Clearing up myths about heat tape

[Invictus]

I would like to take some time to clear up some myths about heat tape, since I've been hearing for the longest time that it's "banned" in Canada, or "illegal" or that it's "not UL listed" and blah blah blah.

Flexwatt Corp does not exist anymore. I'm not sure if they sold off their assets or merely changed their name, but heat tape is now made by Calorique.

Flexwatt heat tape has never been banned. What was banned in Canada as a result of the class action lawsuit, was Flexwatt's Radiant Cceiling Heat Panels. These most definitely are illegal in Canada and against building code.

For those who don't think heat tape is UL listed, here's the UL file and model numbers, as per my email by Calorique:

The reptile heat tape products are covered by our UL Component Listing File #E108850. The model numbers are IND-103 for the 3", IND-104 for the 4" and IND-101 for the 11".

So there you have it.

It is NOT illegal in Canada. It IS UL listed. You CAN use it in your home with no fear of a lawsuit.

[marisa]

Thanks. I never understood it either. People often say, if you use it, and it causes a fire then you will get squat from insurance. But what I always thought when hearing this is what insurance company would give you money from a fire started by ANY reptile heating source? lol

Marisa

[Invictus]

That's exactly it, Marisa. If you tell your insurance company you have reptiles, prepare to pay through the nose for premiums, if they cover you at all. Not disclosing that you have them is what will void your insurance.

[concept3]

so then how do you guys get house insurance? Just wondering, commin up on that age when its time to buy a house and all....

[marisa]

I am probably alone here, and maybe even stupid in saying this but I think when I buy a house, we will not disclose our herps.

YES this will mean we get NOTHING in the event of a fire caused by the reptiles. YES this is a risk. But to me it outweighs the possible headaches and problems involved declaring the reptiles and even finding a company that will insure us/them.

If I was in this for a serious serious business, then my plans would be a lot different. But I plan to keep this as a small hobby, and sell some stuff to like minded people in the future, as well as buy from others. So for me, I would not disclose them unless someone could show why it would be easier and better to tell the insurance about them. But so far it seems like a bad idea.

Marisa

[Stockwell]

But Ken UL is an American standard,which still has only limited acceptance in Canada, plus as stated it has a component approval which is to say, it must be used in something else, which as a whole is approved, probably under a different standard.
It doesn't mean its approved for consumer use by Joe Q public, as it is supplied.
For Canadian acceptance it really should have been submitted for approval by CSA, or barring that what is typically done these days is UL will approve to Canadian standards as well as American for an additional price. This of course means that the product must actually conform to the applicable Canadian standard in addition to the American . Such dual approval is seen commonly in consumer products, these days and will bear the monogram cUL.
Heat tape is not really a consumer ready product, ie it comes with no cord, no insulation and no connections, and no instructions... Half the danger involves how it is used and how it is hooked up(gauge of wire, insulation and terminations etc, etc.) and that is out of the control of the manufacturer. Another point that was mentioned to me years ago with my discussions with Flexwatt , was that they were informed that there was no Canadian standard for Carbon film heaters.
If that was the case the product couldn't have been approved anyway, until a standard was establised, and with the uniqueness of the product, and few competitive equivalents that was unlikely unless it could be classified under some already existing standard. I don't believe they ever actully submitted it.

To a large extent, the entire discussion about Heat tape approval is moot.
Like you say, if you have a fire, due to faulty home brew wiring of any type, that wasn't performed by or at least inspected by a licensed electrician or municiple inspector, there's a possibility you're going to be held liable anyway, whether its herp related or otherwise.
It would all depend on the Insurance company, the post fire forensic evidence, and their level of desire to litigate rather than accept the claim.
In other words, when you have self done wiring, or especially wiring not done to code, that results in a catastrophe you really won't know if your policy is worth the paper it's written on, until the claim is processed. At least that's the way I see it.

The biggest cause of all Herp related fires, is light bulbs. Of specific concern are those damn clip on reflectors.... funny thing is they are approved.
Herpers need to eliminate as many light bulbs as possible, and use fluoresents or even compact fluorescents instead, since they produce less heat. If you must use basking lights, make sure any are very well secured, are outside the cage, have adequate ventilation and are screened, screwed down, and never simply "clipped on"
I'm sure Ryan and Sheila from Scales Zoo can tell you all about it.

[Invictus]

Good info Roy. The point I was trying to make is, it's not banned nor illegal in Canada.

For the record, I use light bulbs in all of my enclosures, but they are quite well ventilated, very secure, and there is ZERO chance the reptile can get at them and cause problems. Though I agree, the reflecting dome lamps are a hazard waiting to happen.

[marisa]

Yeah I am moving away and away from lamps. I am currently using lamps only when I have too which is on my RES, iguana and Golden Gecko. All three enjoy basking so lamps are needed.

But what I want to do is remove the "heat" higher wattage bulbs, and replace with heat tape/pads and a simple low wattage white bulb instead of relying on the bulb for all the heat.

Marisa

[MouseKilla]

I'm wondering about using human heat pads as UTHs.

They are all UL/CSA approved products but may not be intended to run constantly... They don't get all that hot so I don't think they're much of a hazard but who knows, fires happen. I wonder if I would be held liable using an approved and unmodified product.

[Stockwell]

Killa, they are indeed approved and must be to be legally sold retail. However the basis for approval is relevant to the intended use. Sticking one under a sheet of glass or wood would technically constitute abuse of product.
Heat pads are used all the time by herpers and have been for as long as I can remember. The Sunbeam ones are especially popular as they are widely available from all drug stores, Walmart etc.
I have lots of experience with them and used them for years prior to Flexwatt.
You should be aware that they tend to be too hot even on the low switch setting. If you use them directly under aquariums or wooden enclosures the excess heat makes a black spot in the middle and the plastic begins to get brittle and breaks down.
The units all contain a high temperature bi-metal cut off switch as required by CSA, so they are relatively safe until the outer plastic breaks down.
They should still be used on a dimmer to adjust for the heat level you want, plus despite the pain in the butt it is, it's a good idea to leave an air gap between the cage and the pad. Jacking the tank up on some 1x1 moulding or equivalent works well. The pad will last longer that way as well, because they are designed to have air flow across them.

[justinO]

Roy, we use the sunbeam heat pads almost exclusivly (save for a few exo-terra or hagen herp pads)... It is good to know that they are relitavly safe to use. we still have smoke alarms and 2 class ABC fire extinguishers in our herp room in case the unthinkable happens

I have noticed that on some of them the normally white plastic is turning a slight red/brown color.. is this the brittle plastic you speak of? most of them are kept with 1/2'' risers under each enclosure.

how does this "bi-metal cut off switch" work? I am interested in hearing more about it.

as a side note about the reflector domes, I have had one catch fire on me before. I woke up one morning about 30 seconds before my timer went on.. as soon as the timer turned on, i heard a pop and within 1/2 second, i had a small flame shooting out of the top of the ceramic base. It certainly scared the crap out of me.

cheers,

Justin

[Stockwell]

Ken,you're correct its not banned or illegal, but it can't be legally sold at the retail level, such as out of petstores. In Canada this would be a violation of an old statute called the Candian Power Act, which dictates that all electrical appliances be agency approved.
CSA and UL have always been advisarial,and this has created some huge trade barriers that cost both countries a pile of money in lost trade.
Only recently has there been some co-operation between both agencies. It's still very confusing and in a state of flux, and UL is not CSA and visa versa.. two separate standards still exist for both countries, and there is still not an across the board acceptance of each others mark.
Recently CSA and UL have agreed to accept each others marks in regard to component approvals, but this only effects certain components, and was primarily brought about due to near impossible conditions with computer power supplies containing either CSA or UL approved components, not being legal on opposite sides of the border without re-submission in the other jurisdiction, a timely and costly proposition.
Free trade will require even more consolidation of US(UL) and Canadian standards, but we still aren't there yet.

[Stockwell]

Justin, all heating applicances must come complete with a thermal fuse or bimetal overtemp. Some appliances have both. All toasters and toaster ovens have thermal fuses which open at fixed temps and disconnect the element. They don't reset and are one time blow units. They need to be replaced before the device will operate and they aren't user servicable.
Other devices have bimetal thermal cutoffs. Heating pads electric blankets, and water bed heaters contain these. At temperatures deemed to be outside the normal and a potential risk, the device opens until the unit cools down, at which point they close and normal current flow resumes. They are infact a form of high limit thermostat and are built right into the unit in series with the nichrome heater, and are not adjustable or accessible.. If you feel around the plastic, you might find the bump... that would be the cutoff thermostat.
When used under aquariums with no normal heat circulation, these will likely start to operate. You could probably hear them switch with an AM radio tuned to a blank station held close to the unit... You'll likely hear a click on the radio produced by the RF component of the arc, as they cycle on and off.. Of course an ammeter would also indicate the change in current flow, if you have access to a clamp on ammeter and a line splitter.
The darkening/red/brown you see is that start of the plastic breaking down.. Eventually you'll have a dark black mark in the hottest spot, and over the years, the plastic will turn brown and crack, and they should be discarded before that.

[MouseKilla]

Thanks Roy, you always seem to really know the equipment.

I have always used more air space instead of a dimmer, a couple of inches or so seems to keep the temps within an acceptable range. Is it any more dangerous to do it this way?

My reason for doing it this way is that I trust my ability to raise or lower a cage with chunks of wood more than my ability to safely wire a dimmer. I'm sure I could learn how but so far I have no need to.

[justinO]

Thank you for the information Roy. Greatly appreciated. I will start checking on them every month to monitor them.

I'm glad I decided to check in this forum.. you learn something new every day.

Justin