Interesting retic bite.

[CrotalusR#1]

Originally Posted by FWK

I have a young Bull Snake with a fearsome feeding response. A few months ago I reached into his enclosure to grab his water bowl when he shot out of a hide like he was spring loaded and latched onto my hand. I didn't move as he started to throw the first coil over my hand when he suddenly disengaged and vanished back into his hide. I didn't think for a second that he let go because he knew it was me or that he didn't want to hurt me, he let go because he realized he bit something much bigger than he could handle and if he didn't get out of there he was going to get hurt. Prey fight back.

I don't think there is much real debate as to the level of intelligence in snakes. Spend a bit of time studying the nervous system of a snake at it will quickly become pretty clear to you that they do not have the capacity for intelligence warm blooded animals do. But within the hobbyist community there is some debate as individuals are often blind to reason when it comes to their pets because they become overly attached to the animal(s) in question and typically assign human qualities to their beloved pets (the technical term is anthropomorphism but I like to call it crazy cat lady syndrome).

Snakes do seem to have some ability to learn, for example my snakes seem to know that if there is movement outside their enclosures (as in, I'm walking around in the snake room) there is a good chance food is on the way. And over time they learn that I am not a threat and picking them up will no longer trigger a fight or flight response. But is this truly knowledge they can actively employ or simply a conditioned response? Personally I think it is a little bit of both (leaning more towards a conditioned response overall) but there doesn't seem to be a whole lot of legitimate research on the subject, at least not that I can find. I am very much open to new ideas if you know of any research/articles on the subject.

There are a number of cases of snakes swallowing a persons arm and refusing to let go until forcibly removed. I don't think the snake wouldn't let go because it didn't have a strong enough bond with the individual, the snake wouldn't let go because it didn't "realize" it had made a mistake (there wasn't enough stimuli to override the feeding response).

Great feedback! I think it's probably a 99% chance that it's just him realizing Im to big or a weak feeding response. It was just a weird feeling that's all I can say.

[yeloowtang]

it probably is as others have mentioned, the snake realized it made a mistake and let go.
i've had it happen with diferent species over the years..

then you have some snakes who will not let go (usually a water spray bottle works) and having a little vinigar really works because of the taste and smell . you even have snakes who will accidently bite and eat themselves !!!!

but I have read many reports from experts citing that the reticulated python is one of the most intelligent of all snakes.. they are one of the only snakes who will sit there and watch you and follow you .. some real interesting reads out there regarding retics.
it's also one of the reasons why hook traing them is easy.
my girl will almost always come out of her hide and watch me clean cages then if/when it's her turn, she always lifts her head up to smell me and goes back in her hide while i clean.. pretty cool.

only other snakes that i have who act odd are my emeralds, most of them when i got them, were nervous because of bad conditions they were in with the previous owner.
after a while in perfetc conditions they all calmed down and now they don't come at me when i open the cage, instead they will tilt their head to have one eye looking at me..
as if saying, go ahead do your thing i'm watching you hehehehe others won't even bother moving at all..

now they are not going to have feelings for you but they are known to learn and get to know their owner.

there's still is a slight chance that it did look at you and realized who/what it grabed..
most is instinct but they do learn and are smarter than it's believed..

I will hunt down some of the articles just for fun...

[FWK]

Retics are one of the snakes commonly involved in the arm swallowing shenanigans I mentioned. Their feeding response is famous. I find, in general, Python people claim Retics are the most intelligent snakes, Colubrid people swear Indigos are, and venomous people insist King Cobras are. I have yet to see a study actually comparing these animals (and again if anyone knows of such a study I would be extremely interested), and very few people keep all three. So what you wind up with is individuals each convinced their animal is best, as is human nature. My dad could beat up your dad! The subject makes for interesting discussion as long as one remains self aware and keeps his predisposed favoritism out of the conversation.

[Pirarucu]

As has been said, the snake realized it was grabbing something much too large on accident, and backed off in the hopes it wouldn't get hurt. Self preservation is the motive for backing down, the snakes aren't apologizing.

[JWFugle]

My 2 cents on strange snake behavior;
I had let my super jamp (at the time was 7-8ft) roam around my room getting some time to explore when she came up to my foot and proceeded to headbutt, sniff and push into my foot all over. I sat there amused by this interaction and would push back or reach down with my hand and kind of bump her away. this went on for 5-10mins till she was wrapped around my leg, now i will say i really didnt even notice her wrapping around my leg due to the fact she was just going around my leg while bumping me, she then proceeded to wrap up and tighten around my leg. for whatever reason she was convinced my foot and calf was her next big meal and all she had to do was find a "head" to bite. Lucky for me she never found it :P, but i had a good fight with her unwrapping her off my leg which she refused to loosen up on.

I finally got her off my leg and put her back in the cage and closed the door. during this whole time she never once hissed, opened her mouth, attempted to strike at me. She was just hell bent on finding the mouth of my foot haha.

Totally weird experience for me and has never happened since, while I agree that retics are some sneaky and very smart cookies they certainly have their WTF moments.

[CrotalusR#1]

I think that when it comes to snakes they don't get the credit they deserve when it comes to intelligence but part of there extremely repetitive behavior makes them appear as if there figuring things out.

[jjhill001]

Originally Posted by CrotalusR#1

I think that when it comes to snakes they don't get the credit they deserve when it comes to intelligence but part of there extremely repetitive behavior makes them appear as if there figuring things out.

There was an article posted on Kingsnake .com earlier this year talking about how intelligence in reptiles is greatly underrepresented because most of the measurements were done in cold lab settings set up for rats. Well we all know what happens to reptile when you cool them down. They are recreating the tests with optimal temps and the results are astounding compared to what we thought we knew.

That said I'd say the biggest difference is what you do after a bite decides how the snake will react. If you freak and try to get away I think the feeding response is reinforced. Some snakes have crazy feeding responses and will constrict cage furniture if they miss and hit that. Others are a bit more methodical. Depends on how easy you are to see and what smells are on you and a whole bunch of factors. Even in the wild it's not uncommon for a python or anaconda to kill itself trying to swallow something really big on accident. It just depends on how ridiculous your snake is.