How to recognize stress

[Mrr]

Hey there,

I'm just curious about stress behaviour during handling with ball pythons.

As a general rule, if I take either of my BP's out and they either A.) Make nonstop attempts to hide, or B.) Sit perfectly still like a paperweight, I assume that they aren't particularly interested in being out of their enclosure and I put them back. However if they're checking out their surroundings/not attempting to hide, I'll keep them out for a bit.

Are there any other sure-fire ways to recognize stress? Aside from the obvious hissing/S-pose?

I'm curious because when I took my firefly boy out today, he seemed content to just wrap around my arm and hang out while I read - occasionally reaching out a bit to explore, but always holding on to and returning to my arm. I had him out for a while like that, until he then released my arm and attempted to hide under my legs, which I took as a sign to put him away. Am I reading him correctly?

[craigafrechette]

BPs should move in a slow, calculated manner. Erratic movements and darting around are an indication the animal is stressed.

Also, watch their tongue flicks, they should be slow and deliberate. Flicking in and out rapidly could be a sign of stress.

Lastly, you can actually watch to see their lungs expand and contract. Big, quick breaths could be a sign of stress.

Since your snake seems willing to just sit and chill with you that's a good sign.

[Mrr]

Thank you! I was a bit worried today, after a different group (who believes that ball pythons should never be handled, outside of cage cleaning) told me that I was likely stressing him out. I work in the behaviour field (albeit with people), so I thought that I would inquire a bit more about this first. From my observations, he didn't seem like he was stressed, but I'm also still learning about reptile behaviour. I've only had this guy since September, and he was quite jumpy and would be ready to strike at any movement for the first few weeks, so I'm really happy that he seems to be comfortable enough to occasionally come hang out with me. I just wanted to make sure that I wasn't missing any potential stress signals.

So I guess my follow up question is... Is handling them really that bad? As I said, the Facebook group that I'm on ("Ball Python people") states that ANY handling is too stressful for the snake, and should be avoided. However my other ball python, a 3 year old pied female that I've had since a hatchling, is so calm and seems to love to explore when she's feeling up to coming out. If she ever seems stressed or is trying to hide, I immediately put her back in her tub. She has never once in 3 years hissed, attempted to strike, or refused food.. So I'd like to think that my occasional handling (1-2x a week maybe) isn't hurting them, right?

[Mrr]

Originally Posted by craigafrechette

BPs should move in a slow, calculated manner. Erratic movements and darting around are an indication the animal is stressed.

Also, watch their tongue flicks, they should be slow and deliberate. Flicking in and out rapidly could be a sign of stress.

Lastly, you can actually watch to see their lungs expand and contract. Big, quick breaths could be a sign of stress.

Since your snake seems willing to just sit and chill with you that's a good sign.

Also, does rapid tongue flicking mean stress for every species? My brown African house snake is always flicking his tongue in and out. I just assumed it was he was curious ��*

[Veronica]

Although I know basically nothing about ball pythons, I'm pretty sure that occasional handling isn't terribly stressful for them. As long as they are eating consistently it's fine.
Just don't handle all the time.

[craigafrechette]

Originally Posted by Mrr

Also, does rapid tongue flicking mean stress for every species? My brown African house snake is always flicking his tongue in and out. I just assumed it was he was curious ��*

It certainly may be typical of that species. I'm not familiar enough with them to say for sure though. As long as it's consistent I wouldn't worry about it.

[craigafrechette]

Originally Posted by Mrr

Thank you! I was a bit worried today, after a different group (who believes that ball pythons should never be handled, outside of cage cleaning) told me that I was likely stressing him out. I work in the behaviour field (albeit with people), so I thought that I would inquire a bit more about this first. From my observations, he didn't seem like he was stressed, but I'm also still learning about reptile behaviour. I've only had this guy since September, and he was quite jumpy and would be ready to strike at any movement for the first few weeks, so I'm really happy that he seems to be comfortable enough to occasionally come hang out with me. I just wanted to make sure that I wasn't missing any potential stress signals.

So I guess my follow up question is... Is handling them really that bad? As I said, the Facebook group that I'm on ("Ball Python people") states that ANY handling is too stressful for the snake, and should be avoided. However my other ball python, a 3 year old pied female that I've had since a hatchling, is so calm and seems to love to explore when she's feeling up to coming out. If she ever seems stressed or is trying to hide, I immediately put her back in her tub. She has never once in 3 years hissed, attempted to strike, or refused food.. So I'd like to think that my occasional handling (1-2x a week maybe) isn't hurting them, right?

No, that's not true at all. I left FB years ago,it's toxic. And of all the people I know in this hobby that have years of experience and knowledge avoid FB groups like the plague.

BPs tolerate handling extremely well. Their docile nature is a big part of why they're the most popular species in the snake hobby.

That being said, they tolerate handling. They don't enjoy it or seek it out, but once trust is developed they handle very well. Use common sense with each individual animal, as they're all different. But don't let toxic FB groups steer you wrong.
I handle my BPs anywhere from 2-5 times a week depending on sheds, feeding, my spare time, etc...

[Mrr]

Originally Posted by craigafrechette

No, that's not true at all. I left FB years ago,it's toxic. And of all the people I know in this hobby that have years of experience and knowledge avoid FB groups like the plague.

BPs tolerate handling extremely well. Their docile nature is a big part of why they're the most popular species in the snake hobby.

That being said, they tolerate handling. They don't enjoy it or seek it out, but once trust is developed they handle very well. Use common sense with each individual animal, as they're all different. But don't let toxic FB groups steer you wrong.
I handle my BPs anywhere from 2-5 times a week depending on sheds, feeding, my spare time, etc...

Thank you! I have since left that particular group, as I can't stand the constant negativity. I also think its a bit ridiculous to attack people for handling their snakes every so often. Good riddance

I appreciate you clearing that up for me though! I do my best to pay attention to the signals that my animals are giving off, and would hate to think that I'm missing something and potentially harming my snakes. I guess I'll just keep doing what I'm doing then

[craigafrechette]

Originally Posted by Mrr

Thank you! I have since left that particular group, as I can't stand the constant negativity. I also think its a bit ridiculous to attack people for handling their snakes every so often. Good riddance

I appreciate you clearing that up for me though! I do my best to pay attention to the signals that my animals are giving off, and would hate to think that I'm missing something and potentially harming my snakes. I guess I'll just keep doing what I'm doing then

My pleasure, I'm happy to help.

Sounds like you're doing things right to me. Honestly, common sense goes a long way, and it sounds like you're using common sense. So just keep doing what you're doing. Try to end handling sessions on a positive note too.
Keep up the good work and don't be shy if you have questions in the future.