng pics, planning the next project, making a display tank for a non-breeding species, etc etc etc. There's a formula in place to breed snakes now and its proven. I'd rather spend my time in the field or taking pics, but then again, to each their own.......

BoidKeeper · 01-05-05, 07:50 PM

See Bristen! I've got all the styros you need buddy. I can make you the same incubator I hatched my ball eggs in last year.lol
All jokes a side Jeff. Have a look at the incubator that Greg Maxwell uses, the pic is in The Complete Chondro. That is what he is trying to build. If he gets that right he'll have no problem because if Greg can hatch Chondros in it Bristen can hatch balls in it.
Cheers,
Trevor

Scales Zoo · 01-05-05, 08:01 PM

I made an incubator out of a fridge last year, and the eggs had not hatched yet when I had my water incubator built.

Took a 4x2 melamine cage that did not have glass in it, put one of those big clear rubbermade tote things in it, put styro insulatin around the clear tote, filled with some water, added 2 bricks, some egg crate and an aquarium heater, put egg box in there with egg crate, and then put insulation and a 4x2 peice of melamine on the top.

I don't have pictures, cause I didn't have a camera at the time, but i might take pictures cause the thing holds temperature within .2 F - and seems to work like a damn. I can't wait to get some python eggs to try it on.

Ryan

Bristen · 01-06-05, 06:43 AM

Hey Jeff, I've got nothing against other methods... But when I was reading on various posts on incubators on www.ssnakess.com, there were many posts from Roy. Roy's incubators are the same type of incubator I'm trying to build. They are dry and heat tape is the heat source. He has over 20 years experience with this stuff. I think that would be a proven method would it not? I don't think it's going to be that hard myself, but it being my first one, I'll know that for sure once it's all done. [edit]Oups... not true, I had a small dry incubator with a infrared bulb for heat for corn eggs which worked perfectly on a few clutches... this is my first large vertical incubator, and it's the first time I will be trying to incubate ball python eggs...[/edit]

What's your big beef with building an incubator like I'm trying to build? Fridge incubators have been used for the longest time and it's basically a vertical box with a heat source on the bottom. What's the difference with what I'm trying to do? GLK Herp just recently posted their new incubator on "the other forum". It was also a tall vertical dry incubator with a heat source on the bottom. There appears to be a lot of people doing it that way, so it works... no?

Let me know what you think.

Thanks,
Bristen.

BoidKeeper · 01-06-05, 07:19 AM

Hey I just remembered that I have an old full size fridge. I'm going to build a larger version of my bar fridge one.
I'll have to do the picture post thing too.
Can't wait to get started. The key to a large incubator I think is circulation and humidity.
Cheers,
Trevor

The Dom · 01-06-05, 08:54 AM

Hey

I use a tall incubator with heat tape and a helix to control it all ...
I have a fan and wireless thermometers and hydrometers.. Heres my thought on the system..

If I had to build an other one .. I would not make it vertical but horizontal. To me its just a pain in the butt .. harder to keep the temps on the bottom simillar to the temps on top .. Always ended up having a good .5 degree difference between both top and bottom containers ..

I used the Heat tape. Wired 5 feet of it inside and ended up just pluging 3 feet thats not working to full capacity .. My incubator is about 4 feet tall 2 feet deep and 2 feet wide..

I used this method for incubation -- one tupperware with vermiculite then a plastic grate on top (no substrate touching the eggs) .. Holes in that tupperware and its in a bigger tupperware with water in it. This tupperware sits in a boxed melanine chamber that is warmed up w/ the heat tape ..

Anyway my method worked great wit about a .3 gradient variation during incubation. Using it again this year.

I have also used the simple styro box with water heater and containers on bricks .. Worked great but could not make it big enough .. the gradient was at least .8 though ..

Best of luck to you .. Listen to the guys up top.. They know what there talking about

Dom

Bristen · 01-06-05, 09:05 AM

Hey Dom, thanks for posting!

Quote:

Originally posted by The Dom
If I had to build an other one .. I would not make it vertical but horizontal. To me its just a pain in the butt .. harder to keep the temps on the bottom simillar to the temps on top .. Always ended up having a good .5 degree difference between both top and bottom containers ..

sorry, but I really fail to see why a 0.5F difference is a big deal... the eggs will hatch fine at that temperature, just a little quicker or a little slower... am I correct on that? I could easily have my box flipped on it's side, but I was trying to save up on space.. that's a BIG box... :-(

Quote:

Originally posted by The Dom
I used the Heat tape. Wired 5 feet of it inside and ended up just pluging 3 feet thats not working to full capacity .. My incubator is about 4 feet tall 2 feet deep and 2 feet wide..

ok, so you're thinking that I may not need a 10' length of 11" wide heat tape? I'd rather have a tad too much than not enough if I decide to use heat tape.. my box is somewhat insulated, but it will be far from a fridge, so I want to have enough heat to keep it at correct temperature. One of the reasons I'm leaning towards the heat panel...

Thanks!
Bristen.

Jeff_Favelle · 01-06-05, 10:49 AM

Quote:

What's your big beef with building an incubator like I'm trying to build?

Nothing it all. It will work. I've hatched eggs in incubators like that.

Its just not my first choice. But I have no beef with it, and I am certain that it will work for you. Heck, I've hatched eggs back in the old days with just a heat pad and not even a dimmer. But that was a LONG time ago..............

Vengeance · 01-06-05, 11:00 AM

Hey Jeff, do you have some pics of your wet incubator?