Cal king feeding on culled cornsnake (pics)

vanderkm · 09-07-04, 01:38 PM

We had a single cal king hatchling this year that has not shown any interest in mice. I had a couple corns that refused to feed (8-10 offerings, various methods) that I decided to kill rather than go the route of forcefeeding them this year. This year is the first time we have fed snakes to a snake so I took a few pics of this cal king's second meal to share.

The cornsnake was killed (brain crushed) just before being offered to the king. Anyone who would object to feeding culled corns to kings should not look no further - I don't wish to offend anyone, but I find the process an interesting difference from feeding mice and thought I would share with others who might be interested.

The king is very vigorous in biting and wrapping as soon as the prey snake is introduced to his tub and he has bitten the neck near the head each time he has been fed.

You can see by the extended tongue of the corn that it is dead, but the bite around the neck in combination with the strong wrapping would be sufficient to aspyhxiate it. He wraps the corn very strongly and persists until reflex movement is almost gone

This was quite a long corn and it is a short, small cal king - you can see the difference in relative size of their heads

and comparable body sizes as he aligns the corn to start swollowing

almost completed with the typical bulges apparent as he swollows the whole body

Within 3 days the bulges are no longer visible, within 5 days there is barely an overall bulge in his belly. The cal king is thriving so far - I am a bit worried about converting him to mice, but was more concerned about getting him to start feeding and if he is a typical cal king he will eat anything once he is established.

It was over 2 weeks between meals and I plan to offer mice again for the next meal in another 2 and then 3 weeks time.

mary v.

Scales Zoo · 09-07-04, 01:59 PM

Very cool pictures, thanks for sharing.

Did you weigh each snake? I'd be interested to know what they weighed.

Would also be neat to do an experiment, to see how much the kings grow when fed snakes, as compared to how much they grow when fed the same weight in mice.

Ryan

Kevin McRae · 09-07-04, 02:15 PM

I love corns and kings, but I have no problem feeding one to another if it is needed.....

Very interesting....

marisa · 09-07-04, 02:25 PM

I read someone saying a few years ago they thought snake fed kings grow larger than mouse fed kings. I don't think it would really matter, but it will be interesting to see the outcome in either case...although you say you are switching him to mice anyways.....is he/she bigger than its siblings?

Marisa

vanderkm · 09-07-04, 03:41 PM

Ryan - good point - I didn't get weights - the one piece of essential equipment I don't have yet is a really good scale. I think they were likely pretty equal in overall weight but it would be very interesting to know for sure.

Marisa - I have also heard that those fed snakes seem to grow faster and thrive more than those fed mice. This little guy was the only one to hatch from his clutch - the only reason I am switching to mice is because I don't have access to corns to feed him continuously - mice are cheaper!! Just wanted to get him started and not waste any corns.

I actually think this king is a bit weird - he seems very short and thick bodied - not as long as other hatchlings I have seen - wonder if he will grow to proper proportions regardless of what he is fed.

mary v.

gonesnakee · 09-07-04, 04:07 PM

Ya Big Meanie Mary! LOL I too just culled a couple of Corns the other day. One to the PacMan Frog & one to White Widow (adult female CK) I had never fed a snake to another before, not that I'm againest it, but I didn't want to promote feeding responses from the smell of other snakes. WW had already eaten snake before though & tries to eat me just about everyday already so I figured what the heck. The PM Frog has eaten a few in its day too. I have sent culled specimens to Kyle's to make snake mush for scenting food for Eastern Indigos too. If they can't make it at least they can help some one else along I figure, Mark

Colonel_SB · 09-07-04, 08:34 PM

Excellent shots man

Katt · 09-07-04, 08:41 PM

We have feed different species of culled snak to different snakes, notably kings and jungle corns although one of Vanan's house snakes did eat another snake. The snakes that have been raised on eating occasional snakes, take very quickly to being fed snakes, whilist adults whom we did not raise showed little interest.

I find the snakes whom have been fed other snakes are better eaters and have a nice shine to their scale. If I coud afford it, feeder snakes would be on the menu for many of my kings.

Amazing how that king got such a big meal down!!!

Will · 09-08-04, 01:44 AM

Wow, just amazing to see what they can actually fit in their stomachs. Good to hear that that little guy has eaten...

Very interesting post.

ChunkyMunky · 09-08-04, 01:58 AM

Very cool pictures! I am curious, how long did it take for him to finish that meal?

vanderkm · 09-08-04, 08:54 AM

It was quite a big meal for this king, but he finished it from first strike to the final pic (I put him back after that - not sure how long it took to get the tail end down) in about 35 minutes - but almost half that time was to finish constricting - even when it is dead he spent a lot of time holding it before he started to eat.

It amazes me how they really hold it tight in their coils and stretch it out - he seemed to put a lot of energy into pulling it toward him before he would swollow a length of it.

While he looks pretty thick now - 3 days later - there are not bulges left and he is cruising his tub looking for more. It will be 2 weeks before his next meal - I offer mice first and will try with a frozen/thawed snake if he doesn't take the mice. We were feeding our cull corns to our Oscar fish last year - didn't think of using the Pac Man frog!

mary v.

seann · 09-11-04, 11:53 PM

I'm sad but i think i'll be able to tuff it out, dont cry seanny
Thats it its war i am going to breed a killer corn and glue big fands on them muhahahahahahaha its war!

herpslave · 09-12-04, 12:17 AM

I enjoy feeding mice to my pac man much more then a beautiful corn, though I am not against corn feeding. Have you ever tried feeder anoles?

I am not against snake cannabalism, but You can get feeder anoles 3 dollars each dead and alive.

gonesnakee · 09-12-04, 01:49 PM

Herpslave, I don't think ya get it. The Corns are being "culled". Breeders cull animals all the time because of birth defects etc. They are being euthanized because they don't have what it takes to make it in life, not because they are the only things the snakes, Pacmans etc. will eat or just for the thrill of it. Another note feeder Anoles are not readily available up here in Canada as they are down in the States where they are native to. To feed Anoles up here would be quite a bit more costly as they are available but not too cheap. By feeding the culled animals they become a meal for another herp rather than just compost, Mark
P.S. a straight mice diet for a Pacman is too high in fat, it needs to be mixed up in variety

TheRedDragon · 09-12-04, 02:22 PM

Very interesting photos Mary, thank-you for sharing. If I was in your position, I would have done the exact same thing.