Opinion on this rule of thumb for the size of a snake enclosure?

Tyzuris · 02-11-18, 08:47 AM

So I am going to be getting a burmese pythons in the future, and my idea for the cage of the burm is that the longest side will be equal to the average length of a burm at about 14ft, then the width will be half of that, and the height will be one third of the length of the enclosure.

So what do you think about my plan for the enclosure size? I've been thinking two burms and their cages would be stacked on top of each other.

IDvsEGO · 02-12-18, 07:41 AM

That is pretty much what I am following for my snakes, but none are burms. I was told that as long as the length and depth were equal to the snakes total length it would be OK but that seems small to me. I like your rules better.

Roman · 02-12-18, 02:00 PM

The size of your proposed enclosure sounds great, a large Burmese python would certainly appreciate the room to move in. I don’t want to talk you out of it, but you have to consider several issues with an enclosure of that size.

We are talking about a room sized enclosure, let’s call it a room. In order to clean it you have to walk into the enclosure / room, so don’t reduce the height to 150 cm / 5 ft, use the full height of the room you build it in so you can stand in it.

If you enter the enclosure, you will come near your snake(s), not only with a hand or some tools but with your full body and avoiding a bite might proof more difficult that way. I have no experience with large pythons, someone like Tsubaki is much better suited to tell you this, but I saw several large Burmese pythons which were really nasty. I don’t doubt that there are calm snakes out there as well, it will come down to the individual snake, but you have to plan for the worst case and need somebody at home whenever you work with a large snake.

Have you considered the amount of energy you will need to light and heat so much room? Especially during a Finish winter?

Tyzuris · 02-12-18, 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roman

We are talking about a room sized enclosure, let’s call it a room. In order to clean it you have to walk into the enclosure / room, so don’t reduce the height to 150 cm / 5 ft, use the full height of the room you build it in so you can stand in it.

But if I have a 150cm tall enclosure, then I can stack two on top of each other having a cage for two burmese pythons in the same floor space one requires. Basically because a female is larger, have the bottom cage be for the female, then the above cage for the male.

Roman · 02-12-18, 02:54 PM

I suppose you are missing my point. If you build it as you propose it’s dimensions would be about 430 x 210 150 cm (14 x 7 x 5 ft). How do you want to reach the back of your enclosure if it is 200 cm deep (wide)? Especially if there is another enclosure of the same size on top where you would probably have to step on a small ladder to reach in. I have a large enclosure for my Spilotes pullatus which is 250 x 90 x 190 cm (ca 8 x 3 x 6 ft), and even a three feed deep enclosure can be difficult to do maintenance in.

Tyzuris · 02-12-18, 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roman

How do you want to reach the back of your enclosure if it is 200 cm deep (wide)? Especially if there is another enclosure of the same size on top where you would probably have to step on a small ladder to reach in. I have a large enclosure for my Spilotes pullatus which is 250 x 90 x 190 cm (ca 8 x 3 x 6 ft), and even a three feed deep enclosure can be difficult to do maintenance in.

I would buy cleaning apparatus with a telescope handle in order to reach the entire two meters of the width of the enclosure. And I would install a divider slot into the enclosure for cleaning it. So I would move the snake to the other side of the enclosure, then slide a divider panel to the divider slot and push it all the way back to the wall when I clean out the other half of the enclosure then do the repeat for the other half.

IDvsEGO · 02-12-18, 03:02 PM

you lifting a 14 foot snake 5 ft in the air to get it in there? or chunking substrate up there? also, thats a lot of weight to support (enclosure, substrate, appropriately sized water bowl, and the snake. Not saying it is impossible but keep it in mind. and yeah, getting to the back of a 7 foot deep enclosure with only 5 feet of headroom means hands and knees. also, a snake enclosure directly on the floor means you might not see much of the snake without getting down on your knees.

Roman · 02-12-18, 03:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyzuris

I would buy cleaning apparatus with a telescope handle in order to reach the entire two meters of the width of the enclosure. And I would install a divider slot into the enclosure for cleaning it. So I would move the snake to the other side of the enclosure, then slide a divider panel to the divider slot and push it all the way back to the wall when I clean out the other half of the enclosure then do the repeat for the other half.

Sounds good in theory, but believe me it won’t work in praxis. To work with a tool this long you would need about the same room behind you, otherwise you would bump into the wall behind you. Balancing the amounts of feces a large snake can and will produce will result in scattering most of it all over the place. There will an obstacle like branches, hiding box, water bowl etc. in your way whenever you try to reach the back end of your enclosure.

The divider is a nice touch, but most likely your snake won’t cooperate, it will of course be at the dirty side and will stay there, especially if you are in a hurry. And of course the points IDvsEGO raised, don’t underestimate the weight of an enclosure of this size.

Tyzuris · 02-12-18, 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roman

Sounds good in theory, but believe me it won’t work in praxis. To work with a tool this long you would need about the same room behind you, otherwise you would bump into the wall behind you. Balancing the amounts of feces a large snake can and will produce will result in scattering most of it all over the place. There will an obstacle like branches, hiding box, water bowl etc. in your way whenever you try to reach the back end of your enclosure.

The divider is a nice touch, but most likely your snake won’t cooperate, it will of course be at the dirty side and will stay there, especially if you are in a hurry. And of course the points IDvsEGO raised, don’t underestimate the weight of an enclosure of this size.

Alright. Thanks for bringing some insightful feedback on my idea here. I appreciate it.

**Tsubaki** · 02-13-18, 10:16 AM

The sizing sounds great.. But I can tell you from personal experience having a very deep enclosure is only a good idea, if you really have the room to move around in it (mostly) upright, or if you're willing to put up with a lot of inconveniences. I volunteer at a zoo where we have a few crappy sized enclosures (As in crappy to clean, they're actually amazing and spacious for the inhabitants). It's is quite a pain always having to remove an animal just to safely clean. Especially if it's a heavy one with attitude. Telescope handles can't handle heavy snakes that far away, they Will break/bend. You'll have to drag it out of your way while getting pretty up close, but without being able to grab and lift it properly it will likely wriggle away and obviously proceed to move whatever direction is least convenient for you at that time, because its a snake haha. Also if they get annoyed, you got nowhere to go quickly. For safety reasons we just pair up, one keeps the animal away while the other cleans.. But still you're both crawling through the moist bedding, nasty... so we wear plastic overals over our clothing. Long handle tools work sort of for small cleanings, but not for the larger messes (Which giants will always have, often multiple days in a row) they either bend too much and spill easily, or they are really heavy and hard to use. If the animal is in a clean area we sometimes just trap it under a laundry basket to save time if possible.

But yeah the designer didn't think about cleaning on those enclosures.. Luckily there's only 3 of them and the rest is much easier.

A deviding enclosure is a nice idea in theory, but you still have to drag the animal up close and personal through a dirty enclosure while someone else puts it in. Because NO WAY the animal will just stay where you put it and allow you time to get out and slide it in yourself;.., I've use devider enclosures, they're much more of a hassle than you'd think in the first place. Bedding gets stuck in between, the animal could get stuck in between, the opening is drafty, also the mess will sometimes be on the slider... A see through board (plexiglass) with a handle was my favourite tool dealing with aggressive giants or venomous snakes during cleaning.

I prefer to keep my enclosures +/- 90cm deep max unless I can sort of stand in it, any deeper and I feel like I have to crawl inside for everything. It's a bit personal as not everyone is the same size or as flexible as another offcourse.

Had some neat enclosures in my old house, my favourites ones were 2 very long enclosures (3,5m+) which were also 160cm deep and only 110 tall each if I remember correctly (2 stacked on top of each other).. BUT.. I had them on top of a frame with heavy wheels under it, and they had hatches on the backside. All I had to do was unlock the wheels, pull it forward and open whatever hatch the mess was close to.. Perfect range!! Just gotta watch where the animal is before opening the hatch haha (peepholes recommended). Also got to figure out your wiring in a way that you wont mess it up when pulling them forward.