Trouble with a very brazen snake. - Page 2

**EL Ziggy** · 05-14-14, 07:10 PM

Owl- It sounds like she's just a bit skittish which means you'll have to be extra careful when opening her tub

. My bull snake will sometimes stretch for the top of her enclosure as well, especially if she's hungry. When she's full she's naturally less active. I definitely wouldn't want her to hit the floor and get hurt or lost either so I pay close attention to where she's at when I open her tank and steer her back inside with my hand if necessary. Do you handle her often? Two of my snakes were very skittish for the first couple of months after I got them. They've calmed down quite a bit since then. Best wishes with your corn.

mclund · 05-14-14, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CosmicOwl

I'm not trying to confuse anybody here, but the snake isn't hanging on the inside of the lid. First of all, that's physically impossible with the type of tub I have. What's going on is that she will be hiding, and by the time I've undone all of the latches on the tub, she will be perched at the top of the tub waiting to strike/possibly escape. My worry is that she will managed to surge out of the tub and either get hurt, or manage to somehow escape before I can recover her. If she was larger, I wouldn't be worried, because even an adult corn snake is too big to escape your grasp. A 9 month of corn snake is just too small and wriggly to be 100% sure you can grab/keep in your hands.

As for feeding, I just don't see how an adult mouse would be possible for her to consume. I feed adult mice to my adult corn snake and they still produce a lump in his body. Maybe if you consider a large hopper to be an "adult mouse", but even that would be a good size meal for her.

Cosmic Owl,
Forget the food...It's not the issue here. Please don't take this the wrong way, but truthfully the problem is you. I bred corn snakes for 7 years. I have dealt with every size and temperament you can think of. If I could put my eyes on it, I could handle it. From 8 inches to 5 feet. They are resilient, you will not hurt it...it will not hurt you. At this point I am not sure which one is more stressed...but I think its you. Open the tub and pick up the animal. Do it on the floor or inside a larger tub if that makes you more comfortable. You may think I am being a little harsh, but you are making this a bigger deal than you need to. I want to hear how you did with it.

CosmicOwl · 05-14-14, 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mclund

Cosmic Owl,
Forget the food...It's not the issue here. Please don't take this the wrong way, but truthfully the problem is you. I bred corn snakes for 7 years. I have dealt with every size and temperament you can think of. If I could put my eyes on it, I could handle it. From 8 inches to 5 feet. They are resilient, you will not hurt it...it will not hurt you. At this point I am not sure which one is more stressed...but I think its you. Open the tub and pick up the animal. Do it on the floor or inside a larger tub if that makes you more comfortable. You may think I am being a little harsh, but you are making this a bigger deal than you need to. I want to hear how you did with it.

I'm not trying to discredit your experience, but I think you're reading the situation wrong. I CAN handle her. I've had her for months and her temperament outside of the cage is pretty mellow. I may not be explaining the situation properly, but here is the issue I'm running into:

I don't know whether it's a feeding response or something else, but by the time I undo the latches, she is already at the lid waiting. My fear(and I don't really have trouble admitting this) is that she will escape the tub in the brief moment that I am removing the lid, and I won't be able to grab her quickly enough. I've already had a couple close calls where she has managed to get out and I have been able to grab just enough of her to get her back in the tub.

Unfortunately, I don't have a room in my house that is air tight. But her quarantine is up and I'm going to put her in a smaller room which she couldn't go missing in. I appreciate the opinions, but I know I'm nervous. However, I was hoping to find out if anybody had a solution for training her to stay away from the lid. If there is no solution to that, I guess I will have to deal with it.

mclund · 05-14-14, 10:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CosmicOwl

I'm not trying to discredit your experience, but I think you're reading the situation wrong. I CAN handle her. I've had her for months and her temperament outside of the cage is pretty mellow. I may not be explaining the situation properly, but here is the issue I'm running into:

I don't know whether it's a feeding response or something else, but by the time I undo the latches, she is already at the lid waiting. My fear(and I don't really have trouble admitting this) is that she will escape the tub in the brief moment that I am removing the lid, and I won't be able to grab her quickly enough. I've already had a couple close calls where she has managed to get out and I have been able to grab just enough of her to get her back in the tub.

Unfortunately, I don't have a room in my house that is air tight. But her quarantine is up and I'm going to put her in a smaller room which she couldn't go missing in. I appreciate the opinions, but I know I'm nervous. However, I was hoping to find out if anybody had a solution for training her to stay away from the lid. If there is no solution to that, I guess I will have to deal with it.

I don't think I am...by your own admission. I am not trying to berate you. Your issue is confidence with a snake that acts differently than the others in your collection. Snakes are not very intelligent...most of it is instinct. If they let you handle them..it is really just tolerance. We as humans mistake this for feelings. They don't love or care...there needs are primal, food and temperature, but the level of tolerance can vary. That is what you are dealing with and you are letting it get the best of you. I do not believe you can "train" a snake. They may be subject to repetitive actions, but instinct will take over most of the time. Stick a rodent in a snakes face...it is going to eat it.

smigon · 05-15-14, 01:07 AM

Have you considered the possibility that she might be trying to find a place to lay eggs? Both of my unbred girls laid slugs in the last two weeks, I didn't even consider that they would even be trying, my older girl was so nasty for the last two months and when I did decide to put a lay box in her viv she immediately went in, didn't come out for two days, and when she did she crawled out and died.

I opened the lay box and there were 12 tiny slugs the size of marbles, and she was so emaciated that she just couldn't take it.

Try putting a lay box in her viv and see what happens.

Pirarucu · 05-15-14, 06:11 AM

I honestly don't think I read it that way mclund. What I am reading is he has a snake with a strong feeding response which tends to come flying out of the cage so fast that it could be hard to grab it in time to stop it from escaping. It's not a confidence issue, it's a fast, bold snake. I've dealt with the same thing, and sometimes it is genuinely difficult to stop an animal from darting out of its cage when you open it. He is asking for some way to slow the snake down so he has more time to react.
Unfortunately there really isn't much you can do. It's likely that as she grows, she will slow down a little bit and become more calm at feeding time.

Mikoh4792 · 05-15-14, 07:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pirarucu

I honestly don't think I read it that way mclund. What I am reading is he has a snake with a strong feeding response which tends to come flying out of the cage so fast that it could be hard to grab it in time to stop it from escaping. It's not a confidence issue, it's a fast, bold snake. I've dealt with the same thing, and sometimes it is genuinely difficult to stop an animal from darting out of its cage when you open it. He is asking for some way to slow the snake down so he has more time to react.
Unfortunately there really isn't much you can do. It's likely that as she grows, she will slow down a little bit and become more calm at feeding time.

+1

Owl maybe you should move him into an enclosure with front sliding doors. Much easier to deal with fast snakes that way.

formica · 05-15-14, 08:37 AM

Use a bigger/deeper tub, so that she cannot get out, unless you take her out

possibly a sliding door enclosure, but make sure to block up the gap between the glass doors if its more than a few mm

CosmicOwl · 05-16-14, 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pirarucu

I honestly don't think I read it that way mclund. What I am reading is he has a snake with a strong feeding response which tends to come flying out of the cage so fast that it could be hard to grab it in time to stop it from escaping. It's not a confidence issue, it's a fast, bold snake. I've dealt with the same thing, and sometimes it is genuinely difficult to stop an animal from darting out of its cage when you open it. He is asking for some way to slow the snake down so he has more time to react.
Unfortunately there really isn't much you can do. It's likely that as she grows, she will slow down a little bit and become more calm at feeding time.

Pirarucu, you're spot on. I made this post in the hope that with so many experienced people, they're might be a tip I didn't know. Unfortunately, it seems like there simply isn't one.

Mclund is right, in the sense that she is different than by other snakes; I wouldn't be here is she wasn't. My other snakes are very placid and make no attempts to leave their enclosures. When I'm working on my adult corn's enclosure, he will usually come out and watch me and wait for me squirt him with a little water. I can't do something like that with my bloodred.

For now, I'll be moving her into the other room, after I've made sure there aren't any possible escape routes. Then I'll take it from there. I'll consider a bigger/deeper tub too.

CosmicOwl · 06-04-14, 06:52 PM

I thought I'd give you guys a little update as I think I'm getting the problem under control. I moved my blood red, Lucinda, into the room with my other snakes, which seemed to settle her down a bit. In addition to that, I've been placing her tub inside of a tall cardboard box whenever I have to open it. It may seem a little unnecessary, but I feel a lot more comfortable knowing the chances of an escape are minimized. Hopefully, she settles down more with time and handling.

**EL Ziggy** · 06-04-14, 07:48 PM

Glad to hear you're making progress Owl.

sharthun · 06-05-14, 07:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EL-Ziggy

Glad to hear you're making progress Owl.

Ditto!!!!!!!!!!

Roman · 06-07-14, 04:25 PM

Just another thought about your problem…

One of the issues I have with keeping snakes in tubs (or aquariums for that matter) is that you access the tub from above. This is exactly the direction where most predators like birds of prey are coming from, so a lot of snakes get nervous if something comes from that direction. Most snakes calm down after some time and might even get used to it, but maybe your snake thinks the best defense is an aggressive offence, a hit and run tactic.

So I would agree with Mikoh4792, get a front opening cage. Most nervous snakes calm down if you enter their cage from the same level as they are. Your snake can evade you and can move to / stay at the opposite side of the cage while you do your maintenance, but can not escape outside the cage because the door at this side is closed. This might solve your problem.

Roman