Cross breeding

[jparker1167]

I was at a herp show today and one of the vendors said that he heard that someone breed or was trying to breed jcp and gtp and was calling them jungle tree pythons. has anyone heard about this and what does everyone thing about it.

[Brian Petersen]

Hi. Yes it has been done.
Look at this page. http://www.chondroweb.com/DrFrankenstein/hybrids.htm


Regards

Brian

[mykee]

It's not a cool thing to try to beat mother nature to new snakes. If it hasn't happened in nature, it shouldn't happen in someones basement.

[672]

I don't think I agree with it, but it is a cool looking snake for sure.

[jparker1167]

thanks for the replys, that is a cool looking snake

[CHRISANDBOIDS14]

Those are somewhat neat looking, but I must say, I think the hybrid stuff it getting horrible and ridiculous!

C.

The emeralds by Amazons has already been done. Here is the link to some pictures:

http://www.corallus.com/urbanjungles/hybrids.html

[nicola_boulton]

wow, thats amazing. I Never even thought about cross breeding.let alone it actually happening!
im not sure if i agree with it either though

[NewLineReptile]

Originally posted by mykee
It's not a cool thing to try to beat mother nature to new snakes. If it hasn't happened in nature, it shouldn't happen in someones basement.

How do you know that it has not happened in Nature??????

Brandon

[djc3674]

wow...those are some cool lookin critters. I wouldn't mind having one. I don't think cross breeding is as big of a deal as some people make it. As long as the overall health of the animal is not compromised and it is being sold for what it actually is, then so what. Humans have been cross breeding for centuries...lol

[M_surinamensis]

If you pay attention, you'll note that there are no photos of adult "Carpondos" on that site, just juveniles... This is because the adults look like arboreal vomit.

Hybridization can do unpleasant and irreversable things to captive gene pools... "Creamcicle" corns were originally produced by crossing emoryi with corns. This was not widely advertised however and they were treated as simply another color variety of pure cornsnake... People bred them to pure corns, sold the offspring as pure corns and since the color traits are recessive, the link to the creamcicle animals is easily obscured and lost. These days I'd wager that unless you know for a fact where a breeder got their stock, a good portion of captive animals aren't pure corns no matter what pattern or morph they may be. Only a matter of time before someone does the same thing with "Jungle Corns" (corn X cal king) and the captive gene pool is tainted even further. Heck, there was an uproar from the milksnake community when it was discovered that albino pueblans were first produced in captivity by introducing the albino gene from Nelson's milks.

To some people, I suppose those hybrids are "cool" because they look different... To the rest of us, who appreciate our animals specifically for the way in which the species adapted to their environments, the wild color patterns and behaviors (including intrinsic isolating mechanisms which prevent wild hybridization), these things are simply a risk. I want a piece of nature, I want to appreciate how evolution and environmental pressures sculpted an animal to be as successful within an evolutionary niche as they are... I don't want some piece of crap basement lab creation where the females had to be artificially inseminated because the hemipenal structures wouldn't even allow for copulation.

[crocdoc]

Although I can understand other people being fascinated with morphs and hybrids, personally I'm a big one for purebred reptiles, even to the point where I would try my best to match parents from the same locale within the same species or subspecies. I find most hybrids fascinating to look at, but have no desire to own or produce one.

However, for those that are already into their morphs (supertigersnowcreamsicle or whatever), I can't see what difference it would make if the morph is a hybrid or not. It's already a freak.

[varanus69]

Originally posted by M_surinamensis
... People bred them to pure corns, sold the offspring as pure corns and since the color traits are recessive, the link to the creamcicle animals is easily obscured and lost.

You said it best yourself "easily obscured and lost "i bet you have some sort of albino corn or king and maybe even a het for something ball python right?
What about albino spider balls are they garbage? while i am not saying it is the best idea i don't see anything OVERLY wrong with it if they do it on there own.....If you need to artificially inseminate them then they should not be crossed..if we all kept our animals looking normal than great breeders such as corey woods (bp morphs) and jeff favelle (high end jungles) would be no more recognized in the industry than Aaron Robson.And if any one asks why i used jeff as a reference it is because while his animals are pure and beautiful i would challenge anyone to find a jcp in the wild that even comes close to the high yellows and and pure color of his awesome animals. As a final statement i like them but doubt i would breed them myself.

[M_surinamensis]

i bet you have some sort of albino corn or king and maybe even a het for something ball python right?

Not a one actually. However I DO have GTPs and Carpets and I really don't want to have to require lineage papers and importation documents in order to obtain an animal which I know is pure.

There is a difference between hybrids and color/pattern morphs, or even selectively bred animals. While none of these are common in the wild and any captive breeding automatically goes against the idea of natural selection there is a difference between circumventing any given animal's inclinations within a species and removing the species concerns entirely. It's a matter of degree and a significant one.

You don't have to agree of course... but you're not likely to change my mind on this.

[BoidKeeper]

Very well put mykee!
Cheers,
Trevor

[jparker1167]

they are cool looking snakes. but i wouldnt want one either i rather have a pure atb or etb not a mix of the two