my monitors

[Aaron_S]

I read that. It's interesting but he's got key words in there. "Judiciously" feed LEAN mice. Not rats, but mice. He also stated that a varied diet is also a very good way to go.

This interview is also done in 2000, which leaves us 8 years of captive research that isn't in there. It's also done by Melissa Kaplan who is very against the reptile industry.

[Smilts]

I also read that.. However anywhere you go there are arguments just like this, and the over all problem is there just isnt enough research.

[Boostedneon04]

Originally Posted by Coy

I also read that.. However anywhere you go there are arguments just like this, and the over all problem is there just isnt enough research.

i agree..i think keepers need to get together and raise a few monitors on different diets and proper cage set ups and see what the best overall diet is for the species of monitor. would cost way less then doing research in the wild but wild data would also be a huge plus in what to feed the monitors. there just isnt enough research out in the wild yet that isnt out dated..

[Boostedneon04]

Originally Posted by Coy

I also read that.. However anywhere you go there are arguments just like this, and the over all problem is there just isnt enough research.

off topic you arnt on srtforums.com are you??

[Smilts]

Nope sure not I double checked lol

[allergenic]

Originally Posted by Aaron_S

I read that. It's interesting but he's got key words in there. "Judiciously" feed LEAN mice. Not rats, but mice. He also stated that a varied diet is also a very good way to go.

Indeed. Most people assume that because the monitor will take the rodent eagerly that it's good for them. People will always choose chocolate over broccoli, it doesn't mean it's sustainable. The sad part is that most exanthematicus in captivity die of fatty liver disease due to a primarily rodent diet.

Originally Posted by Aaron_S

This interview is also done in 2000, which leaves us 8 years of captive research that isn't in there. It's also done by Melissa Kaplan who is very against the reptile industry.

Though Balsai is respected, I'm hesitant toward anything on anapsid.org, she's not had credibility in some time.

Originally Posted by Coy

I also read that.. However anywhere you go there are arguments just like this, and the over all problem is there just isnt enough research.

I quoted enough research to point in the right direction. The problem is that people are so blockheaded they want to do it a different way. Again, people are free to go against what has been found and feed whatever they like. How long the monitor lives and the condition of its health will be the deciding factor. You should get a good 12 years out of your Savannah.

Originally Posted by Boostedneon04

soo yes a 100 percent diet of processed meats would be no good i agree but my animals eat it once a week with sum egg shells and vitamin supplement..

If you are going to feed processed meats from the grocery store (which it looks like you are), at least please follow the SDZ Diet (which you are not).

[Smilts]

I actually dont feed ground turkey, I do know lots of people that do its a very lean meat and with supplements.. With out going to Savannah a perfect diet isnt easy.

[allergenic]

Originally Posted by Coy

I actually dont feed ground turkey, I do know lots of people that do its a very lean meat and with supplements..

I also know lots of people who recommend feeding dog and cat food to Savannah monitors, and keeping them in aquariums with a single high wattage basking spot. I also know lots of people with dead monitors.

The only diet which includes ground turkey that has worked so far, is the SDZ Diet from Jeff Lemm:

10 lbs. lean ground turkey
90 grams steamed bonemeal
2 ground Centrum tablets

Many people seem to have other ideas as to what this diet is, and make little tweaks and substitutions until it doesn't work anymore.

Originally Posted by Coy

With out going to Savannah

Sport, a savannah is a type of ecosystem, as is for example a desert or rainforest. It is mostly grassland. Savannah monitors come from certain regions of Africa.

Originally Posted by Coy

a perfect diet isnt easy people do the best they can.

To repeat myself, if the best you can do is subpar, why take on a medium to large monitor in the first place?

Would people do the same thing to mammals? "I have two dogs but I can only keep them outside even in winter, and feed them breakfast cereal. I know other people that do this, I'm doing the best I can."

[Smilts]

that about Savannah was a joke, I know where they come from relax allready.

This thread was about showing off monitors which despite all you have said look great. If you truly believe that people are blockheaded and will not listen then why keep coming back and argueing the point?

I dont think the argument is rather to feed the dog, cereal or Purina, more rather to feed the dog Purina or Iams

[Aaron_S]

The reason he comes back, at least in my guess isn't to change people's minds who won't listen but to put the information out there for the readers who aren't posting.

On another note, yes anapsid.org has no credibility, which is run by Melissa Kaplan. I do note that you mentioned the interviewee is knowledgable but anything put on that site just doesn't do it for me.

[allergenic]

Originally Posted by Coy

This thread was about showing off monitors which despite all you have said look great.

If by great you mean borderline dehydrated and slightly obese then yes they are great.

The origin of this degradation was my response to OP posting photos of his albig in an aquarium eating processed grocery store meat (with a poor excuse for a basking spot, I might add). Like it or not, that kind of stuff will get negative comments by anyone who knows anything about monitors, whether it is rationalized after the fact or not. We didn't even get to touch on the 2 inches of substrate in the enclosures, which is a bit less than the 1-2 feet of soil needed by both those monitors.

Originally Posted by Coy

I dont think the argument is rather to feed the dog, cereal or Purina, more rather to feed the dog Purina or Iams

The argument is about (bear with me here), that if dogs eat Purina in the wild, is it really that big a deal/difficult to just feed them Purina? Why even bother with Iams?

Originally Posted by Aaron_S

The reason he comes back, at least in my guess isn't to change people's minds who won't listen but to put the information out there for the readers who aren't posting.
On another note, yes anapsid.org has no credibility, which is run by Melissa Kaplan. I do note that you mentioned the interviewee is knowledgable but anything put on that site just doesn't do it for me.

Thanks Aaron. Not sure if Balsai is knowledgable, haven't read his books/papers. He seems somewhat respected, I think is how I put it. The fact that it's on anapsid makes me cringe a bit also. I agree with your lean mice comment.

[Smilts]

Tanks probably are not the best, my tegu is in one while I work on her enclosure but prob not the best. I agree with you on the subject of substrate depth, I also dont care for that type of substrate at all.


As far as feeding you have inspired me to do more of my own research. How do you truly feel about the SDZ diet? It seems easy enough to follow, but is it just sort of a band aid diet? Finally you mentioned a few possibilitys for food items but what do you feel a well rounded diet for 1 week would be. I guess Im asking what one week of your monitors diet would look like or 2 weeks if that would be more thorough?

I do listen by the way. And research what Im reading.

[Boostedneon04]

dehydrated??how are they dehydrated??please explain this to me??and the tank is only till his cage is done soo relax already with the tank b.s..the savannah was over weight from the day i got him..hes sliming down and getting back to a good weight..the bone meal is to supply calcium? so whats any different than using a calcuim powder and a vitamin supplement instead of using the central vitiamin and bonemeal???or should the centrim vitamin and bonemeal be used instead??

[Boostedneon04]

oo and btw..those pictures are quite old..i ran out of cypress mulch that day and went and picked up another bag the next day..the tank is half filled with the substrate so hes got plenty to burrow and dig in..also since that isnt his cage its just a temp set up while his other is being done what type of basking area do you recommend??since u dont think the large peice of wood under the two lights is good enough??that savannah cage is also different than pictured..theres more substrate and a larger basking area now..ill take sum pictures tomm for you..

[Aaron_S]

I just don't understand why someone takes a picture of there animal in less than optimum conditions. If you need more mulch then take the picture the next day. Although mulch is terrible for burrowing. Some sort of soil mixture is best.