Syringe Feeding - Getting Veiled's Mouth Open

[J-Man]

Hi Ice

Thankfully, like I said I can see no difference in the eyes... they're just closed. As for the cage, his cage set-up was a bit iffy a day or 2 ago... there weren't a whole lot of intersecting "highways" so to speak... it was very centralized. So I re-arranged it and now it was very dispersed and has lots of "highways."

I can't really be sure if he falls asleep or not because his eyes are always closed but it certainly does seem like it sometimes. As I told Trace before, he's really not that active... which kind of worries me.

Thanks

Jeremy

By the way, don't worry about the long posts.... I really don't mind at all.

[J-Man]

Update:

Good news. Duke is looking very plump (thanks to his 10 1/2 ml or whatever of that "bug" mix). He's looking perfectly colored, a very beautiful green and it looks like he's starting to show his colors, tan stripes and maybe a hint of yellow. Also, I went up to water him and he had one eye open. I watered him and he closed it (naturally) and I stopped and he opened it... so I watered some more (lots) and after I was done he opened one eye and had the other open a little bit... which is the first time he's had his left eye open at all in a long time.

I don't think I've stressed just how much he ate... he's only a little under 4 in. nose to vent (butt?) and he ate a syringe full worth of that crap... that thing's longer than him!!!

I'll keep you posted with any more news... I'm sure I'll have something tomorrow.

[Trace]

Oh geez, I'm behind on this thread again! So I'm going to answer everyones comments at once! Hopefully this won't get too confusing!

verbatim eh? Well isn't it "There are THOSE who call me... 'tim'?" I could very easily be wrong...

HAHAHAHA! You could be right as well... I have not had access to the TV tonight, so I was unable to watch the movie. I'm stuck at home tomorrow waiting for my shipment of bugs, so I'll try and pop it in, if the roomies aren't around. BTW, I've been laughing at your joke ALL day! Thanks!

I'm going to contact my vet though, and ask about the Emeraid Nutri-Support you mentioned. If nothing else, I'd like to buy a bigger container of meal replacement, than these little 50 grams bags, for 13 dollars a pop.

That Emeraid powder is similar to the Repti-Aide stuff that you are using. It is meant for long term nutritional support for ailing birds and reptiles. It's high in Vitamin A, proteins and carbohydrates and low in fat. This is not something I would use permanently, but can be used long-term. If you are asking your vet, it used to be called Emeraid II and it cost me about $30.00 CAD for a 396g container. I think there is smaller containers available as well?

I too am concerned about the long term use of repta-aide.

What are you going to do though? He won't eat on his own, so he needs the nutrition somehow. What is the lesser of two evils... a slowly starving chameleon or one who is leading a fairly normal life on the Repti-Aide? I don't think I've mentioned it elsewhere, but kudos to you for taking that guy in and spending so much time, energy and money bringing him back to health.

Trace, I didn't know you read KS...do you post there as well?

Never! I've read your trials on the Chameleonresearch forums. Now there is board that I hope gets a little more active in the future as there is some interesting members there. I agree this place is a bit more "family feeling" than other lists I belong to.

And finally Jeremy...

Good news. Duke is looking very plump (thanks to his 10 1/2 ml or whatever of that "bug" mix).

LOL! I bet he'll give you a nice big poop tomorrow! Here's a crazy question... has he ever been dewormed? I doubt that's his problem, but, hey, it's worth asking. Again I'm stumped as to what his problem is, but I'm sssoooo happy to hear that he is taking the food (and so much of it!) so well and seems to be a bit perkier.

Thanks to the two of you for making this thread so interesting.

Go Duke!

There are some (those?) who call me... Trace

[J-Man]

Trace,

Gee I can't wait to wake up and find a little present for me!

He's never been dewormed that I know of, I bought him when he was about 1 month old from lllreptile.com. I haven't noticed anything that looks like a worm in his stomach (you should be able to see it, right?) His stomach is perfectly smooth as far as I can tell.

Don't worry about getting behind... almost all of my questions have been answered so you have no duties

Thanks,

J-Man Jeremy

[Trace]

Hey Hey J-Man!

I haven't noticed anything that looks like a worm in his stomach (you should be able to see it, right?) His stomach is perfectly smooth as far as I can tell.

Yes and no. The worms you are referring to are subcutaneous nematodes that live beneath the skin and you can see those. I don't think you are going to see those kinds of parasites in captive bred chameleons like yours. Chameleons can be infested with things like pinworms, roundworms and even tapeworms though. Most of those buggers are microscopic and live in the intestines of animals, so you won't be able to see them. Basically they attach themselves to the linings of internal organs and suck the blood. Too many of these types of parasites can weaken an animal to the point of death.

Bring a fresh poop to the vet and they can run tests to see if little Duke has got any of these parasites. If he does, there are very safe medications you can use to rid him of these things.

Don't worry about getting behind... almost all of my questions have been answered so you have no duties

If that's the case... then I'm off to bed! LOL!

Go Duke!

There are some who call me... Trace <-- I'm beginning to like that sig!

[icequeen]

This is my baby....Zoe



and this is his home...

[Trace]

Kim, I've never seen pics of your little Zoe and I wasn't sure what to expect from him because of all of his health problems. All I can say is, he looks FANTASTIC! His colours are bright, his eyes are nice and bulgey and he isn't skinny in the least. WOWSERS!

Your dedication to him as paid off. I know he is still a handful for you, but you've given him another chance at a decent life. Good work!

Feel like building me some cages? LOL! Zoe certainly is spoiled living in a palace like that!

Trace

[Collide]

Yea that cage is a bueaty I might steal some of your ideas! LOL

And Zoe is one sexy Chameleon!

[J-Man]

Wow Ice!

Beautiful cham and even more beautiful cage!

Trace

Can any vet do those tests? even if they don't specialize in chams?

Also, in his bad eye (or worse eye for that matter), his left, I saw an odd bulge sorta. It's the same bulge I've seen in both the male and female.. it happens when I water them, like water gets inside their eye. It seems to correlate with their breathing... like it gets bigger then smaller, bigger then smaller. This happened with both my male and female so I doubt it's a problem because what are the odd of that...?

Jeremy

By the way, I like that sig too

[Trace]

Hi Jeremy!

Can any vet do those tests? even if they don't specialize in chams?

I prefer to use a reptile vet for all things medical and I'm lucky that I've got one really close to me, but ANY vet can run tests on a fecal sample. Worms are worms. Problem is, some vets may want to see your chameleon before running the tests, so it might be worth looking for a proper herp vet in Pittsburgh. Some don't.

As for the eye thing on your pair... it does sound like they just got water underneath their eyelids when you sprayed them and they are just trying to get it out. Exactly... what are the odds of both of them doing it!

How is Duke today?

There are some who call me... Trace <--- I'm going with it!

[J-Man]

Duke's doing pretty good... a little more active (expecially while I'm watering him). Surprisingly I haven't found any poop yet... I tried feeding him again today but I think he's a little bloated from yesterday's feast! I fed him a little and gave up. I'll probably feed him significantly again tomorrow. He was LOOKING very good today, showing perfect colors as usual. Well, I'm gonna go check f or poop and water the hell out of him again.

Jeremy

P.S. I wish I could leave more..... dramatically, it would better fit my..... idium. Ok, that was sad, I couldn't really fit it into a sentence that would suit me very well...

[Trace]

NI!

I want a shrubbery... you must return here with a shrubbery, or else, you will never pass through this thread... alive!

Oh dear... look what you've started! LOL!

That's great news! Remember you are giving him a fairly liquid diet at the moment, so it may be a few days before something solid comes out the back end.

Go Duke!

There are some who call me... Trace

[J-Man]

Well Trace, IT would be very hard to find a shrubbery in such a thread. You better believe IT when I say that IT is practically impossible and IT is very unlikely I will return with a shrubbery.

My mom likes that movie a lot too... when she had AOL she made it say "*THWONG* Message for you sir" whenever she got e-mail.

J-meister

[J-Man]

Here's another update:

Duke's doing about the same, I got some wax/meal worms today and made some more bug juice for him... he ate a few cc's. I also tried opening his mouth and having my girlfriend put a wax worm in but he seemingly spit it out. He's still not very active, which worries me. I had him out today for his feeding and I was watering him directly and I put him on a cord so he could climb (he was getting bored of my hands and kept coming close to falling off) and he climbed up and just sat there so I let him go as I checked my e-mail and stuff like that (don't worry he was right next to the computer) I look over and I saw him poop. It was mushy again but the right coloring this time (last time it was all brown). He opened his eye for a little while today, but only one. I have a question, can he eat with only one eye open? I mean eat with his tongue, not by syringe.

I think that's about it! Thanks for all your help.

Jeremy - The Knight who says Icky-Icky-Zaboo-Bating-Voom-Hausen

[icequeen]

Trace and Jeremy...thank you for the compliments on Zoe, and his enclosure.
He is a lot of work...but, if I don't feed him...who else will. It's only an extra few minutes out of my day among all the other things I do. Besides...how many people get to hold a lizard in their lap and baby talk to it on a daily basis!

Jeremy...what did the waxies come in? Did they come in some sort of wood shavings? I wondered if that left a bad taste on them, as Zoe won't eat them either. I also noticed that it was nearly impossible to get all the tiny bits of wood or whatever that was off of them!
It can't possibly taste good...or be good for them to eat.

(By the, on another note...I posted a picture of my Corucia Zebrata in the general lizard forum, if you'd like to get a peek at Dill.)

Don't give up on Duke...I've read about people having to force feed their cham for months, then all of sudden they start eating on thier own. I'm still hoping Zoe will too!

Kim