Scale problem

axwielding1 · 05-20-04, 07:58 PM

Some may remember my woes with my sumatran borgersmai, Lapar.. She got a belly burn from her undertank heating pad about a month or so ago... Her belly scales turned dark brown and scabby, and subsequently peeled off (not shed). After peeling off, her fresh scales were nice and pink, soft, for a few days, and then began turning brownish again.... After some time, they also came off... I've soaked her, and she's soaked herself. I've used plain Neosporin, I tried something I found in a pet store made with jojoba oil, and then the vet gave me silver sulfodine...
She shed a few days ago and everything came off, and she was fresh again.. Now the affected scales are turning brown again, even after the application of her treatment...
I'm obviously concerned as this can't go on much longer. I'm also wondering if this could be something else, like scale rot?
She's sweet as ever even though I can see she's uncomfortable..
Anyone have any thoughts? Different treatment? I've now laid a soft towel down for her to help keep her belly dry in case it is scale rot.The ambient humidity is still 80% though.
Any help would be greatly appreciated...
Thank you.
ax.

Smulkin · 05-21-04, 12:13 PM

When the scales are browning and coming off are they stiff and rigid or do they feel slimy or soft? Are you using betadine or anything similar? I have not tried neosporin per se but have used triple-antibiotic before. What do you have her on (under the towel)?

ethan · 05-21-04, 06:04 PM

I've read to wash infected area with hydrogen peroxide 50% and 50% water then treat area with polysporin twice daily.Has worked for me when the scales have turned really brown and looked like scale rot.After a shed or two things are back to normal.Sounds like yours problem is a little more complex with a good burn trying to heal.Maybe call the vet or I'm sure someone here on the forum might have the magic cure.Hope everything gets back to normal, let us know whats working best. Later, Ethan

Borneoblood151 · 05-22-04, 03:16 PM

Hey,
Well the thing with belly rot, or scale rot, is that there are usually more than one culprit set of bacteria at work, so while you might eradicate one type of bacteria, the others might not be as susceptible to the antibiotic in question. So, you might end up with a festering wound or area that just won't heal or refuses. In which case you might want to consult your veterinarian again, and have him take a culture for sensitivity to figure out what the bacterial strain at work is.

The other possible scenerio might be, that, she or he has a severe burn, greater than second degree, and there is underlying infection being reintroduced with each new shed. Again, systemic antibiotic in the way of injectables might be the remedy for this. Talk to your vet. In the mean time, keep the area as clean as possible, and lower the humidity to 30-40%, as the more humidity there is in the enclosure, the more amenable the environment for a bacterial infection to regain a foot-hold.

Speaking from experience, I would keep her/him, on a plain surface, like a clean sheet of newspaper, or paper towel, and apply 100%, non diluted hydrogen peroxide to the wound area, and blot dry, and apply a clean application of Neosporin ointment, with a clean Q-Tip. Keep the humidity low for the time being. They usually go through several successive sheds when healing, as that is their way of healing wounds.

Note: Keep the temperature in the low 80's. I am not a proponent of keeping the ambient or hot spot in the upper eighties or low nineties, particularly if the cage temperature is well within the eighty degree mark.

-Angel

axwielding1 · 05-22-04, 07:35 PM

Thank you all for the replies...
Right now she's on a felt pad, with a clean towel on top of it. I will lower the humidity, and I agree, the high 80's to low nineties are too high. Right now she only has an undertank pad for heat which keeps it 79 at night and 81 during the day.
I took her out tonight and noticed what seemed almost like a blister alongside the affected area. I'm sure that's a sign of infection of some sort. Also, the new scales are brown and starting to peel again. They seem thick as they come off. This belly peel will be the third since I first noticed it a month and a half ago. I don't know how many more times she can lose these scales.
As soon as I finish writing this, I'll clean her with 100% Hydrogen peroxide, and put her back in the tank on paper towels...
I'll take her to the vet on monday if she won't see her tomorrow, and tell her of the infection. The vet said there didn't seem to be any sign of infection last time, which there wasn't. But now I'm sure there is..
I'm really wondering if this was a burn at all, or if it's just been scale rot all along. I've never seen a snake with either, so I have no comparison. But it did happen after 1 week on sphagnum moss. Maybe there was a bacteria in the moss that infected the snake? I did soak the moss in boiling water, but maybe that wasn't enough. I may get her old smallish tank out and clean it and put her in there for awhile with a low watt bulb for heat and a drier environment. And I'll chlorinate the breeder tank and throw out that felt pad, and see how she does...
Thanks again for the advice, and concern. I'll let you all know what happens...
ax.

axwielding1 · 05-22-04, 09:17 PM

Well, I just cleaned her old,smaller tank, and even wiped it out with the hyd per. I then applied the hyd per on her affected area, (which she obviously didn't like!) and put her in the small tank on paper towels with a small waterdish(too small to get in)
I threw EVERYTHING in the other tank out, and will disinfect it tomorrow. I have no heat pad for the small tank, so I have a 60 watt black bulb clamped above it for heat. Humidity is now 40% and temp is 82.
I'll treat her twice a day, at least till monday when she goes to the vet.
As I applied the hyd per, some of her brown area came off. It's somewhat slimey, not really hard, more like a scabby type. Underneath is pink and soft.
I'm really thinking it's scale rot now.. On the sphagnum moss, the humidity was 90-100%, and the tank stayed really wet. I guess maybe too wet, and a possible bacteria in the moss I suppose.
Anyway, I don't think she'll get back to moss again. I had NO problems when she was on the felt for the first 6 months. She did seem to love the moss though, but if this clears up, I'm not risking this scenario again....
Thanks all, and I'll check back.
ax.

axwielding1 · 05-25-04, 08:24 PM

Just wanted to update all on the progress.
Angel, thank you VERY much for your helpful suggestions. I've kept Lapar on daily fresh paper towel substrate, and been cleaning her affected area twice daily and applying neosporin. She looks FAR better now, and her belly scales are healing well where they weren't as bad, and the worst parts are still pinkish but getting whiter each day!!!
I took her to the vet monday night, and after discussing it with this doctor (different one than last visit) we decided to get her on .4cc of Baytril every 48 hours, orally... BTW, it's chicken flavored. She seems to hate it, and drools and yawns for 15-20 minutes after giving it to her. Had a hell of a time getting her to open up, what with all the huffing and squirming!!!
Anyway, she's on the road to recovery, and in no small part, thanks to you Angel! She looks great and seems to be less uncomfortable and back to her old self. Hopefully this will be my first and last encounter with scale rot.
As soon as she's well, I plan to more actively look for a male banka or maylasian, hopefully with a little more SNAP in his tail, and a little more ATTITUDE than Lapar.(and maybe a lot more red)
THANK YOU AGAIN....................
ax.

sapphire_moon · 05-25-04, 09:59 PM

Glad to hear that your snake is getting better!

nita · 05-25-04, 11:09 PM

Glad to hear the good new Ax.

Borneoblood151 · 05-26-04, 11:15 AM

Hey Ax,
It is great to hear that your blood, is doing better. Glad that I was able to lend support. All the best to you and your friend.

- Angel