37 killed from Marijuana - Day of legalization in Colorado

[MDT]

[KORBIN5895]

Originally Posted by robertjnovak59

I like debates about legalizing drugs. People on both sides are pretty passionate about their beliefs. I think there are a lot of misconceptions about drugs out there that sway people one way or the other. Personally, I think spending billions to criminalize drug use is as rational as using the drugs recreationally. Its like flushing money down the toilet.

I think legalizing something that causes you to sell everything you have and let your kids starve is asinine......

Not referring to pot.

[Sublimeballs]

Originally Posted by robertjnovak59

I like debates about legalizing drugs. People on both sides are pretty passionate about their beliefs. I think there are a lot of misconceptions about drugs out there that sway people one way or the other. Personally, I think spending billions to criminalize drug use is as rational as using the drugs recreationally. Its like flushing money down the toilet.

I'm wondering if you wrote this wrong. How could wasting billions of dollars a year on something that will NEVER change(stoping people for smoking it) be as rational as responsible adults useing marijuana?

[robertjnovak59]

Originally Posted by KORBIN5895

I think legalizing something that causes you to sell everything you have and let your kids starve is asinine......

Not referring to pot.

An addict will use whether its legal or illegal. Laws don't make addicts responsible. A gambling addict can put his her family in the same situation. Putting an addict in prison doesn't change him into a nonaddict. I think treating the addiction would get better results.

[robertjnovak59]

Originally Posted by Sublimeballs

I'm wondering if you wrote this wrong. How could wasting billions of dollars a year on something that will NEVER change(stoping people for smoking it) be as rational as responsible adults useing marijuana?

That's my point but whether its responsible use or irresponsible use, the laws don't stop it from happening.

[formica]

There are more professionals, who are addicted to pharmaceutical opiates, and alcohol, than there are heroin and crack addicts, in the UK and US.

They dont sell everything they own or steal to support their habbit - why? because its not the addiction itself which causes peoples lives to fall apart

Addiction, and the drugs which people become addicted to, are just a coping mechanism....they are essentially an anti-depressant.

I find it strange that Antidepressants are so widley distributed, given the raft of side effects, and the (psychological) addiction potential, aswell as some of the horrific and destructive psychiatric side effects which can occur

Compared to Opiates, antidepressants are responsible for far more potential side effects - opiates are an issue because people do not have the support they need to reduce their use and deal with life in a better way, as the user becomes more addicted they are restricted to less and less pure opiates

unlike with anti-depressants, which are chemically pure and dose controlled and a doctor is monitoring the patient (theoretically), awell as referring them for other psychological therapies to deal with the cause of their problems.

If opiates where used in the same way, or addiction was treated in the same way, opiates would not be seen in the way they are today.

As usual, Western Medicine ignored the ''inferior'' knowledge of Chinese doctors when Morphine and Opium was introduced to western medicine, the whole reason opiates where criminalized, was because doctors turned hundreds of thousands of serving soldiers into addicts within a few years...all because they didnt listen to the advice they where given by a culture which had used opiates for more than 3000 years

I dont know how health services could successfully deal with legalized crack cocaine, tbh, or methamphetamine, but i do know that if services change so that they help people deal with the problems they have in their lives, then neither of those drugs would be an issue - but given that Poverty is one of the main reasons people are driven to those addictions, its hard to see how our society, as it currently views the world, ie that greed and self service is a good aspirational goal, could ever help those people.

[robertjnovak59]

I'd guess a lot of addicts situations were similar to mine. I believed I was keeping things together really well. But it felt like I was losing myself a little piece at a time. I'd let a bill go late, told myself I'd take care of it next payday. Let my brothers birthday go by, told myself I'd call him tomorrow. Then a few years blew by in one big blur. I remember waking up in my van, didn't have enough gas to drive around the block, had no money, no job, no where to go. I clearly remember wondering how this happened. Everyone I knew had given up on me. The job that paid me very well was a faint memory. With as long as it took me to get to that point, it felt like a bad month. It doesn't matter what the laws say, an addict lives by his own rules.

[Sublimeballs]

Originally Posted by robertjnovak59

That's my point but whether its responsible use or irresponsible use, the laws don't stop it from happening.

No, but spending billions of dollars a year to try and stop something that obviously isn't going to end isn't the solution; especially with our economy as bad as it is. You yourself said that the law doesn't stop it, so why not stop spending so much money on trying to stop it, and locking so many people up because of it and put that money to taking care of the real problems?

[Sublimeballs]

Originally Posted by robertjnovak59

I'd guess a lot of addicts situations were similar to mine. I believed I was keeping things together really well. But it felt like I was losing myself a little piece at a time. I'd let a bill go late, told myself I'd take care of it next payday. Let my brothers birthday go by, told myself I'd call him tomorrow. Then a few years blew by in one big blur. I remember waking up in my van, didn't have enough gas to drive around the block, had no money, no job, no where to go. I clearly remember wondering how this happened. Everyone I knew had given up on me. The job that paid me very well was a faint memory. With as long as it took me to get to that point, it felt like a bad month. It doesn't matter what the laws say, an addict lives by his own rules.

If its not to personal do you mind if I ask what the source of your addiction was?

[robertjnovak59]

I agree with you that it shouldn't be illegal. But I'd advise everyone to stay sober. I know I'm biased in that regard. Lol. If it was available I used it. But mainly coke. I've got 2 felonies now, one for cocaine possesion, one for heroin possesion.

[MDT]

I could do this all day
So much material here!!!

[shaunyboy]

Originally Posted by formica

There are more professionals, who are addicted to pharmaceutical opiates, and alcohol, than there are heroin and crack addicts, in the UK and US.

They dont sell everything they own or steal to support their habbit - why? because its not the addiction itself which causes peoples lives to fall apart

Addiction, and the drugs which people become addicted to, are just a coping mechanism....they are essentially an anti-depressant.

I find it strange that Antidepressants are so widley distributed, given the raft of side effects, and the (psychological) addiction potential, aswell as some of the horrific and destructive psychiatric side effects which can occur

Compared to Opiates, antidepressants are responsible for far more potential side effects - opiates are an issue because people do not have the support they need to reduce their use and deal with life in a better way, as the user becomes more addicted they are restricted to less and less pure opiates

unlike with anti-depressants, which are chemically pure and dose controlled and a doctor is monitoring the patient (theoretically), awell as referring them for other psychological therapies to deal with the cause of their problems.

If opiates where used in the same way, or addiction was treated in the same way, opiates would not be seen in the way they are today.

As usual, Western Medicine ignored the ''inferior'' knowledge of Chinese doctors when Morphine and Opium was introduced to western medicine, the whole reason opiates where criminalized, was because doctors turned hundreds of thousands of serving soldiers into addicts within a few years...all because they didnt listen to the advice they where given by a culture which had used opiates for more than 3000 years

I dont know how health services could successfully deal with legalized crack cocaine, tbh, or methamphetamine, but i do know that if services change so that they help people deal with the problems they have in their lives, then neither of those drugs would be an issue - but given that Poverty is one of the main reasons people are driven to those addictions, its hard to see how our society, as it currently views the world, ie that greed and self service is a good aspirational goal, could ever help those people.

here in the U.K. a few years back there were some experementil pilot schemes, where they gave a group of heroin addicts a heroin maintenance prescription,they provided injectable heroin.....

a high percentage (roughly 80%) of the addicts led productive lives,holding down jobs and were leading stable lives...

so the figures back up that giving the addicts what they need had more positive results than negative

the addicts got consistent doses and purety,this takes the criminals out the equation

a lot of Country's that are or have been involved in the American War on Drugs,have or are thinking of de criminalizing personal amounts of drugs...

here's a link on decriminalizing drugs in Portugal and its affects...

https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rc...58187178,d.ZG4


cheers shaun

[Sublimeballs]

Originally Posted by MDT

I could do this all day
So much material here!!!

I'm surprised you haven't had anything to add to this conversation with your insight to the medical world. Other then making everyone laugh of coarse.

[MDT]

Dude...other than Cheech and Chong jokes or references to The Breakfast Club, I'm outta this one

[Sublimeballs]

Originally Posted by MDT

Dude...other than Cheech and Chong jokes or references to The Breakfast Club, I'm outta this one

Really? I was hoping to hear your input to the medical aspects. Don't want to go on the record huh?