Snake Identification Help

gibbons530 · 06-16-12, 08:10 PM

I'm new to these forums... I'm glad to join and be able to share my interest in herpetology with you guys. Where I live snakes are hated by most people and are killed when seen (I guess it's that way everywhere.)

I found this snake in Houston County, Georgia which is in middle Georgia on the coastal plain. I saw this snake a few feet from a lake in grass near a mixed forest. It was very relaxed and did not seem to be bothered by me holding it. I took some pictures but I still cannot identify it. It was a fat brown snake with a small darker colored head. The underside is what I think will help distinguish it from other snakes. It almost has a white and orange checkered coloration. I apologize for the bad picture quality, it was taken on my cell phone. If you have any idea what kind it is, please let me know! Thanks!

MDT · 06-16-12, 08:28 PM

Looks water snake-ish....pics a little fuzzy. That's my guess.

alessia55 · 06-16-12, 08:33 PM

Welcome to the forum! Please read our sSNAKESs forum rules.

I can't really ID the snake, but I would advise you to, in the future, no matter now tame the snake is, Never handle it unless you are certain of what kind of snake it is. Even a venomous snake can appear tame and you might end up getting bitten.

StudentoReptile · 06-16-12, 08:49 PM

Looks maybe like a yellow-bellied water snake. And maybe like it had a recent meal, too.

gibbons530 · 06-16-12, 08:52 PM

Thanks for the responses. I first checked to make sure the snake was not a venomous snake. We only have coral snakes, copperheads, cottonmouths, and rattlesnakes here and I knew this was not any of them. I was especially careful and had a stick to help hold it. I know it probably could have still been dangerous, but I guess I like the thrill of holding a snake.

I was hoping that the underbelly would be the distinguishing factor. I am having trouble looking for pictures of different snakes' underbellies though.

gibbons530 · 06-16-12, 09:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by StudentoReptile

Looks maybe like a yellow-bellied water snake. And maybe like it had a recent meal, too.

Sorry for the double post... I didn't notice your post until after my 30 minutes of being able to edit my post expired. Anyways...

I had that as one of the possibilities of what it could be, but the only thing that makes me think that it is something else is the fact that apparently yellow-bellied water snakes are a subspecies of plain-bellied water snake which has a plain belly with no patterns. Apparently it is the only kind of water snake in Georgia without a belly design. It the possibility of a mutation or a hybrid possible? Other than the belly pattern, it does look like a yellow-bellied water snake from the pictures I've seen online.

A few other possibilities are the queen snake and the mud snake. Any idea?

brandonh · 06-17-12, 01:39 AM

from looking at the photos im not sure its a queen snake either
hers couple pics of one i found here

however i cannot say what snake you have there looks pretty awesome tho

StudentoReptile · 06-17-12, 10:26 AM

Salt marsh snake maybe?

gibbons530 · 06-17-12, 12:33 PM

The head and body color are spot on for a queen snake. The queen snake also is found in the middle Georgia area. The only issue is the underside does not match that picture. Can snakes have unique undersides or does that define them as a species?

maximus30576 · 06-17-12, 12:46 PM

Welcome gibbons i to am a fellow Georgian , up in the northeast corner .. Wish i could identify your snake but i am stumped on this one ..

gibbons530 · 06-17-12, 01:57 PM

Yeah it sure is a tough one. I actually have a good herping book called Reptiles and Amphibians of Georgia that shows the different counties that snakes are in and gives good info. Even with that though, I cannot figure out what this is. I'm thinking that it is a queen snake, but it doesn't match up with other queen snakes I have seen. Thanks for trying to help out though, at least I don't feel dumb for not being able to ID it.

hahaha

brylecc1989 · 06-17-12, 03:45 PM

I think it is possible for stomach patterning to vary slightly from organism to organism within a species. Looks very much like a queen snake.

gibbons530 · 06-18-12, 02:32 PM

I'm going to assume that it is a queen snake. If anyone objects, please let me know, I don't want to check off the wrong snake on my herp checklist!

StudentoReptile · 06-18-12, 03:10 PM

I still think its some form of Nerodia sp., but I will admit this one has been confusing!

gibbons530 · 06-18-12, 05:03 PM

Here is the list of snakes of South Carolina and Georgia I found. (Snakes of South Carolina and Georgia | SREL Herpetology) Maybe I can narrow down what is on this list? I'll put the snakes ruled out in silver. If you know another snake to narrow down, let me know.

Worm Snake (Carphophis amoenus)
Scarlet Snake (Cemophora coccinea)
Black Racer (Coluber constrictor)
Ringneck Snake (Diadophis punctatus)
Eastern Indigo Snake (Drymarchon couperi)
Corn Snake (Elaphe guttata)
Rat Snake (Elaphe obsoleta)
Mud Snake (Farancia abacura)
Rainbow Snake (Farancia erytrogramma)
Eastern Hognose Snake (Heterodon platirhinos)
Southern Hognose Snake (Heterodon simus)
Mole Kingsnake (Lampropeltis calligaster)
Eastern Kingsnake (Lampropeltis getula)
Milk Snake/Scarlet Kingsnake (Lampropeltis triangulum)
Coachwhip (Masticophis flagellum)
Red-bellied Water Snake (Nerodia erythrogaster)
Banded Water Snake (Nerodia fasciata)
Green Water Snake (Nerodia floridana)
Northern Water Snake (Nerodia sipedon)
Brown Water Snake (Nerodia taxispilota)
Rough Green Snake (Opheodrys aestivus)
Pine Snake (Pituophis melanoleucus)
Striped Crayfish Snake (Regina alleni)
Glossy Crayfish Snake (Regina rigida)
Queen Snake (Regina septemvittata)
Pine Woods Snake (Rhadinaea flavilata)
Black Swamp Snake (Seminatrix pygaea)
Brown Snake (Storeria dekayi)
Red-bellied Snake (Storeria occipitomaculata)
Florida Brown Snake (Storeria victa)
Southeastern Crowned Snake (Tantilla coronata)
Central Florida Crowned Snake (Tantilla relicta)
Eastern Ribbon Snake (Thamnophis sauritus)
Eastern Garter Snake (Thamnophis sirtalis)
Rough Earth Snake (Virginia striatula)
Smooth Earth Snake (Virginia valeriae)

I know this doesn't narrow down things much, but these are all of the possibilities that I know of. If a grayed out anything that could be it, let me know. Also if you know that there is something that it cannot be, let me know and I'll fix it. I know this seems like overkill just to find out a snake but I really would like to figure this snake out!

UPDATE: I think I found a hybrid! Nerodia fasciata X sipedon (northern banded water snake). Look at these links.
Nerodia fasciata X sipedon (Water Snake hybrid) | Flickr - Photo Sharing! (looks like the right one)
Nerodia sipedon X fasciata? | Flickr - Photo Sharing!

What do you guys think?