First Thread Here! Quick Question

Garret_Trezona · 02-14-12, 09:23 AM

Hey everyone, this is my first thread here as I just signed up. I came across your forum and saw that there were some expierenced monitor keepers here so I decided to join.

I have a question for the monitor people here about something that I saw and worried me this morning. A little background on me: I have been keeping monitors for a lot of years now along with other types of lizards, snakes, turtles, and tortoises ( family hobby). Out of all the monitors I have including, savs, blackthroats, argus's, and water monitors, this is the first time ive noticed this.

I walked into our garage this morning ( where we keep all of our reptiles being as we live in South Florida) turned on everyones lights and walked out for a little. I had some silk worms left over last night from some chameleons that didnt eat them all so as every monitor keeper does, you never waste the food you just feed your leftovers to the lizards lol. Well my youngest monitor right now is our 4 month old water monitor who is currently eating everything from rat fuzzies, chicken breast, large horned worms, pretty much everything that all my other lizards eat and have always ate. Well to the story, I woke him up this morning because like I said I needed to feed off the silkworms instead of wasting them. When i went to give him a worm, I just drop it in front of him in his cage and he usually goes to town on it. This morning when I did it, he went to go eat it but was missing the worm. He would try to get it 3-4 times but totally miss it then he would finally grab it. Now again, I have never seen this happen and that is the reason that I am worried. This little water monitor is one of my favorite that I have right now and i just want to see if anyone on here has seen anything like this before or knows what it could be?

My optimisitc mind just is saying that he was tired and groggy from me waking him up and trying to feed him early when I usually feed them around 5-6pm.

If anyone could just give a little info I would really appreciate it, thanks!

BarelyBreathing · 02-14-12, 12:58 PM

The easiest way to figure out what happened is to post a video if this happens again. My only thought is that, like most animals, monitors have a blind spot in front of their faces that can sometimes interfere with picking up smaller prey items.

Just to make sure we cover all bases, why don't you give us a run down of your enclosure?
1: What size and type of enclosure is it?
2: What are the temperatures, and what are you using to measure them?
3: What is the humidity, and what are you using to measure it?
4: What are you using for heat?
5: What type of substrate do you have, and how deep is it?
6: Is this monitor housed alone?
7: Do you use any type of UV-B, and if so, what brand, strength, and age is your bulb?
8: Do you use any supplements? If so, what kind and what brand?

One thing I'd like to touch on. You mentioned that you were feeding your monitors chicken breast. I should like to point out that this isn't the healthiest of things to feed your monitors. Whole prey items only. For your water monitor, here is a list of appropriate prey items: Rodents, chicks, silversides, crayfish, freshwater crab, whole shrimp, fertilized eggs with the chick inside, and for his size right now you can add crickets, grasshoppers, locusts, snails, slugs, and earth worms.

Another thing I wanted to touch on (as I know this isn't about your other monitors) is your savannah. I certainly hope you're not feeding it rodents.

crocdoc · 02-14-12, 04:48 PM

When I read your post the three things that went immediately went through my mind were: 1. I saw the words 'chicken breast' 2. I read your description of an uncoordinated feeding attempt 3. I jumped to the probably conclusion of early signs of metabolic bone disease.

Metabolic bone disease is caused by an animal being unable to process calcium. The main causes of MBD in monitors are usually one of, or a combination, of the following four things:

1. A straightforward lack of calcium, relative to other foodstuffs like protein
2. A lack of vitamin D3, which is crucial for metabolising calcium. Monitors can synthesize their own vitamin D3 by basking in sunlight (UV) or via their diet. It is in the gut of the small animals they eat, provided they are fed small whole animals.
3. Insufficient basking heat. Even if fed high levels of vitamin D3 and calcium, if a monitor can't reach the body temperatures necessary to metabolise these properly it will still get MBD
4. Insufficient humidity. This also affects the digestive/metabolic processes, in coordination with #3.

BarelyBreathing has touched on everything I was about to say and asked the very questions I would also have asked. Please answer her questions and we should be able to offer advice.

infernalis · 02-14-12, 04:55 PM

Personally I would like to see photos of the monitor setups, Pictures of the whole enclosure, pictures of the inside and pictures of the animals themselves.

Thank you.

crocdoc · 02-14-12, 05:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by infernalis

Personally I would like to see photos of the monitor setups, Pictures of the whole enclosure, pictures of the inside and pictures of the animals themselves.

Yeah, what he said, too! As the old adage goes, a picture tells a thousand words.

JPLReptiles · 02-14-12, 05:59 PM

Garrett not trying to throw you under the buss but these guys are going to tell you exactly what I said when it comes to your substrate. You gotta do what's best for the animals...

KORBIN5895 · 02-14-12, 06:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JPLReptiles

Garrett not trying to throw you under the buss but these guys are going to tell you exactly what I said when it comes to your substrate. You gotta do what's best for the animals...

Oh! A little history huh?

infernalis · 02-14-12, 07:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KORBIN5895

Oh! A little history huh?

I think you will find us Monitor lovers sign up for just about any forum that has a monitor discussion going on.

I just signed up at another one last night.

BarelyBreathing · 02-14-12, 08:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JPLReptiles

Garrett not trying to throw you under the buss but these guys are going to tell you exactly what I said when it comes to your substrate. You gotta do what's best for the animals...

Substrate really is one of the most important aspects of monitor husbandry, no matter what type of monitor you house.

infernalis · 02-14-12, 08:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BarelyBreathing

Substrate really is one of the most important aspects of monitor husbandry, no matter what type of monitor you house.

I would vote THE most important aspect.

We all know the sad result of no burrows.

BarelyBreathing · 02-14-12, 08:22 PM

I''d disagree there. You can't really have one main importance of monitor husbandry. Humidity, substrate, basking spot are the trifecta of monitor husbandry. Have one that's a bit off, and your monitor will fail.

infernalis · 02-14-12, 08:40 PM

Understood..

I guess the point I was trying to make is, even with good air humidity, and perfect substrate, if the substrate is too shallow to make a burrow in it, then all else is for nothing.

But let's not jump to any conclusions until we see some pictures

BarelyBreathing · 02-14-12, 09:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by infernalis

Understood..

I guess the point I was trying to make is, even with good air humidity, and perfect substrate, if the substrate is too shallow to make a burrow in it, then all else is for nothing.

But let's not jump to any conclusions until we see some pictures

That I agree with.